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Thread: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

  1. #1
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    I think this kid should be administering this test instead of taking it.

    Has Teen Unlocked the Secret to Better SAT Score?

    Even if he's wrong, bravo for thinking outside the box and performing a study on it.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

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    Joe Oliver love-child Blimpie's Avatar
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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Kudos to him for conducting the analysis.

    For those, like me, who have felt that the grading criteria for the SAT essay section is due for an overhaul--this article may go a long way towards prompting that action.
    "Booing on opening day is like telling grandma her house smells like old lady."--WOY

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    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    They should do away with the SAT/ACT.

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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    They should do away with the SAT/ACT.
    Like... replace it with something else or just get rid of college-entrance standardized testing altogether?
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

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    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by *BaseClogger* View Post
    Like... replace it with something else or just get rid of college-entrance standardized testing altogether?
    Get rid of college entrance standardized testing. There are many issues I have with them. It puts poor students at a disadvantage who can't afford to take the tests multiple times in order to get a better score, or pay for classes on how to improve their scores or buy multiple books to improve their test scores. Just really bothers me. Teenagers aren't always good test takers. They aren't all good under pressure, and some of them are under serious pressure to do well on these things.

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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Get rid of college entrance standardized testing. There are many issues I have with them. It puts poor students at a disadvantage who can't afford to take the tests multiple times in order to get a better score, or pay for classes on how to improve their scores or buy multiple books to improve their test scores. Just really bothers me. Teenagers aren't always good test takers. They aren't all good under pressure, and some of them are under serious pressure to do well on these things.
    Agreed. My brother is a very, very intelligent individual, but scored very low on the ACT, and it cost him a shot to go to OSU. They put way too much stock into these things.

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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by cincrazy View Post
    Agreed. My brother is a very, very intelligent individual, but scored very low on the ACT, and it cost him a shot to go to OSU. They put way too much stock into these things.
    yeh was the same with my cousin low score doesnt mean your no intelligent at all

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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Getting rid of the SAT/ACT would be great for the unemployment rate. Colleges around the countries would have to hire thousands of new admissions officers to dig through applications to figure out who to admit/deny (since comparing GPA/class rank for kids from different high schools and different parts of the country is essentially meaningless).

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    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boston Red View Post
    Getting rid of the SAT/ACT would be great for the unemployment rate. Colleges around the countries would have to hire thousands of new admissions officers to dig through applications to figure out who to admit/deny (since comparing GPA/class rank for kids from different high schools and different parts of the country is essentially meaningless).
    Yeah, I wish there was some balance to it. I understand the need for standardized tests. Like you said, trying to compare the relative strengths and weaknesses of school districts and curricula is a very difficult task.

    But it also seems that a single one-time 4 hr. test (or maybe taken 2-3 times) is equally weighed against a 4 year GPA. It seems a little unbalanced. And this also coming from a dad who's daughter had a good day on her ACT and is going to school tuition-free for it.

    One problem is the industry around SAT/ACT that has sprung up. When I took the SAT and ACT back in the day, there was no prep classes, online stuff, academic coaches, Sylvan learning centers, and all that specified and focused training and techniques that are very specifically done with the sole purpose of raising your scores. I just walked in cold and took the test. Get off my lawn.

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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boston Red View Post
    Getting rid of the SAT/ACT would be great for the unemployment rate. Colleges around the countries would have to hire thousands of new admissions officers to dig through applications to figure out who to admit/deny (since comparing GPA/class rank for kids from different high schools and different parts of the country is essentially meaningless).
    I think the SAT is a lot like Pitcher's wins in that it makes sense at the margins, but there are probably better correlating variables to success in college.

    A pitcher who wins 20 years probably had a good season, and someone who wins 300 games in a career is probably not a fluke. A pitcher who went 2-15 probably didn't pitch very well.

    Similarly, someone who takes the SAT and scores a 1600+the essay is probably going to do well. Someone who scores a 600 will probably struggle at college level courses because most college courses ask you to do a lot of the same things as the SAT.

    But what it's not good at is describing the difference in degrees of people coming to the school. Someone who scores a 1150 is not necessarily any more ready to do well in college than someone who scores a 950.
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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoosier Red View Post

    But what it's not good at is describing the difference in degrees of people coming to the school. Someone who scores a 1150 is not necessarily any more ready to do well in college than someone who scores a 950.
    I'm not sure if that is true or not. I have to believe (with no evidence to back this assertion up) that studies have been done that support a pretty strong correlation between SAT score and academic performance in college.

