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Thread: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

  1. #646
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    Good post, Scrap.

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  3. #647
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Respectfully, your argument is entirely semantics, Brutus. It doesn't matter who pays the cash. The fact of the matter is that all were paid largely for their talent. Period. That makes each of them professional. The distinction you're trying to make is flawed at its very core.
    Sure it matters. The very core of the ruling is that he was considered a professional. Professionals earn money for a living. Say some young hair stylist gets paid $20 by a friend to do hair. That isn't really considered being a professional, it's just receiving money for something they're good at. But if they get paid by a hair stylist to do peoples' hair, it becomes a profession.

    It's not semantics. The very definition of the word applies to Kanter. It doesn't apply to the other cases.



    Again, if you want to play any basketball in Turkey, that's the system he had to deal with. There are no high school teams to play with, no AAU clubs. The only basketball is run by professional clubs, who then have a stranglehold on those players.

    It's patently unfair to expect those kids in other countries to do things as American kids when they have no opportunity to do so.

    Too, he wasn't paid to be a professional. His father was given money for educational expenses. He and his family refused moneys that they thought would have made him a professional. That's a pretty big distinction both you and the NCAA haven't seen yet.
    Not true. There are club teams that are not considered professional clubs all around the region. There were plenty of opportunities. And if playing was important to he and the family, they could have uprooted to America to play.



    So it's okay to get money from boosters, agents, and assorted hangers-on, but not from a professional team? Again, that's some pretty tortuous logic, IMO.

    Finally, I think it's important not just to focus on the hard and fast rule. (The NCAA hasn't done that all year-- why start now?) The intent is key here.

    To use an analogy, I've got a kid in class who plagiarized on his last paper. He didn't really understand the concept of cheating, but, once it was explained, he apologized profusely and offered to not only take the punishment (a zero), but also re-do the paper.

    The rule is pretty straightforward.

    But the intent wasn't to deceive me or lengthen his work. He just didn't quite grasp the concept of how to (or the need to) cite paraphrased material.

    What should I have done, Brutus?

    I know what the NCAA would have done. Well, no, I don't. I guess it depends on the university, the spotlight, and how much money can be earned, as to their decision.
    Show me where I said it was "OK" to get money from boosters. Don't start with the strawman.

    I said there's a difference between receiving benefits and being a professional. Those other examples were cases of receiving money or benefits, not being in a quasi-state of employ. They all broke rules, but being a professional is what constitutes being ineligible.

    The intent was to render services as a basketball player to a club that operates professionally in exchange for a stipend that went beyond travel expenses. That's all the intent that matters, even if the family had the 'right' intentions. It doesn't matter what the money was going to be used for.

    You keep trying to portray the NCAA as inconsistent. But they're not... not when it comes to professional clubs and this type of money. Anytime you get dollar amounts involved, especially of this magnitude, and especially involving professional clubs... even the NCAA is pretty consistent: you're a professional. To their credit, that's the one area they've never wavered.

    To your analogy... what should you have done? He broke a rule. There should be a punishment involved. But it's hard to compare the instance because this isn't about punishing someone as much as it is deciding whether someone is a 'professional.' Breaking a rule once can earn varying degrees of punishment. Becoming a professional never goes away.
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    Sigh.

    Once again, Brutus, you refuse to acknowledge the fact that the money was NOT for playing basketball, but for educational expenses. (As is supposedly allowed by NCAA guidelines, though only, apparently, for select colleges and players.) For example, Ohio State used a couple kids from foreign countries who also were technically "paid" money in order to obtain an education. Should they too have been ruled permanently ineligible?

    In other words, that professional dog just won't hunt.

    As to "simply moving to America" in order to not break NCAA guidelines of professionalism-- geez, ethnocentrist much? He was 14 when he started, for God's sake. Would you uproot for family, practice, and stake everything on whether a 14-year-old might eventually 1) be good enough to play at a high level college, and, 2) still be interested in playing basketball at all?

    I'm suprised you're arguing this, as you've always seemed a bit of a pragmatist when it comes to tOSU, the NCAA, and the prossionalism of amateur athletics. Wonder why?
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Sigh.

