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Thread: .287 / .333 / .620

  1. #1
    getting younger alloverjr's Avatar
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    .287 / .333 / .620

    I know I'm beating a dead horse, but can the organization not do better than this? We've seen a half year of this line, in the one or two spot in the order for a large chunk of the year, and it drives me absolutely batty. He brings experience but little else as far as I can see. Limited range, though he seems to make the plays he gets to. I know Lee is on most people's wish list and #1 priority and a TOR guy, a real hammer, would be great. But I would love to see this club upgrade this position. His glove doesn't even warrant an 8 hole placement IMO. Allegedly Drew is not on the table although it's certainly worth a tire kick. Anyone else out there? Or is RZ content with the one player who makes me vomit each time he steps to the plate?

    I still don't feel better.
    This place use to be fun

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  3. #2
    We Need Our Myths reds1869's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    I would be OK with Cabrera if he were in the eight hole and his glovework improved slightly. As a top of the order guy he isn't cutting it and Janish certainly outfields him.

  4. #3
    Member mdccclxix's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    I'm one who likes his at bats, for some reason, but I totally agree we need to be at least getting Janish some cuts 1-2 times a week.
    2015 Rotation: Cueto, Latos, Bailey, Leake, Cingrani

  5. #4
    Member mdccclxix's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    Post-injury has been really bad. It's time to recognize that.
    2015 Rotation: Cueto, Latos, Bailey, Leake, Cingrani

  6. #5
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    A) http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=82779

    B) Why can we not mention the word Cabrera?
    Last edited by kaldaniels; 07-09-2010 at 01:47 AM.

  7. #6
    I'm gettin paper Homer Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    Yeah. We need Janish in the lineup. Because we know Dusty won't bat him 2nd.

  8. #7
    Member OnBaseMachine's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    Cabrera is getting closer to Patterson/Taveras territory. Shortstop (and LF) is a big problem right now. If Cabrera is going to continue to play everyday then he should at least bat 8th where he won't hurt the offense as much.
    I miss Adam Dunn.

  9. #8
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    It's out of control now. He should be dropped to 8th or hitting the bench. The 1st pitch swinging is just out of control.

  10. #9
    Member Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    Quote Originally Posted by Homer Bailey View Post
    Yeah. We need Janish in the lineup. Because we know Dusty won't bat him 2nd.
    Janish has hit 8th 11 times and 2nd 3 times this year.

  11. #10
    Member Ron Madden's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    Quote Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine View Post
    Cabrera is getting closer to Patterson/Taveras territory. Shortstop (and LF) is a big problem right now. If Cabrera is going to continue to play everyday then he should at least bat 8th where he won't hurt the offense as much.
    I totally agree with this statement.

  12. #11
    Resident PED Expert nemesis's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    As much as Cabrera is hurting the top of the order, I am suprised that Rolen's slump hasn't been really discussed...

    .290/.321/.611 in July and this goes back a bit into June.

    That's worse than Cabrera .303/.323/.626 - Miller .250/.458/.708 - Gomes .310/.407/.717 - Stubbs .313/.567/.880

    Only Bruce .258/.286/.544 is worse.

    Is he starting to wear down? Votto cannot be the only RBI man on the team. He needs Rolen and either Bruce or Gomes to help out.
    If you can't be a good example... then you'll just have to be a horrible warning...

    Nothing tastes as good as being fit feels...

  13. #12
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    Quote Originally Posted by Razor Shines View Post
    Janish has hit 8th 11 times and 2nd 3 times this year.
    And in the #8 spot he has had 22 ABs and put up these numbers....

    .136 BA .321 OB% .182 SLG% .503 OPS

    He's had 17 ABs in the #2 hole with this line......294 .400 .588 .988

    Personally, the above numbers mean very little to me because of the small sample size. But which one is closer to his career norms which is....

    .215 .303 .313 .616 and worse then the title of this thread.

    Many got all excited when Janish entered the game last Sunday, after Votto got ejected, and went 4 fer 4 with a HR and 3 RBIs. Many keep claiming that Janish, because he's in his peak year at age 27, is coming into his own. Yet Janish entered that game with three HRs and 28 RBIs in 382 career ABs.

    Yes Janish is a stellar defensive player. And if they benched OCab tomorrow I probably wouldn't put up too much resistance. But the problem is that Janish has not proven his bat at a consistent level. You take a look at his numbers while at AA/AAA and they are not stellar.

    Yet now, all of a sudden, based on very small sample sizes, and also due to the extreme dislike for Cabrera (and good points are made there), we want to ignore the above and give Janish more playing time? Now if your argument is for a defensive upgrade, then you get no argument. But offensively I think you'll get your heart broke even more.

    I don't think there isn't a person on this forum that wouldn't like a better solution at the #2 hole then Cabrera. We've tried numerous other "experiments" and they haven't worked too well.

    Cabrera was inserted at leadoff in the first week of May, and for a short time provided some spark. Yes, people said he'd end up regressing to his career norms, and most wouldn't argue with that, and that is pretty much exactly what happened.

    But they'll utilize Cabrera's career numbers against him, but not Janish's. Somehow Janish's career numbers are ignored or not to be taken seriously. Why is that?

    I do like the suggestion made awhile back of trying Bruce there, but other then that, we're really running out of options.
    Last edited by GAC; 07-09-2010 at 08:41 AM.
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

  14. #13
    Member Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    I don't think his numbers in the 8 spot vs. the 2 spot matter too much. I don't honestly think that he'll hit much better if any than Cabrera, but he is a much better defender than OCab. So if they're gonna be equally sucky at the plate, why not play Janish with his superior glove?

  15. #14
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    Quote Originally Posted by Razor Shines View Post
    I don't think his numbers in the 8 spot vs. the 2 spot matter too much. I don't honestly think that he'll hit much better if any than Cabrera, but he is a much better defender than OCab. So if they're gonna be equally sucky at the plate, why not play Janish with his superior glove?
    Good argument; but what if Janish's offense was even worse? Would his better defense offset the lack in offense, or hurt us even more? That I don't know.

    And while his defensive skills have deteriorated, due to age, I don't think OCab is as terrible as some try to contend. But I say that strictly from observation, and not from pouring over defensive matrix' - which I'm sure someone will soon post in response.
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

  16. #15
    Danger is my business! oneupper's Avatar
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    Re: .287 / .333 / .620

    Quote Originally Posted by nemesis View Post
    As much as Cabrera is hurting the top of the order, I am suprised that Rolen's slump hasn't been really discussed...

    .290/.321/.611 in July and this goes back a bit into June.

    That's worse than Cabrera .303/.323/.626 - Miller .250/.458/.708 - Gomes .310/.407/.717 - Stubbs .313/.567/.880

    Only Bruce .258/.286/.544 is worse.

    Is he starting to wear down? Votto cannot be the only RBI man on the team. He needs Rolen and either Bruce or Gomes to help out.
    Rolen feasted on breaking balls early in the season. He waited for them, got them and crushed them.
    Now he's getting a steady diet of heat, heat and more heat. His bat isn't as quick anymore and he can't keep up.
    He'll adjust, but I don't think we can expect anything like his first half in the second half.
    "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it."

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