Turn Off Ads?

View Poll Results: What do we NEED to take the next step?

Voters
65. You may not vote on this poll
  • We Need an ACE and we don't have one.

    10 15.38%
  • We Need a (RH) Cleanup Hitter and we don't have one.

    29 44.62%
  • We Need to improve the top of the lineup and we don't have the parts in house.

    12 18.46%
  • We don't need anything but patience and what we have will be enough.

    3 4.62%
  • We need all the above.

    8 12.31%
  • Not sure what we need.

    3 4.62%
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 34

Thread: The Next Step (POLL)

  1. #1
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Springfield, Ohio
    Posts
    9,052

    The Next Step (POLL)

    It seems many here are divided on what we "need" to take the next step. Many of us think it's an ACE and some of those folks (not sure how many thus this poll) believe we don't have one or won't have one. So it begs the question be asked, what do we need to improve upon this past season?

    Personally I'm torn, I know we need better offensive performance as we didn't do as well against better teams/pitching. But I'd really "like" a guy with ACE stuff, command and control. Now we could gamble that one of these youngsters reaches his ceiling or at least gets in the neighborhood and use our excess to reel in at least a capable #4 hitter. People like having the luxury of 6 or 7 really good starters but there is only a 5 man rotation and all 7 should be starting in the big leagues or at least is scheduled to be. So something has to give right? And so it only makes sense to use that excess to get that need.

    So again what do we need? How do we get it and with whom?
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

    --Woody Hayes

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Lexington
    Posts
    6,006

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    We need an Ace, but not necessarily as the next step. A SS who can hit first or second would be great, but I think the meat of the order should be top priority - even if it's jest the left-handed side of a platoon. Get the bat over the winter and go hard after the arm at the deadline.

  4. #3
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    14,834

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Not sure how to answer this poll. IMO the Reds need a starter who isn't a question mark to go with Cueto and Arroyo and is better than anyone on the 2010 team. An Ace would be nice, but some certainty and success would be great even if he isn't the first name to come to mind when thinking about the Cy Young award. Leake, Bailey, Volquez, Chapman and Wood are all still questions. I like them all, but if my plan is to compete, I don't want three of my rotation spots filled with so much uncertainty from among those five.

    I also think the Reds need another middle of the order bat. An every day LF who could hit 4th would be great and most people want a RH bat, but IMO a guy like that is more than the Reds can afford and with a number of RH options already on board, I'd rather go for a lefty who mashes righties who could patoon with Gomes, Heisey, Wlad or eventually Frazier.

    I'm content to go with Cozart and Jansih at SS, but if the Reds could add a LH hitting alternative who could caddy Rolen provide some rest for Phillips and play some SS when the home grown guys are scuffling, it would be a huge addition.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  5. #4
    Socratic Gadfly TheNext44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    4,228

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    I voted for top of the lineup. Getting one, would keep Stubbs from the top of the lineup and allow him to develop into the middle order power hitter he should be.
    "Imagination is more important than knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

  6. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Lexington
    Posts
    6,006

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    Not sure how to answer this poll. IMO the Reds need a starter who isn't a question mark to go with Cueto and Arroyo and is better than anyone on the 2010 team. An Ace would be nice, but some certainty and success would be great even if he isn't the first name to come to mind when thinking about the Cy Young award. Leake, Bailey, Volquez, Chapman and Wood are all still questions. I like them all, but if my plan is to compete, I don't want three of my rotation spots filled with so much uncertainty from among those five.

    I also think the Reds need another middle of the order bat. An every day LF who could hit 4th would be great and most people want a RH bat, but IMO a guy like that is more than the Reds can afford and with a number of RH options already on board, I'd rather go for a lefty who mashes righties who could patoon with Gomes, Heisey, Wlad or eventually Frazier.