    Once again, Brutus, you refuse to acknowledge the fact that the money was NOT for playing basketball, but for educational expenses. (As is supposedly allowed by NCAA guidelines, though only, apparently, for select colleges and players.) For example, Ohio State used a couple kids from foreign countries who also were technically "paid" money in order to obtain an education. Should they too have been ruled permanently ineligible?

    In other words, that professional dog just won't hunt.

    As to "simply moving to America" in order to not break NCAA guidelines of professionalism-- geez, ethnocentrist much? He was 14 when he started, for God's sake. Would you uproot for family, practice, and stake everything on whether a 14-year-old might eventually 1) be good enough to play at a high level college, and, 2) still be interested in playing basketball at all?

    I'm suprised you're arguing this, as you've always seemed a bit of a pragmatist when it comes to tOSU, the NCAA, and the prossionalism of amateur athletics. Wonder why?
    I'm not "refusing to acknowledge" anything. Except that why was he given money for 'educational expenses' in the first place? Because of his skills as a basketball player to contribute to a professional basketball club! That's a professional. He was reimbursed to contribute to a pro basketball club. Forget that it was for educational motives. That's a professional.

    That's really all that matters and the core point that is conveniently being ignored by folks in Kentucky.

    I don't see what Ohio State has to do with this. You want to know something? Alexander Radojevic. Remember him? He was the OSU recruit that was declared ineligible by the NCAA in 2003. You want to know why he was ruled ineligible? Because he was paid by a professional club, despite appearing in six games. But he was ruled a professional. He didn't know the rules. He was 17. Should the NCAA let him be eligible? Should he have been allowed to play for Ohio State? He could have just gone to the NBA, but he wanted to play in America's college system.

    I'm really not sure what your points about OSU have to do with this anyhow. Seems you're trying to get some jabs in. Except, for what? I've not said anything about Ohio State other than to say the stuff OSU athletes did are things you can find at Kentucky, North Carolina, Oklahoma, etc. I certainly haven't really said much about it except being the 'pragmatist' you describe in the crucification of athletes. It's by that token I'm not blaming Kentucky or Kanter, but you can't have your cake and eat it too. He wanted to be an amateur but he was willing to accept expenses from a pro team when there are club teams in the region and they could have uprooted to America. You say that's not practical, yet it was practical enough for them to do research on what constitutes being an NCAA athlete and that was their motivation... to prepare for being a college basketball player. You say they took steps to make sure he would be eligible, yet you say they "didn't know the rules." If ignorance of overseas players is the litmus test, then every kid that was paid by a professional club should get to come to America to play if they want to, because by that standard, it's not fair to expect any of them to know the rules.

    But one thing that still rings true: they weren't paid by a professional club. And that's really the difference that matters.
    Last edited by Brutus; 01-08-2011 at 05:42 PM.
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    The OSU player absolutely should have been allowed to play, if his journey was similar to Kanter's. (I know nothing of him or his situation.)

    As to the "payment", the NCAA allows players, like Kanter, to get their educations paid for by professional teams.

    Febernahce pulled a fast one with elder Kanter, giving him the money instead of paying a tutor/ teacher directly. By the rule of the law, this immediately made Kanter ineligible.

    This is why Kanter is ineligible, Brutus.

    Meanwhile, kids from Kansas, Mississippi State, and OSU not only are found out doing things against the rules, but they lie about it after getting caught. Each of these players are punished (well, kind of-- some are still awaiting a punishment, assuming they come back to school), but allowed to stay in school.

    A player from Auburn is allowed to be eligible even though his father broke a major rule with the NCAA having found him good to go because they had no proof he knew the rule was being broken.

    If you can't see the dichotomy of the decisions...
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    The OSU player absolutely should have been allowed to play, if his journey was similar to Kanter's. (I know nothing of him or his situation.)

    As to the "payment", the NCAA allows players, like Kanter, to get their educations paid for by professional teams.

    Febernahce pulled a fast one with elder Kanter, giving him the money instead of paying a tutor/ teacher directly. By the rule of the law, this immediately made Kanter ineligible.

    This is why Kanter is ineligible, Brutus.

    Meanwhile, kids from Kansas, Mississippi State, and OSU not only are found out doing things against the rules, but they lie about it after getting caught. Each of these players are punished (well, kind of-- some are still awaiting a punishment, assuming they come back to school), but allowed to stay in school.

