Turn Off Ads?
Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 31 to 45 of 45

Thread: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

  1. #31
    Reds fan for life!!!! WVPacman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    West Virginia
    Posts
    1,955

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    What exactly was the feud about and how did it start?You don't have to give me the long verson of the story.The short story will be just fine.
    I can spell,I just can't type!!

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #32
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    4,749

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    Quote Originally Posted by WVPacman View Post
    What exactly was the feud about and how did it start?You don't have to give me the long verson of the story.The short story will be just fine.
    I think part of it was a failed car dealership they had together but more so they both were both huge egomaniacs who couldn't stand it if the other got more pub or love from the fans or press corp.
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

  4. #33
    Member top6's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    cincinnati
    Posts
    1,655

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    Quote Originally Posted by Yachtzee View Post
    That's because Barry Larkin is awesome.
    He also made almost $80 million in his career, and will never have to worry about making a living post-baseball (unlike Johnny Bench, who made about $3 million his WHOLE CAREER - and likely depends on endorsements and autograph signings to make a living, or at least live comfortably).

    Also, yes, Ramon Hernandez is making more this year than Johnny Bench made in his whole career. Of course that's in actual $. But even if you factor in for inflation, the $11 million Ramon made the last two years is still probably more than Bench ever made. Crazy.

  5. #34
    Member redsfandan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    3,583

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    Quote Originally Posted by top6 View Post
    He also made almost $80 million in his career, and will never have to worry about making a living post-baseball (unlike Johnny Bench, who made about $3 million his WHOLE CAREER - and likely depends on endorsements and autograph signings to make a living, or at least live comfortably).

    Also, yes, Ramon Hernandez is making more this year than Johnny Bench made in his whole career. Of course that's in actual $. But even if you factor in for inflation, the $11 million Ramon made the last two years is still probably more than Bench ever made. Crazy.
    According to baseball-reference.com Bench made $2 million over his last 5 playing years ('78-'82) and then retired at the age of 35. He did continue to work but his baseball retirement coincided with arguably the biggest run up in stock market history. He wouldn't have needed to keep that much of that money in the market to have ended up a multi-millionaire.

    Yeah, there have been a lot of players since then that weren't as good as him and yet they made more money. But, while it's one thing to say that endorsements/signings supplement his income, I think it might be a stretch to say that he depends on that source of income to make a living or live comfortably. Unless, of course, he was really bad with his money.
    Last edited by redsfandan; 07-27-2010 at 06:55 AM.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

  6. #35
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    34,437

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    Quote Originally Posted by George Anderson View Post
    I think part of it was a failed car dealership they had together but more so they both were both huge egomaniacs who couldn't stand it if the other got more pub or love from the fans or press corp.

    I think you nailed it. I'm partial to Bench and had a very good experience with him, unlike others. I also don't think Rose is credible at all. I would look outside if he told me the sky was blue. However, both of them were/are egomaniacs and I'm sure each feels they should have received the lion's share of the credit for the BRM. Looking back on it and looking at the dynamics of teams these days with multiple superstars playing on one team, it's a wonder and a testament to Sparky Anderson that the team got along as well as it did.
    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rally-...24872650873160

  7. #36
    Member top6's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    cincinnati
    Posts
    1,655

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    According to baseball-reference.com Bench made $2 million over his last 5 playing years ('78-'82) and then retired at the age of 35. He did continue to work but his baseball retirement coincided with arguably the biggest run up in stock market history. He wouldn't have needed to keep that much of that money in the market to have ended up a multi-millionaire.

    Yeah, there have been a lot of players since then that weren't as good as him and yet they made more money. But, while it's one thing to say that endorsements/signings supplement his income, I think it might be a stretch to say that he depends on that source of income to make a living or live comfortably. Unless, of course, he was really bad with his money.
    I don't think - especially after taxes - that most people could just stop working at age 35 having made $2 million over 5 years. But even if most people could, I'm confident that someone living a lifestyle similar to most professional athletes could not.

