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Thread: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

  1. #16
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Dom Brown in AA-AAA as a 22 year old (college senior age): .327/.391/.589 with 20 bombs in nearly 400 PAs.
    No doubt he's a really good prospect. But he's still raw. Not good defensively. He struggled as a big leaguer late last year, and bombed in winter league, taking an early exit. Great tools and upside, but there's some work left to do, I think, on some fundamentals (swing, defense). Too unfinished to be placed in the very top tier, IMO.
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  3. #17
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    No doubt he's a really good prospect. But he's still raw. Not good defensively. He struggled as a big leaguer late last year, and bombed in winter league, taking an early exit. Great tools and upside, but there's some work left to do, I think, on some fundamentals (swing, defense). Too unfinished to be placed in the very top tier, IMO.
    Ranking these guys is a delecate balance. If you don't factor in projectibility, you might miss out on guys like Crawford, Chapman and Wily Mo Pena.

  4. #18
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    Dom Brown in AA-AAA as a 22 year old (college senior age): .327/.391/.589 with 20 bombs in nearly 400 PAs.
    Kid will bust if he doesn't do something about that long swing. Waste of a #4 ranking IMO.
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  5. #19
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    As opposed to the guy who throws 106? lol
    The guy who throws 105 but has questions about a third pitch and control? Absolutely. Top it off that one guy throws a baseball for a living, while the other doesn't and its simple. Bryce Harper has one of the best swings I have ever seen. His talent at this age can be matched by very few in the history of the game (I am talking Arod/Griffey type of ability). Chapman has a tool that no one else in the history of the game (that we know of at least) can match, but his talent at this point is IMO.

  6. #20
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    While I agree that Harper is the better of the two prospects, Chapman showed control enough the last half of last season to minimize supposed control issues. He also showed a plus change in limited time. At this point, all he really needs is time and experience against major league hitters.

    Two 80 pitches (his slider and fastball) plus an average to plus change would make him, IMO, the pitching prospect with the best tools. Heck, he may have the best pitching tools in the history of the game. (This is a claim I don't take lightly and is not meant as hyperbole.)

    Whether he can harness those tools (his feel for the game and ability to pitch rather than throw is well below average at this point) will make the difference between Chapman becoming a dominant closer (he can already do that, IMO) and a dominant starter.
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  7. #21
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    While I agree that Harper is the better of the two prospects, Chapman showed control enough the last half of last season to minimize supposed control issues. He also showed a plus change in limited time. At this point, all he really needs is time and experience against major league hitters.

    Two 80 pitches (his slider and fastball) plus an average to plus change would make him, IMO, the pitching prospect with the best tools. Heck, he may have the best pitching tools in the history of the game. (This is a claim I don't take lightly and is not meant as hyperbole.)

    Whether he can harness those tools (his feel for the game and ability to pitch rather than throw is well below average at this point) will make the difference between Chapman becoming a dominant closer (he can already do that, IMO) and a dominant starter.
    You are the first person to suggest he shows a 'plus change'. Everyone universally thinks he has quite a ways to go with it at this point. While I agree with you that his control is likely better than some would lead you to believe, as a starter we simply aren't sure because when he started showing better control it was as a reliever when he didn't have to throw his worst pitch or repeat his mechanics 100 times a game.

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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    You are the first person to suggest he shows a 'plus change'. Everyone universally thinks he has quite a ways to go with it at this point. While I agree with you that his control is likely better than some would lead you to believe, as a starter we simply aren't sure because when he started showing better control it was as a reliever when he didn't have to throw his worst pitch or repeat his mechanics 100 times a game.
    Not true, doug. From former professional scout, Frankie Peliere:

    Changeup: Chapman's changeup is the obvious surprise in his repertoire. Word was he had the fastball and slider, but the changeup is a revelation. He's going to need to be far more consistent at selling his arm action and staying through the pitch. He spun off a couple of them in warm-ups and lost them high and away to his arm side. He threw some outstanding ones on the edges of the plate against live hitters, however. All coming in at 82 mph, it's going to be downright unfair to big-league hitters if he can throw this pitch for strikes. It has the fading action and differential to one day grade out as a plus offering.
    Obviously, his change has further to go than do his slider and fastball. (Both of those pitches are already 80 on the scale.) That said, his change has the chance (as I stated in my post) to be between average and plus (as, again, stated in my post and in Peliere's article).
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
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  9. #23
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Not true, doug. From former professional scout, Frankie Peliere:

    Obviously, his change has further to go than do his slider and fastball. (Both of those pitches are already 80 on the scale.) That said, his change has the chance (as I stated in my post) to be between average and plus (as, again, stated in my post and in Peliere's article).
    There is a large difference between where it is today and where it could be one day. Right now, the pitch is below average.

  10. #24
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    I said he's shown a plus change. You said no one aside from me had said that. I then shoed you the article quote from Peliere that said he has shown a plus change.
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  11. #25
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    I said he's shown a plus change. You said no one aside from me had said that. I then shoed you the article quote from Peliere that said he has shown a plus change.
    Except that isn't what Frankie said. He said this: It has the fading action and differential to one day grade out as a plus offering. He showed the ability that it could one day be a plus pitch. He didn't throw plus ones, he just showed some things that could mean that one day he could throw a plus one.

  12. #26
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Would you agree that plus equals outstanding? (BTW, every scout I've ever talked to does.)

    He threw some outstanding ones on the edges of the plate against live hitters, however.
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  13. #27
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Would you agree that plus equals outstanding? (BTW, every scout I've ever talked to does.)
    No, I wouldn't agree to that because we simply don't know. To me, if plus equated to outstanding, Frankie would have said he threw several plus change ups given that he used the word plus later on.

    Here is my take on it.... I don't care how good it moves right now, he is clearly slowing down his arm action to throw it and that alone means there is no way its a plus pitch.

  14. #28
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    He used outstanding because he was trying to use synonyms for "plus" (as almost any writer would).

    But hey, why admit your mistake when you can argue an arcane semantic argument?
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
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  15. #29
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    I have to agree with Doug here. That scouts statements suggest that he has the makings of a decent change and even threw an occassional outstanding one. That is far different than actually having a plus change.

    Just because Paul Janish hits a HR once in a while doesn't mean that he's a HR hitter.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  16. #30
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: MLB Network Special Top 50 Prospects tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    He used outstanding because he was trying to use synonyms for "plus" (as almost any writer would).

    But hey, why admit your mistake when you can argue an arcane semantic argument?
    Well, Frankie used the words plus to describe his fastball and his slider. He even used it to describe what his change up could be one day. Why wouldn't he use it to say what it is now if that is actually what it were?


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