    A player from Auburn is allowed to be eligible even though his father broke a major rule with the NCAA having found him good to go because they had no proof he knew the rule was being broken.

    If you can't see the dichotomy of the decisions...
    I've already corrected this in the Cam Newton thread, but this is not the case.

    The NCAA's FAQ on benefits:

    It is important to note that educational expenses (e.g., high-school or preparatory school tuition payments) may be considered a prohibited form of pay based on athletics skill, depending on the source from which the educational funds are received. For example, under current NCAA legislation, a prospective student-athlete may not receive educational expenses from his or her outside sports team or organization when those funds are based in any degree on the recipient's athletics ability. In addition, a prospect may not receive educational expenses from any individual whose relationship with the prospect developed as a result of the prospect's athletics participation or reputation.
    The FAQ for allowed sources of benefits:

    The most common sources from which a prospect may receive educational expenses without jeopardizing his or her amateur status are described below:

    * Parents, legal guardians and other family members may provide educational expenses for a prospect.

    * High schools and preparatory schools may provide academic and athletically related scholarships to a prospect.

    * A prospect may receive educational expenses from an established and continuing scholarship program designed to aid students in secondary schools, even if athletics participation is part of the basis (but not the major criterion) for receiving the award, provided the prospect remains free to select his or her own school, the school controls the aid and the prospect has no continuing obligation to the donor.

    * An established friend or mentor who has a close and established relationship with a prospect that developed without regard to athletics participation or reputation and before the prospect achieved any notoriety as an athlete may provide educational expenses to the prospect if such expenses are similar in nature to other assistance provided by the individual to the prospect before the prospect achieved notoriety as an athlete.
    Professional clubs are not the guise under which educational expenses can be paid. It doesn't matter if the money went to Kanter or his father. Professional clubs cannot pay for educational expenses.

    Only high schools & prepatory schools can cover educational expenses for athletes. That's been the basis of almost every ruling the NCAA has had in this particular type of instance. That's always been true.

    You keep quoting the "he's allowed to received educational expenses" mantra, but it's not true. The NCAA's FAQ's, rule book, etc. make this clear. Every coach I've ever spoken with has told me the same. No expenses can be paid for by a professional club to any prospective athlete except for actual travel expenses incurred as part of participation. That's it.

    If he had gone to a school in Turkey that paid for his athletic scholarship, you would be correct. But professional clubs cannot pay for any other expenses whether he or his father receive the money.

    He's a professional by the clinical form of definition. What the other athletes did while they were already on campus is nowhere related to whether Kanter was considered a professional basketball player before arriving at Kentucky.

    Heck, even Steve Smith wouldn't take him because he thought Kanter was a professional. What does that tell you?

    Once again: educational expenses cannot be paid for by a professional team.

    From the NCAA Bylaws, Rule 12.02.4 Amateurism: Professional Athletics Team: Allowable "necessary" expenses:

    (1) Meals directly tied to competition and practice held in preparation for such competition;
    (2) Lodging directly tied to competition and practice held in preparation for such competition;
    (3) Apparel, equipment and supplies;
    (4) Coaching and instruction;
    (5) Health/medical insurance;
    (6) Transportation (expenses to and from practice competition, cost of transportation from home to training/
    practice site at the beginning of the season and from training/practice site to home at the end of
    season);
    (7) Medical treatment and physical therapy;
    (8) Facility usage; (Revised: 4/24/03)
    (9) Entry fees; and (Revised: 4/24/03)
    (10) Other reasonable expenses; or (Adopted: 4/24/03, Revised: 10/28/04)
    Now, another rule directly from the bylaws regarding this issue. Regarding educational expenses prior to arriving in college...

    From NCAA Bylaw 12.1.2.1.3.1 Prohibited Forms of Pay: Educational Expenses Prior To Collegiate Enrollment:

    12.1.2.1.3.1 Educational Expenses or Services—Prior to Collegiate Enrollment. A prospective student-athlete may receive educational expenses or services (e.g., tuition, fees, room and board, books, tutoring, standardized test preparatory classes) prior to collegiate enrollment from any individual or entity other than an agent, professional sports team/organization, member institution or a representative of an institution’s athletics interests, provided the payment for such expenses or services is disbursed directly to the individual, organization or educational institution (e.g., high school, preparatory school) providing the educational expense or service. (Adopted: 4/25/02 effective 8/1/02, Revised:1/14/08)
    So again, Kanter CANNOT receive money for educational expenses from a professional club. Even if it were not directly given to him.