  8. #37
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Richmond, Indiana
    Posts
    1,707

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    This might be total BS but here's what i always thought:

    pete feels johnny has faults, just as pete has faults --the only difference is johnny is better at hiding his faults.

    so pete says to johnny "why do you get to be the hero? you have faults the same as i". and johnny replies "no, my faults are fundamentally different and somehow character building while yours are an affront to baseball men everywhere".

    pete knows that johnny has some faults- he also knows these faults would hurt johnny's image of the golden boy. so he holds it over johnny. johnny responds by saying "no one will believe you". at this point, they have enough on each other that they have an informal agreement based on mutually assurred destruction. it's sick and it requires a lot of energy to remind the other that they have this informal agreement.

    they get older and both realize that they are human and there's no value in destroying each other. they decide that MAD isn't worth it. they start to put in perspective what they accomplished together. there's no more books to write. there's nothing new to add to the story. as old men do everwhere when they take stock of their lives they decide to make it a happy ending.

  9. #38
    My clutch is broken RichRed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Asheville, NC or thereabouts
    Posts
    3,872

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    Quote Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
    This might be total BS but here's what i always thought:

    pete feels johnny has faults, just as pete has faults --the only difference is johnny is better at hiding his faults.

    so pete says to johnny "why do you get to be the hero? you have faults the same as i". and johnny replies "no, my faults are fundamentally different and somehow character building while yours are an affront to baseball men everywhere".

    pete knows that johnny has some faults- he also knows these faults would hurt johnny's image of the golden boy. so he holds it over johnny. johnny responds by saying "no one will believe you". at this point, they have enough on each other that they have an informal agreement based on mutually assurred destruction. it's sick and it requires a lot of energy to remind the other that they have this informal agreement.

    they get older and both realize that they are human and there's no value in destroying each other. they decide that MAD isn't worth it. they start to put in perspective what they accomplished together. there's no more books to write. there's nothing new to add to the story. as old men do everwhere when they take stock of their lives they decide to make it a happy ending.
    Astute analysis, I'd say.

    As an aside, did anyone see Bench's impersonation of Harry Caray at the HOF Induction ceremony? It was bizarre and uncomfortable.
    "I can make all the stadiums rock."
    -Air Supply

  10. #39
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    4,749

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    Quote Originally Posted by RichRed View Post
    Astute analysis, I'd say.

    As an aside, did anyone see Bench's impersonation of Harry Caray at the HOF Induction ceremony? It was bizarre and uncomfortable.
    Oh I agree.

    Bench was my boyhood idol but I find him to be a very strange man.
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

  11. #40
    Member cumberlandreds's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Sterling VA
    Posts
    9,306

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    One thing I always heard was that Bench was jealous of Rose because of the local love he received from Cincinnati. Pete was always jealous of Bench because of the National love Bench received. I would say that's is part of it. When Tony Perez was on the team it was always said he knew how to keep Bench's,Rose's and Joe Morgan's ego's in check. When he left the egos went off the charts and played as much as anything for the BRM downfall after 1976.
    Reds Fan Since 1971

  12. #41
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Richmond, Indiana
    Posts
    1,707

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    The 77 team got old quick and the front office didn't see it coming. The team depended on a 36 yo 3rd baseman and a 33 yo 2nd baseman to continue playing at a incredibly high level and that was just not possible. When you are those ages your going to have difficulty staying at the top of your game.

    Rose and Morgan went from 16 WAR in 76 to 9 WAR in 77 (quick math) -that's about 60% -70% of the ground lost from 76 to 77. Those 2 guys were great, but at those ages they were due for some slippage. The FO really didn't prepare for that. By 78, Morgan though still a great player was getting booed when he left runners on base and Rose was looking at a town that appreciated a soon to be 38 yo 1st baseman. I think he probalby knew he couldn't play 3rd forever and he dang well figured out he couldn't play 1st for the Reds. His options were fading and to continue he had to get out of town.

    Dan Driessen playing of 1st base insured 3 of the BRM would leave town or retire too soon and when you think about it -that's amazing: a 38 yo Rose is beginning to have some issues playing 3rd. He wants to make a run at Cobb, but he has to be able to play 1st base somewhere down the line and the team says "nuts". Of course everyone knows about Perez. And then an older Johnny Bench wants to play first base and the team again says "nuts". And soon Johnny decides he will retire after losing a long strange battle with 3rd base. Bench probably could have played 1st base and continued his career and played till 85 or 86. Players tend to hit better when they don't have to battle injuries, but Bench really never got that chance to relax at 1st base and just hit.