    I'm content to go with Cozart and Jansih at SS, but if the Reds could add a LH hitting alternative who could caddy Rolen provide some rest for Phillips and play some SS when the home grown guys are scuffling, it would be a huge addition.
    I consider Wood solid enough to pencil him into the fourth spot in the rotation and not worry and believe it or not, after watching his maturtation process over the last two or three years, I would put Homer in the same category. He may not be an ace, but he and Travis make as good a 4/5 backend of the rotation as you could ask for.

    I'd put Volquez in the same category, but his control issues still worry me and he's the arm I'd be most willing to put in a trade (wonder if Texas would take him back for Nelson Cruz?). I like Leake, but would like to see another year of him (Cincy or L'Ville) before making any kind of lasting opinion. He would be the second on my "if you had to deal him, would you?" list of starters.

    Chapman is the main enigma. I believe he could stay in the pen and become a Mariano-like closer - maintaining his velocity for years to come. Move him back to the rotaton and you may eventually have your ace, but losing velocity and possible Volquez-like control issue are what bother me. I think his slider and changeup would be in his favor as a starter though.

    The one thing I think is lacking is the number one. I think that it would be easier (and less costly) to acquire them in July than Nov-Feb. Webb being the possible exception.
    Last edited by corkedbat; 10-22-2010 at 10:53 PM.

  7. #6
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Springfield, Ohio
    Posts
    9,052

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    Not sure how to answer this poll. IMO the Reds need a starter who isn't a question mark to go with Cueto and Arroyo and is better than anyone on the 2010 team. An Ace would be nice, but some certainty and success would be great even if he isn't the first name to come to mind when thinking about the Cy Young award. Leake, Bailey, Volquez, Chapman and Wood are all still questions. I like them all, but if my plan is to compete, I don't want three of my rotation spots filled with so much uncertainty from among those five.

    I also think the Reds need another middle of the order bat. An every day LF who could hit 4th would be great and most people want a RH bat, but IMO a guy like that is more than the Reds can afford and with a number of RH options already on board, I'd rather go for a lefty who mashes righties who could patoon with Gomes, Heisey, Wlad or eventually Frazier.

    I'm content to go with Cozart and Jansih at SS, but if the Reds could add a LH hitting alternative who could caddy Rolen provide some rest for Phillips and play some SS when the home grown guys are scuffling, it would be a huge addition.
    I can see all of that with the exception of the rotation uncertainty. I, like corkedbat feel really confident in Wood in fact I'd feel comfortable with him in any spot in the rotation. I know i'm in the minority on Leake but I feel fine with him at the back end of the rotation next year and eventually the middle of it. Like corkedbat said Chapman is a bit of an enigma he's the one guy i'm on the fence about just because I don't know whether or not to buy what the F.O. is selling about putting him in the rotation.

    Homer and Edinson are the 2 that I don't know what to expect from and one of these 2 are the ones I would work on dealing. I like corkedbats idea of Nelson Cruz but I think Texas might have more interest in Homer and he's the one I'd most prefer to deal myself. That is an interesting possibility.
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

    --Woody Hayes

  8. #7
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    14,834

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Quote Originally Posted by Mario-Rijo View Post
    I can see all of that with the exception of the rotation uncertainty. I, like corkedbat feel really confident in Wood in fact I'd feel comfortable with him in any spot in the rotation. I know i'm in the minority on Leake but I feel fine with him at the back end of the rotation next year and eventually the middle of it. Like corkedbat said Chapman is a bit of an enigma he's the one guy i'm on the fence about just because I don't know whether or not to buy what the F.O. is selling about putting him in the rotation.

    Homer and Edinson are the 2 that I don't know what to expect from and one of these 2 are the ones I would work on dealing. I like corkedbats idea of Nelson Cruz but I think Texas might have more interest in Homer and he's the one I'd most prefer to deal myself. That is an interesting possibility.
    I think both Chapman and Leake need a full season at AAA. If the Reds don't develop them into Starters who can go innings before throwing them into the fire, I fear they'll become Joba-like disappointments. I like them both long term, but for 2011, I don't want them rushed into the Reds rotation.