    He, thereby, was considered a professional basketball player.
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    I obviously wasn't being clear enough, as I expected you to know the loopholes used by Division I schools.

    He's not getting paid. Not in a legal sense. Let me explain: professional teams in foreign countries provide "expense" money. This money may be used for anything from an apartment to food to clothing to... yep, you guessed it, an education. (This is a common loophole around the NCAA ruling and has been for 30 years.)

    It's one used by virtually any prospect from anywhere around the world (other than the US and Canada), including some pretty good foreign players of the past 20 years. The only difference is that the Kanters touched the money, rather than letting the professional team pay for it (as per guidelines for some expenses) and that they didn't spend all the cash given them. (The amount of money given was excessive; many think it was done purposefully, as a way to make Kanter ineligible before he ever stepped foot on a high school or college campus.)

    As an aside, using only common sense here: how different is this than simply a private school scholarship? I'm fairly certain amost any private school in the country does the same thing for somewhere around the same amount of money.
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    I obviously wasn't being clear enough, as I expected you to know the loopholes used by Division I schools.

    He's not getting paid. Not in a legal sense. Let me explain: professional teams in foreign countries provide "expense" money. This money may be used for anything from an apartment to food to clothing to... yep, you guessed it, an education. (This is a common loophole around the NCAA ruling and has been for 30 years.)

    It's one used by virtually any prospect from anywhere around the world (other than the US and Canada), including some pretty good foreign players of the past 20 years. The only difference is that the Kanters touched the money, rather than letting the professional team pay for it (as per guidelines for some expenses) and that they didn't spend all the cash given them. (The amount of money given was excessive; many think it was done purposefully, as a way to make Kanter ineligible before he ever stepped foot on a high school or college campus.)

    As an aside, using only common sense here: how different is this than simply a private school scholarship? I'm fairly certain amost any private school in the country does the same thing for somewhere around the same amount of money.
    Did you bother reading what I posted? It says specifically... educational expenses CANNOT be covered by professional teams. How is that a loophole? It's expressly forbidden by the NCAA and has been ruled as such in pretty much every case that's come before the NCAA in some form or another.

    Any players that had educational expenses covered were considered a professional by NCAA definition. That's right there in the rules plain as day. There's no loophole about it. Teams may try to launder the money to players in that form (under the guise of "expenses"), but if the NCAA finds out about it, there's no doubt what the ruling will be -- because it's not allowed.

    It seems you're arguing that because some teams have gotten away with it, thereby it's a loophole. I'm sure that it's happened before, but it's not a loophole. It's against the rules and stated in the bylaws as such.

    I think you're mistaking ways to hide something like educational expenses with "loophole." There's nothing legal about it. It's not a loophole because it's specifically addressed. If you want to again amend your statement to say teams have used other allowable expenses to launder educational expenses... then sure, I'm sure that's happened. But it's still against the rules no matter how you want to slice it.

    How is it different than an athletic scholarship? Well, pretty simple: professional teams have one purpose. Basketball. At least athletic scholarships, in theory, serve the purpose of also educating the students. Now I'm not so naive to think that's not abused in the states, nor is it even a major concern with a lot of coaches/athletes these days. But there is still at least, on paper, a big difference between the two.
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    So did anybody know Kentucky lost yesterday?
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    As for Kanter, here are some quotes by the UK brass. The bolded comments are for harshness toward the NCAA ruling.

    UK Athletics Director Mitch Barnhart

    “We are disappointed in the result and equally disappointed in the process. We have spent significant effort and resources to help this young man play college basketball in the United States. This has been on our radar screen daily for 10 months.

    “We were informed by the NCAA that the flexible decisions made by the NCAA staff in other high-profile cases could not be used in case precedent and were not binding on the NCAA going forward. The University of Kentucky was very hopeful that our student-athlete might receive the same type of consideration afforded to these other athletes but that did not happen. We were also reminded on a regular basis that the amateurism and professionalism piece, including benefits received from a professional team, is the one area of Bylaw 12 that has not been deregulated.”

    UK Men’s Basketball Coach John Calipari

    “We are obviously disappointed in this decision and find it unfortunate that a group of adults would come to such a decision regarding the future of an 18-year-old young man.

