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Thread: Outfield question

  1. #46
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Outfield question

    Quote Originally Posted by cinreds21 View Post
    I'd be happy with getting a short stop or a pitcher or two for him. I would say just swap a prospect for him that is in the same situation as Yonder is in, but that is not the norm.
    The problem is, there isn't really a shortstop in the same position as him and the shortstop crop really sucks these days in the minors. You aren't going to get someone that equals Zack Cozart. As for the pitchers, it seems you then just acquire another guy that is going to then be blocked.

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  3. #47
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    Re: Outfield question

    Of course, that's why I didn't have an example of a trade.

  4. #48
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    Re: Outfield question

    I think Votto can be at least average defensively in LF. It would benefit him in that his competition for an All Star berth in LF is much weaker than at first. Based on his current production Votto could be a regular All Star in Left.

  5. #49
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Outfield question

    I'm guessing, but since Votto to LF makes so much sense, I can only conclude that he has already been asked and declined the invitation. I've ruled it out as an option and base most of what I think on that assumption. IMO Yonder needs to be dealt for a similar player who plays the OF. I'm not a big believer in using career minor league stats for anything, but Matt Joyce has a carrer .850 OPS versus RHP and has always been considered a good defender. This year, as a major leaguer, he has a .255/.390/.516 line in 157 ABs against RHP while playing in the tougher AL East. He'd be a perfect platoon option with Heisey or maybe Frazier for the next several years and the Rays need a 1B option to be the heir to fee agent to be Carlos Pena.

    Joyce has always been a bit of an under the radar prospect but he has power, OB skills and defensive ability. Next year will be his age 26 season and a move to the NL Central and GABP could be the perfect setting for a break-out.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  6. #50
    Charlie Brown All-Star IslandRed's Avatar
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    Re: Outfield question

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I'm guessing, but since Votto to LF makes so much sense, I can only conclude that he has already been asked and declined the invitation. I've ruled it out as an option and base most of what I think on that assumption.
    Just curious... why do you think it's already been asked? I don't think it's a question you ask until you need an answer, and I haven't seen that need arise during this season. This offseason, different story.
    Not all who wander are lost

  7. #51
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    Re: Outfield question

    I've read from Fay or one of the other writers that they have asked or someone has shot it down somewhere.

    I think Votto has said something along the lines of how hes worked really hard at first and would prefer to stay there. Not an outright NO, but considering Vottos personality I would take that as a polite way to give a stern NO!. Votto isnt going to tick off the front office if he can avoid it given what we know about him.

  8. #52
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    Re: Outfield question

    I'm hoping that Joey will see that Yonder Alonso is the additional bat needed in the middle of the lineup and volunteer, next spring, for the move.

  9. #53
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    Re: Outfield question

    Joey is near gold glove quality at 1B - I say its up to him - otherwise Yonder should show he can play LF or be dealt for a real LFer. I don't know that he's shown enough to be moving Votto out of his position. I'd rather have three true OFers and not sacrifice any defense.

  10. #54
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    Re: Outfield question

    I agree Hokie, but I think the odds the Reds try to trade Yonder greatly outweighs the chance Votto even seriously gets asked to move. I'm willing to be surprised though.

    Another thought is if the Reds go to Votto and offer him a LTC it would probably smoth the issue over a lot lot easier. Hard to ask a player who is playing his butt off and making pennies compared to his value to move to a new position and risk losing money if he struggles or gets injured.

  11. #55
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    Re: Outfield question

    I've only seen probably 7 Yonder plate appearances this year, but I am already in love with his approach. He's just the type of player the Reds need to replace Gomes with in order to continue to improve and really create a great lineup for years.

    I absolutly yearn for a lineup with both Votto and Alonso in it next year, however it gets done. I don't think you'll get a hitter of his caliber who would fit in as perfectly as Alonso.

