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Thread: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

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    Member mdccclxix's Avatar
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    Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slu...mpaign=br_reds

    ORLANDO – The Cincinnati Reds continue to receive calls about Yonder Alonso(notes), their 23-year-old first baseman and No. 1 pick whose path to the big leagues is blocked at least in part by MVP Joey Votto(notes).

    Several inquiring teams have come away from conversations with GM Walt Jocketty believing the Reds are hesitant to trade Alonso, however, because Votto could be difficult to sign to a long-term deal – both in terms of Votto’s expectations and the club’s ability to carry what would be such a large contract.

    Jocketty, according to the clubs, has suggested he may be forced to trade Votto before he reaches free agency. Votto is arbitration-eligible for the first time, so the Reds might not consider trading him for at least another two years.

    Alonso played 30 games in left field in the minors last season, though first base is viewed as his more natural position.
    The Votto / Alonso crunch is palpable at this point if this rumor holds weight.
    2015 Rotation: Cueto, Latos, Bailey, Leake, Cingrani

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    Battle Toad Historian thatcoolguy_22's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Could just be a play by WJ to up the asking price somewhat. If teams think Alonso is completely unneeded, then they will only want to pay pennies on the dollar. BCast seems pretty adamant about signing Votto.
    "Last week I helped my friend stay put. It's a lot easier'n helpin' 'em move. I just went over to his house and made sure that he did not start to load **** into a truck."

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    Member redsfandan's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Maybe, but Votto hasn't sounded as interested in a long term deal as Bruce. Maybe Walt is trying to up the price on Alonso. Maybe he's using Alonso as a hedge against what Votto may do. Maybe it's just part of the negotiations between Walt and Vottos agent. Maybe it's all of the above. Who knows.

    At least it's nice to hear that teams are showing interest in Alonso.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

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    OlafTheBlack Dan's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Votto has 3 years before he reaches free agency. That's a lifetime in terms of baseball contracts, etc. To hold onto Alonso now because of what might happen 3 years down the road is extremely foolish. I'm guessing, like others, that this is to drum up a market for Alonso more than anything.
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    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan View Post
    Votto has 3 years before he reaches free agency. That's a lifetime in terms of baseball contracts, etc. To hold onto Alonso now because of what might happen 3 years down the road is extremely foolish. I'm guessing, like others, that this is to drum up a market for Alonso more than anything.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

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    Mr.Redlegs is my homeboy Eric_the_Red's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan View Post
    Votto has 3 years before he reaches free agency. That's a lifetime in terms of baseball contracts, etc. To hold onto Alonso now because of what might happen 3 years down the road is extremely foolish. I'm guessing, like others, that this is to drum up a market for Alonso more than anything.
    I agree that 3 years is foolish, but 1 more season won't hurt anything. Let's give Alonso another year at AAA to continue to improve and show that he truly is legit. And give Votto another year to show what he can do in the majors. Votto won the MVP this year and, unless he wins another, I doubt his price can go much higher.

    The time to make a decision on Votto/Alonso is next off-season, IMO. If they both mash, then the team should be able to trade either one to improve another area of the team.

    I would hate to lose Votto, because I think he brings a work ethic and demeanor that is a good example to the rest of the team. But no matter how many tickets are sold, we will always be in a small to mid-size market, and you have to operate as such. If a trade of Votto next year can be offset with Alonso bat in the lineup in 2012 and allows the team to trade for/sign a SS, LF or ace, then I'm all for it. As much as I want to keep Votto, I want a championship more.

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    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric_the_Red View Post
    I agree that 3 years is foolish, but 1 more season won't hurt anything. Let's give Alonso another year at AAA to continue to improve and show that he truly is legit. And give Votto another year to show what he can do in the majors. Votto won the MVP this year and, unless he wins another, I doubt his price can go much higher.

    The time to make a decision on Votto/Alonso is next off-season, IMO. If they both mash, then the team should be able to trade either one to improve another area of the team.

    I would hate to lose Votto, because I think he brings a work ethic and demeanor that is a good example to the rest of the team. But no matter how many tickets are sold, we will always be in a small to mid-size market, and you have to operate as such. If a trade of Votto next year can be offset with Alonso bat in the lineup in 2012 and allows the team to trade for/sign a SS, LF or ace, then I'm all for it. As much as I want to keep Votto, I want a championship more.
    One more season does hurt something. The Reds need to add talent to the major league team now. Holding Alonso while Rolen continues to decline, Phillips contract comes to an end and the team continues to have holes in LF and at SS is a waste. The time to go for it is now while 2B and 3B are still solid positions and that means dealing some prospects with some value at positions of strength to add missing pieces.

    Hanging onto Alonso is like punting 2011 IMO.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

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    Greatness In The Making RedLegSuperStar's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    MVP or unproven prospect... Hmmm

    I'm sorry but if you are going to resign Arroyo and Scott Rolen and not focus on it's key asset baffles me. Trade Alonso.. Not the MVP!
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    Mr.Redlegs is my homeboy Eric_the_Red's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    One more season does hurt something. The Reds need to add talent to the major league team now. Holding Alonso while Rolen continues to decline, Phillips contract comes to an end and the team continues to have holes in LF and at SS is a waste. The time to go for it is now while 2B and 3B are still solid positions and that means dealing some prospects with some value at positions of strength to add missing pieces.

    Hanging onto Alonso is like punting 2011 IMO.
    I don't follow you. How does Alonso make essentially the same team from last year worse? I think Bruce improves, perhaps even Stubbs and Heisey too. The defense improves with Janish playing SS, and hopefully the young pitchers can step forward to improve also.