    I like Wood, and he impressed, but I don't take it as a given that he'll be a dependable starter now that the league has had a chance to adjust. Volquez and Bailey are injury questions IMO. Ideally, the Reds deal Volquez for a more certain guy, fill the back with Wood and Bailey and let Leake and Chapman develop with one replacing Arroyo after the 2012 season and the other nosing out whoever reveals himself to be the weak link,
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  9. #8
    Member redsfandan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    3,583

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    I haven't read the other responses yet but I'm torn between these two options:
    • A (RH) Cleanup Hitter


    • Other: Wait until July and then get the best player available to fill the biggest need

    The Reds really don't HAVE any glaring weaknesses right now. But I can also understand people that want an ace (mostly because of how it would help in the playoffs), a top shortstop (even though Janish/Cozart could provide close to as much production at a fraction of the cost), or a top leftfielder (which is probably the easiest position to fill even if it's with a platoon).

    That's why, while I know that buying at the trade deadline may very well up the price of whoever we'd acquire, I'd prefer either Werth (or someone close/better value) for leftfield or to just wait 'til July.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

  10. #9
    The Franchise sivman17's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Akron, OH
    Posts
    736

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Not sure why so many people think we need an "ace." We have 8 legitimate pitchers for a 5 man rotation. We have great pitchers. What we need is a solid, everyday SS and/or LF.
    Votto for MVP

  11. #10
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Guelph, ON
    Posts
    16,027

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Quote Originally Posted by sivman17 View Post
    Not sure why so many people think we need an "ace." We have 8 legitimate pitchers for a 5 man rotation. We have great pitchers. What we need is a solid, everyday SS and/or LF.
    I would have voted for an everyday SS if the option were available. Short of that, this offense led the NL least year. I'm more worried about run prevention. You can only use 5 starters at a time. #s 6, 7 and 8 only hep you if another guy is hurt. I'd like to upgrade over one of the top 5 guys and have somebody who can give us an advantage in a short series.

    Of course, if you can find a plus defending LF who can also hit, that would do a good bit for our run prevention too.

    20 runs allowed (the difference between Gomes and a good LF) is the difference between a 4.50 and a 3.60 ERA over 200 IP.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  12. #11
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    16,297

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    20 runs allowed (the difference between Gomes and a good LF) is the difference between a 4.50 and a 3.60 ERA over 200 IP.
    Is this correct?

  13. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    West Side (No Diggity)
    Posts
    1,052

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Quote Originally Posted by corkedbat View Post
    Get the bat over the winter and go hard after the arm at the deadline.
    That's where I am.
    I have a love-hate relationship with Albert Pujols. Mostly hate.

  14. #13
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    16,297

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Quote Originally Posted by I(heart)Freel View Post
    That's where I am.
    Yep, me too.

  15. #14
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Guelph, ON
    Posts
    16,027

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    Is this correct?
    If you're referring to the math, yes. 20 runs over 200 IP is 0.90 ERA.

    If you're referring to the 20 run figure itself, yes, more or less. Is it the exact figure? Who knows. It could be less. And frankly it could be more if we're talking about a truly good defensive LF. But it's the best estimate we can get right now using a logical, reasonable, consistent methodology and the available underlying information.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  16. #15
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    16,297

    Re: The Next Step (POLL)

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    If you're referring to the math, yes. 20 runs over 200 IP is 0.90 ERA.

    If you're referring to the 20 run figure itself, yes, more or less. Is it the exact figure? Who knows. It could be less. And frankly it could be more if we're talking about a truly good defensive LF. But it's the best estimate we can get right now using a logical, reasonable, consistent methodology and the available underlying information.
    In 200 innings a "good" LFer would be worth 20 runs in comparison to Gomes? I find that very hard to believe. One every 10 innings?


Turn Off Ads?

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25