    In 1976, if you would have told Bench, Perez, and Rose that they'd be moving on to new pastures because of Dan Driessen they'd have shot you a look like you were crazy.

  13. #42
    First Time Caller SunDeck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    5,394

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    I saw Pete with Paul Hornung at a sports stag in January. Of course, it was in front of a very supportive West Side audience, which included many long time buddies, but he was not apologetic in the least. In fact, given that he and Hornung often appear together, and given the topics they have in common, it would seem that he's not connecting the dots on how these appearances are viewed by MLB at all. But man, the guy can sure tell a dirty joke.
    Next Reds manager, second shooter. --Confirmed on Redszone.

  14. #43
    Maple SERP savafan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Posts
    17,568

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    I've met Bench on two occasions. The first was before he was inducted into the HOF, and he was as pleasant and personable as can be, and the second time was at Redsfest in 1999, my ex-brother-in-law and I were getting a photo with Bench and the 1975 and 1976 Series trophies. We were told to not speak to Mr. Bench, and he refused to look either of us in the eye or open his mouth to utter as much as a word. It was very odd.

    As for Rose, if the headline in the morning's paper read "Pete Rose wakes up and gets out of bed," there would be about 20 comments here on Redszone about how he's a self serving SOB, and how he only got out of bed for his own selfish gain.
    My dad got to enjoy 3 Reds World Championships by the time he was my age. So far, I've only gotten to enjoy one. Step it up Redlegs!

  15. #44
    Member redsfandan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    3,583

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    Quote Originally Posted by top6 View Post
    I don't think - especially after taxes - that most people could just stop working at age 35 having made $2 million over 5 years. But even if most people could, I'm confident that someone living a lifestyle similar to most professional athletes could not.
    I don't think most people could stop working at 35 either even with that kind of windfall. But, I don't think I said that he could stop working at 35. I was only disputing these words that you said:

    "(he) likely depends on endorsements and autograph signings to make a living, or at least live comfortably)".

    Now, you can say that he needs that source of income to help him live comfortably if you want (I'm skeptical) but to make a living? I doubt that even more.

    Bench was lucky in that he was able to take advantadge of playing most of his career when the rules for player compensation were starting to change. Bench's major league career started in '67, arbitration started in '70, free agency a few years later. And even back then it was already making a big difference. Yogi Berra retired in '65 and is still considered one of the best catchers of all time. Now, you'd expect Bench to have made a little more in his career simply due to inflation. But, Bench made $400K in each of his last 5 years while Berra made roughly a half million in his entire career.

    Yeah, todays players make more, ALOT more. But, I think Bench did ok. And, no, I don't see a reason to feel sorry for him either. Bench was able to capitalize on the changes in player compensation. The players that came before him, like those in the 20's - 60's who were most responsible for the rise in popularity of baseball, weren't able to do the same. If I were Bench I'd consider myself lucky.
    Last edited by redsfandan; 07-27-2010 at 11:14 PM.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

  16. #45
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    Out Wayne
    Posts
    22,834

    Re: Pete Rose Apologizes To Johnny Bench

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    I think you nailed it. I'm partial to Bench and had a very good experience with him, unlike others. I also don't think Rose is credible at all. I would look outside if he told me the sky was blue. However, both of them were/are egomaniacs and I'm sure each feels they should have received the lion's share of the credit for the BRM. Looking back on it and looking at the dynamics of teams these days with multiple superstars playing on one team, it's a wonder and a testament to Sparky Anderson that the team got along as well as it did.
    Joe Posnanski stated in "The Machine" that Bench often would refuse to talk to any sportswriter after a game who had first interviewed Rose. Joe Morgan wrote in his autobiography that when he first came to the Reds he was told by teammates that he couldn't be a friend to both Rose and Bench (of course Ken Griffey Sr. would later say that Morgan and Bench were both jerks, although Griff was a bit more blunt).
    Yes, Rose and Bench are/were egomaniacs and it is to the credit of both Sparky and Tony Perez that the BRM still stayed together.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25