    I yearn for a lineup next year of:

    Phillips
    Bruce
    Votto
    Rolen
    Alonso
    Hanigan/Hernandez
    Stubbs
    Cozart

    And the thought of Devin coming up next year, or even Grandal in 2 years, really makes me excited for the offense.



    I think every few years you have an offseason that really shapes what your team is going to be for an extended period. And to me, this is that year. Last year with Rolen already in the fold and Alonso still a year away there wasn't going to be tons of movement.

    This year, one way or another, I think there will be some significant movement.

    Some questions (most of which will prob. be answered by opening day 11)

    1. What to do with Alonso (trade, left, move votto to left)
    2. What to do with the starting pitchers (sign arroyo, pickup option and trade arroyo, trade one of the young guys, move someone like Bailey to the pen to try and groom for Coco's replacement)
    3. What to do with Chapman (I seperate this as he's currently in the pen)
    4. What to do at Short (keep Cabrera, bring in Cozart, trade some of the pieces mentioned above for one)



    I think what happens this offseason is really going to shape this team for years. I'm interested to see what happen.
    Last edited by NeilHamburger; 09-19-2010 at 12:16 AM.

  12. #56
    Socratic Gadfly TheNext44's Avatar
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    Re: Outfield question

    I really don't see what the big deal is in moving Votto to left.

    First, he's not that great defensively that the team would be losing anything at that position.

    Second, it's firstbase, the easiest position on the field to play. No one wants to play first, they end up there because they can't play anywhere else. I can understand a player wanting to stay short or third or center, but who would want to stay at first?

    And Votto is such a professional that he could easily be a decent left fielder by spring if he worked on it this winter.
    "Imagination is more important than knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

  13. #57
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    Re: Outfield question

    I liked playing first when I was little, and I was the best CFer in my town.

  14. #58
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Outfield question

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNext44 View Post
    I really don't see what the big deal is in moving Votto to left.

    First, he's not that great defensively that the team would be losing anything at that position.

    Second, it's firstbase, the easiest position on the field to play. No one wants to play first, they end up there because they can't play anywhere else. I can understand a player wanting to stay short or third or center, but who would want to stay at first?

    And Votto is such a professional that he could easily be a decent left fielder by spring if he worked on it this winter.
    I'm guessing its about a guy

    1. not wanting to embarass himself
    2. Not giving up what he won and staked a claim to.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  15. #59
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    Re: Outfield question

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNext44 View Post
    I really don't see what the big deal is in moving Votto to left.

    First, he's not that great defensively that the team would be losing anything at that position.

    Second, it's firstbase, the easiest position on the field to play. No one wants to play first, they end up there because they can't play anywhere else. I can understand a player wanting to stay short or third or center, but who would want to stay at first?

    And Votto is such a professional that he could easily be a decent left fielder by spring if he worked on it this winter.
    then with your own statement about 1st base played by a guy that can't play any other position in the field then the arguement about why you shouldn't even consider moving Votto to Left Field is already made. he can't play anywhere but first. Saying that I'll take a .300 avg and 100 rbi's every year from him there. And if you look at his numbers he is destroying Puhols in stats with close to 40 less at bats.

  16. #60
    Socratic Gadfly TheNext44's Avatar
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    Re: Outfield question

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteRoseBelongs View Post
    then with your own statement about 1st base played by a guy that can't play any other position in the field then the arguement about why you shouldn't even consider moving Votto to Left Field is already made. he can't play anywhere but first. Saying that I'll take a .300 avg and 100 rbi's every year from him there. And if you look at his numbers he is destroying Puhols in stats with close to 40 less at bats.
    Obviously that was just a generalization. Like I said, Votto is a good enough athlete and professional, that if he worked on it this winter, he could be passable by spring.

    He makes a better first baseman, but considering the situation, the Reds defense would be better with Votto in left and Alonso at first, rather than the other way around.
    "Imagination is more important than knowledge." -- Albert Einstein


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