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    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Get rid of college entrance standardized testing. There are many issues I have with them. It puts poor students at a disadvantage who can't afford to take the tests multiple times in order to get a better score, or pay for classes on how to improve their scores or buy multiple books to improve their test scores. Just really bothers me. Teenagers aren't always good test takers. They aren't all good under pressure, and some of them are under serious pressure to do well on these things.
    There are certainly some good reasons you list here, but I think the tests are a necessary evil for other reasons that have been pointed out.

    There's just no way to really compare GPA across school systems, as so much depends on not only the relative strength of the student's curriculum, but the quality of the system they are in. And while tests are a good indicator of intelligence, there are other kids that are better on tests and not very good on doing the everyday work that is assigned in school.

    I think getting rid of the tests is a mistake, but I do agree undue weight is assigned to them. There needs to be a better mix, IMHO.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boston Red View Post
    I'm not sure if that is true or not. I have to believe (with no evidence to back this assertion up) that studies have been done that support a pretty strong correlation between SAT score and academic performance in college.
    Mike McConnel, if you choose to believe him, use to quote studies (or perhaps claim that he's read them, don't know if he quoted directly) that by and large, the SAT/ACT is the best barometer for how a student will do in college. Of course individuals are going to vary, no test can be that accurate, but the kids who scored an 1200 do better in college than the kids that score a 900. Similary, put a kid that scored a 900 in a college that typically only admits kids in the 1200 range, and they'll struggle by average.

    As someone pointed out, admissions would be a nightmare w/o some form of standardized test. Most administrators know the school system in their area, which have harder classes, higher grading scales, etc.. and which ones allow a student to skate thru a bit easier. But how do they compare the kid from 5 states away that is applying because that is where mom & dad went or a cousin goes to?

    I have no idea how much the prep classes cost, or the books, etc... I took the ACT 1x with no extra prep, got a score more than high enough to get into my college of choise (UD) and never looked back. I assume you can find many of the prep books available at your local library. I'll also assume that many school districts have prep classes for the SAT/ACT at very low cost, if not free. If a student, either poor or from wealthy parents actually cares about doing well, puts in the time for their regular school work, I think most will do well enough the first time around to get into a decent school. Eliminate the test, and most schools are going to charge you a lot more (if they even charge you at all) just to apply to their college. The ACT/SAT allows them to quickly weed out kids that statistically won't cut it at their university.

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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Get rid of college entrance standardized testing. There are many issues I have with them. It puts poor students at a disadvantage who can't afford to take the tests multiple times in order to get a better score, or pay for classes on how to improve their scores or buy multiple books to improve their test scores.
    I didn't do any of that prep stuff and didn't find it necessary or particularly helpful. As for being able to afford taking the test multiple times, get a job.

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    really bothers me. Teenagers aren't always good test takers. They aren't all good under pressure, and some of them are under serious pressure to do well on these things.
    If you aren't a good test taker then you are probably in for some struggles in college since most college grades are primarily based on examination. If you can't handle pressure, college might not be for you because there is a LOT of pressure...
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

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    Start the Reactor! *BaseClogger*'s Avatar
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    Re: Has a 14-year old unlocked an SAT secret?

    Quote Originally Posted by medford View Post
    Mike McConnel, if you choose to believe him, use to quote studies (or perhaps claim that he's read them, don't know if he quoted directly) that by and large, the SAT/ACT is the best barometer for how a student will do in college. Of course individuals are going to vary, no test can be that accurate, but the kids who scored an 1200 do better in college than the kids that score a 900. Similary, put a kid that scored a 900 in a college that typically only admits kids in the 1200 range, and they'll struggle by average.
    I have a lot of friends who were simply lazy or complacent in high school and did not have the GPA they were capable of. But they got high scores on the ACT and are now flourishing in college where they find the coursework more challenging and pertinent to their future.

    Quote Originally Posted by medford View Post
    Eliminate the test, and most schools are going to charge you a lot more (if they even charge you at all) just to apply to their college. The ACT/SAT allows them to quickly weed out kids that statistically won't cut it at their university.
    Excellent point. It typically costs about $50 to apply to a school when I was applying a few years ago, and IIRC the ACT test only cost about $80. That is NOT doing a favor to the poor kids...
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."


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