    “This has never been about our program or the University of Kentucky, it has been about the wishes of Enes and his family to have their son educated in the United States. It is a shame that Enes had to endure the constant speculation and misinformation that was furthered by certain media organizations in the smear campaign conducted by his Turkish team.

    “The silver lining is that Enes will always be part of this team. My job will be to prepare him for his entry into the NBA Draft, which this decision by the Association will likely necessitate. Enes will always be a part of our family and I plan to be by his side in the green room whenever he is drafted.”
    “I’m very disappointed in what appears to me to be an inconsistent decision that leaves an outstanding young man without any recourse. It’s very disappointing that this young man, who along with his family intended to do everything the right way and in compliance with the rules, won’t be able to pursue his dream of playing at UK and in intercollegiate athletics. As an NCAA board member, I continue to be puzzled and confused by the reasoning behind this decision, which seems to be an inconsistent and arbitrary application of the rules. It is unfortunate and disappointing that Enes and his family have been negatively impacted by this process. It is certainly a matter I will continue to try to understand and question in my remaining time on the board as part of an organization, whose stated purpose is to put families and student athletes first.”- Lee T. Todd, Jr
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus the Pimp View Post
    Did you bother reading what I posted? It says specifically... educational expenses CANNOT be covered by professional teams. How is that a loophole? It's expressly forbidden by the NCAA and has been ruled as such in pretty much every case that's come before the NCAA in some form or another.

    Any players that had educational expenses covered were considered a professional by NCAA definition. That's right there in the rules plain as day. There's no loophole about it. Teams may try to launder the money to players in that form (under the guise of "expenses"), but if the NCAA finds out about it, there's no doubt what the ruling will be -- because it's not allowed.

    It seems you're arguing that because some teams have gotten away with it, thereby it's a loophole. I'm sure that it's happened before, but it's not a loophole. It's against the rules and stated in the bylaws as such.

    I think you're mistaking ways to hide something like educational expenses with "loophole." There's nothing legal about it. It's not a loophole because it's specifically addressed. If you want to again amend your statement to say teams have used other allowable expenses to launder educational expenses... then sure, I'm sure that's happened. But it's still against the rules no matter how you want to slice it.

    How is it different than an athletic scholarship? Well, pretty simple: professional teams have one purpose. Basketball. At least athletic scholarships, in theory, serve the purpose of also educating the students. Now I'm not so naive to think that's not abused in the states, nor is it even a major concern with a lot of coaches/athletes these days. But there is still at least, on paper, a big difference between the two.
    Not some teams, Brutus. All teams.

    You're simply wrong on this, despite what you insist is in the rules. It's been seen as an expense for all high school level athletes for 30 years.
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRed View Post
    So did anybody know Kentucky lost yesterday?
    Lost to GA? That's surprising.

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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Not some teams, Brutus. All teams.

    You're simply wrong on this, despite what you insist is in the rules. It's been seen as an expense for all high school level athletes for 30 years.
    I'm honestly shocked anyone could say, with a straight face, they're "wrong" when the rules are posted plain as day specifically saying this is something that is not permissible in any form by the letter and spirit of the law. Even if you choose to not take my word for it, coming from many conversations about it with coaches & compliance folks, which is fine, that you're still choosing to believe otherwise even though it's right there staring you in the face in black & white is pretty incredible.

    I'm not wrong about it. Not "all" teams do it. The ones that do... it's still very much against the rules. Some teams (and yes, "some") do it as a form to try to avoid getting caught. It's like money laundering with benefits. But it's still against the rules. Period.
    Last edited by Brutus; 01-09-2011 at 02:50 PM.
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    It's not ignorance, Brutus. This is the way it's been with all European prospects (aside from England and some German guys) that have come to America to play basketball since Detlef Schrempf and Christian Welp.

    It's the way Olympiakos "high schooler" and former OSU 7-footer Zisis Sarikopoulos was able to get through school. It's the way any kid from Turkey, Serbia, Spain, et al, gets eligible for the NCAA.

    The dogmatic insistence that this is professionalism, Brutus, simply doesn't pass the smell test.