    Trading Alonso may improve the team this year, but what happens when Votto goes somewhere else? I want to team to experience sustained success, not just a two year window.

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    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric_the_Red View Post
    I don't follow you. How does Alonso make essentially the same team from last year worse? I think Bruce improves, perhaps even Stubbs and Heisey too. The defense improves with Janish playing SS, and hopefully the young pitchers can step forward to improve also.

    Trading Alonso may improve the team this year, but what happens when Votto goes somewhere else? I want to team to experience sustained success, not just a two year window.
    Because the window as it has been set up is the next 3 seasons at best, time to ante up now, win and worry about that when the time comes. If they win now they will be in a better position to extend Joey when it comes up to help the winning to continue.
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Seems to me Walt's just being honest. Uncertainty over Votto makes trading Alonso a more difficult, complex matter over which one would be uncertain. Keeping Alonso enables Walt to entertain transactions involving Votto, not this year necessarily but perhaps next and certainly for the following year. IMHO, there's no way Votto signs for less than 100 for 6; in fact, I don't see the slightest reason he'd sign anything that would prevent him from hitting the free agent market as soon as possible. If Alonso's good enough--which we don't quite know yet, I'd contend--the right trade of Votto, at the right time, might bring both the players and free the cash needed to extend the so-called "window" a good bit longer. I should add I reject the idea the "window" depends primarily on Votto, good as he is. It mostly depends on the depth of our starting pitching; that's what won the division last year.

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    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    Maybe, but Votto hasn't sounded as interested in a long term deal as Bruce. Maybe Walt is trying to up the price on Alonso. Maybe he's using Alonso as a hedge against what Votto may do. Maybe it's just part of the negotiations between Walt and Vottos agent. Maybe it's all of the above. Who knows.
    Whatever the case, it seems clear that Walt has every reason to amp up perceptions of the Reds interest in keeping Alonso. That's what you always do before you trade something, no? Unless you are having an absolute fire sale, which they obviously aren't.
    "I’ll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. That’s just how I do things.” -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

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    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Quote Originally Posted by HokieRed View Post
    Seems to me Walt's just being honest. Uncertainty over Votto makes trading Alonso a more difficult, complex matter over which one would be uncertain. Keeping Alonso enables Walt to entertain transactions involving Votto, not this year necessarily but perhaps next and certainly for the following year. IMHO, there's no way Votto signs for less than 100 for 6; in fact, I don't see the slightest reason he'd sign anything that would prevent him from hitting the free agent market as soon as possible. If Alonso's good enough--which we don't quite know yet, I'd contend--the right trade of Votto, at the right time, might bring both the players and free the cash needed to extend the so-called "window" a good bit longer. I should add I reject the idea the "window" depends primarily on Votto, good as he is. It mostly depends on the depth of our starting pitching; that's what won the division last year.
    I don't know that anyone is contending that the window depends primarily on Votto. However since you bring it up it probably does take up a good part of the equation. But Arroyo has 3 more years, Rolen was extended for another 2 and alot of these youngsters will be making big money in 2-3 years including Votto. I think that is what creates the window.

    As far as dealing Votto, they better never. At least not in the next 6-7 years anyway. If they do they might as well just fold this thing up, sick of seeing it. If I were a Padre fan right now I'd be livid and seriously consider moving on.
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    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric_the_Red View Post
    I don't follow you. How does Alonso make essentially the same team from last year worse? I think Bruce improves, perhaps even Stubbs and Heisey too. The defense improves with Janish playing SS, and hopefully the young pitchers can step forward to improve also.

    Trading Alonso may improve the team this year, but what happens when Votto goes somewhere else? I want to team to experience sustained success, not just a two year window.
    Holding onto Alonso doesn't make the team worse, it simply passes on the opportunity to make a good team strong enough to win. Right now the window is 2011 and 2012. After that 2B and 3B will be holes. The core will be expensive. The same team in 2011 won't be good enough IMO. They made the play-offs by playing in a weak division and beating up on those weak teams. Good teams manhandled the Reds not only in the play-offs but all season. In 2011, they won't get a two month Cy Young turn from Leake. They won't likely get a two month Cy Young run from Travis Wood either. They will see declines at 3B, C and most of the bench players. In the line-up, I'm guessing that we won't see an .800 OPS at 3B, its possible we won't see a .700 OPS behind the plate and there is a very real possibility that we won't see a .600 OPS at SS. IMO the team needs to add talent to the major league team to not only get to the next level, but to offset the drop-offs we're likely to see in multiple spots. I see a solid team that can win with the right addition or two, but status quo isn't good enough.

    If/when Votto leaves it might be nice to have Alonso around, but he's most likely nothing more than a backfill and not an MVP caliber replacement. Backfills at 1B can be had pretty easily and there is no need to hang onto him for that. If things go well he's Dan Dreissen to Votto's Perez. But Dan Driessen's are out there every year in the form of the Lyle Overbays, Adam Laroches, aging Lance Berkmans or aging Derek Lees of the world. Other than the long shot chance that Alonso becomes an upper echelon player, there really isn't a future value that he'll have to make it worth passing on an upgrade when the team is in position. I won't pass on the now on the long shot bet that Alonso becomes that caliber and at 1B, even if he's only a notch below, a similar guy won't be hard to find. If he was a starting pitcher or a middle infielder it might be different.
    Last edited by mth123; 12-06-2010 at 09:12 AM.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

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    Member hebroncougar's Avatar
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    Re: Reds fielding calls about Alonso

    I deal Alonso ASAP. I still try and find something Tampa has that I want/need, or at least include them in a 3 way.


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