Thank goodness Volquez was foolish enough to turn down the LTC

[reds44]

To be clear, I want Volquez to stay in the rotation and all of that. I'm not saying he should be demoted or anything absurd like that. He can definitely be an asset for this team. I'm even holding out hope he will turn things around and have a great season (and prove schlubs like me wrong).

I just don't understand why we as Reds fans can't sit here and talk about factual things (even if they happen to be negative) about our players without people getting upset. If I was talking to a few of my Reds fans in person, we would probably all agree on the topic. But bring it up on a message board, and I think some people take it as you're bashing the player. Not in my case. I like talking baseball. And keeping it real! I want Volquez to be great. Doesn't mean I have blinders on though. He has major issues IMO.

Because you're not talking factual? You made a thread to rip Volquez with no facts in it at all. The only fact you had in your post was that we traded Josh Hamilton for Edinson Volquez. That was it.

As a matter of fact, somebody in this thread ripping Volquez basically said they weren't going to look up facts to prove their point.

[Blitz Dorsey]

Because you're not talking factual? You made a thread to rip Volquez with no facts in it at all. The only fact you had in your post was that we traded Josh Hamilton for Edinson Volquez. That was it.

OK, not going to keep responding to you, this is the last time: I've said over and over again in this thread Volquez has battled command issues throughout his career. If you don't find that factual, fine. We'll agree to disagree. No need to keep going around in circles. But I think you'll find the numbers back my statement up when you combine his MLB and minor league totals.

[kaldaniels]

OK, not going to keep responding to you, this is the last time: I've said over and over again in this thread Volquez has battled command issues throughout his career. If you don't find that factual, fine. We'll agree to disagree. No need to keep going around in circles. But I think you'll find the numbers back my statement up when you combine his MLB and minor league totals.

I think everyone would agree Volquez has battled control issues throughout his career. But to say he is the weak link based on 14 starts or so since TJ surgery is a stretch IMHO.

[edabbs44]

Should we be counting EV's recovery from Tj in innings or months? Because we are closing in on 2 years, right?

[kaldaniels]

Should we be counting EV's recovery from Tj in innings or months? Because we are closing in on 2 years, right?

We are approaching the point where he should be turning the corner, yes. But we are only 11 innings into that point.

[Blitz Dorsey]

I think everyone would agree Volquez has battled control issues throughout his career. But to say he is the weak link based on 14 starts or so since TJ surgery is a stretch IMHO.

Fair enough. I would definitely take Wood, Arroyo and Leake over him, but that's just an opinion.

[Blitz Dorsey]

Should we be counting EV's recovery from Tj in innings or months? Because we are closing in on 2 years, right?

Seriously, if anyone is still using that as an excuse in 2012, we'll know they are just Edinson groupies.

[reds44]

75 innings isn't the turning point.

[reds44]

OK, not going to keep responding to you, this is the last time: I've said over and over again in this thread Volquez has battled command issues throughout his career. If you don't find that factual, fine. We'll agree to disagree. No need to keep going around in circles. But I think you'll find the numbers back my statement up when you combine his MLB and minor league totals.

We're not going around in circles. You claim there are facts, I give you the actual facts, you ignore the facts and post something completely different.

And we all know you didn't make this thread to say Volquez has control issues.

[kaldaniels]

75 innings isn't the turning point.

He is closing in on 2 years. If that's not the turning point what is?

[Slyder]

Hmm...suspended for PED's after Tommy John surgery. Show me some proof its PED's and not the elbow replacement surgery he just had.

Ill provide you a link to Francisco Liriano's numbers post Tommy John because he is fresh in my mind. Just take a look, Liriano comes back for 14 starts in 2008, Volquez started 12. Liriano put up worse numbers, 2009 was another rough year, then 2010 (2 years removed) he was back to being pretty darn good. You may also want to take a look at the BB category, he was pretty erratic post TJ for his first 2 years.

You probably don't want to look at facts right now, but its some food for thought.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...iriafr01.shtml

This is the very reason why I wanted to pretty much keep Volquez limited to the pen in '10.

[reds44]

He is closing in on 2 years. If that's not the turning point what is?

You need to pitch innings. He's thrown 75 of them. It has nothing to do with years.

[kaldaniels]

You need to pitch innings. He's thrown 75 of them. It has nothing to do with years.

Minor league innings don't count?

[reds44]

Minor league innings don't count?

If you include those how many innings does he have? 95? And I wouldn't even include those.

The turning point should come sometime this year, though.

[westofyou]

Should we be counting EV's recovery from Tj in innings or months? Because we are closing in on 2 years, right?

Innings, in fact 388 big league innings is pretty small, plus the dude was and still is kinda wild, 14 hit batters and 10 WP in his big year.

Nolan Ryan used to pitch like this ALL the time.