    1) Most Division I athletes must practice with/ learn from a professional squad in their region because high school sports (as they're known in America) just aren't there.
    2) Professional teams give money to amateur basketball players as "expenses" to pay for needed expenses.
    3) Division I prospects must have the equivalent of a high school diploma or GED in order to get into colleges and universities in America.
    4) Professional teams across the rest of the world practice at all hours and are not responsible for the education of their players (like a high school would be), so not only do they not require kids to go to school, they basically keep them from it.
    5) Many foreign players come straight from Europe, Latin and South America, and some from Asia and Australia to American universities and are immediately eligible for playing and for .

    I know it's confusing. (This is why the NCAA handbook is so incredibly hard to decipher. Rules oddly oppose each other.) You find a rule (or seven) to quote but the reality is obviously different. (Otherwise, no player from basketball factories like Olympiakos or Febernahce or wherever would ever be eligible.)

    I'm not ignorant on this issue, Brutus. The NCAA ruled against Enes Kanter citing the professionalism rule.

    They could have just as easily allowed him in (as they have in every other case where a player came to Division I hoops from a basketball factory).

    This runs contrary to decisions made this year across the NCAA landscape, where the focus wasn't on the rule, but on the individual student involved. (Newton, the OSU players, Selby, et al.)
    Last edited by Scrap Irony; 01-09-2011 at 04:17 PM.
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball - 6th edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    It's not ignorance, Brutus. This is the way it's been with all European prospects (aside from England and some German guys) that have come to America to play basketball since Detlef Schrempf and Christian Welp.

    It's the way Olympiakos "high schooler" and former OSU 7-footer Zisis Sarikopoulos was able to get through school. It's the way any kid from Turkey, Serbia, Spain, et al, gets eligible for the NCAA.

    The dogmatic insistence that this is professionalism, Brutus, simply doesn't pass the smell test.

    1) Most Division I athletes must practice with/ learn from a professional squad in their region because high school sports (as they're known in America) just aren't there.
    2) Professional teams give money to amateur basketball players as "expenses" to pay for needed expenses.
    3) Division I prospects must have the equivalent of a high school diploma or GED in order to get into colleges and universities in America.
    4) Professional teams across the rest of the world practice at all hours and are not responsible for the education of their players (like a high school would be), so not only do they not require kids to go to school, they basically keep them from it.
    5) Many foreign players come straight from Europe, Latin and South America, and some from Asia and Australia to American universities and are immediately eligible for playing and for .

    I know it's confusing. (This is why the NCAA handbook is so incredibly hard to decipher. Rules oddly oppose each other.) You find a rule (or seven) to quote but the reality is obviously different. (Otherwise, no player from basketball factories like Olympiakos or Febernahce or wherever would ever be eligible.)

    I'm not ignorant on this issue, Brutus. The NCAA ruled against Enes Kanter citing the professionalism rule.

    They could have just as easily allowed him in (as they have in every other case where a player came to Division I hoops from a basketball factory).

    This runs contrary to decisions made this year across the NCAA landscape, where the focus wasn't on the rule, but on the individual student involved. (Newton, the OSU players, Selby, et al.)
    It says plainly that professional teams cannot pay education expenses. Not even if the money is not paid directly. There's no debating that in plain language. It's right there. That's always been the rule and that's always been the interpretation.

    Any teams that do it otherwise are doing so as an attempt to hide the educational expenses being paid to the athlete so they will not lose eligibility with the NCAA. And when the NCAA finds out that is the case, that's why rulings like the one with Kanter happen.

    There's nothing vague, inconspicuous or inconsistent about this rule. It's not a confusing rule. It's not contradictory. That particular one is right there in the bylaws. Compliance officers are laughing right now at the comments coming out of Lexington because everyone knows the NCAA ruled, in this case, in the technical way. The way that the rulebook dictates. There's no disputing that, or at least there shouldn't be (but apparently citing the actual rules on the subject isn't enough to avoid creative ways to be entrenched in a position).

    If you want to argue whether or not it should constitute professionalism, it's a discussion I think can be made. But there shouldn't be any debating the fact that, at least according to the bylaws, this IS professionalism.

    As I said, you're right that teams do often do what you suggested... pay expenses through pro teams without the athlete touching the money. But it's just a laundering scheme to avoid getting caught. It's not permissible and it doesn't make the player avoid the dreaded "pro" label if he gets caught.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda


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