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Thread: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

  1. #661
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    If he goes, it's because Kentucky is probably the most exhausting job in sports. It's truly 24/7, and you can't hide. Ever.
    I think Mike D'antoni would say the same about the Knicks job.

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  3. #662
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    [QUOTE=jmac;2548608]

    I understand some of your points but overall, I see things a little differently.

    1: I agree as far as the missing ingredient Cal will have after this year barring a return from Lamb or Jones (and it wouldnt surprise me if Lamb returned)
    Alot of people do not pick up on the veteran that each Cal team has had. Stevenson and Harris were big that first year even though they didnt get much pub. Harrelson came from out of nowhere so who knows...maybe Hood will or Wiljter will take a giant step next season.
    Of course "each" Cal team has had one common denominator and that is Darius Miller. The kid has really grown leaps and bounds in the last 3 years and I am sure UK would have lost a couple during the season if it wasnt for Miller.
    Wiljter is a good recruit who is the kind of kid who would stick around maybe 3-4 years. UK has another one coming in next season who isnt the one and done type (cant think of his name though)
    Problem is you can't expect sophomores (Wiltjer) to lead your team, and by lead I mean veteran composure. Kentucky has had a "glue guy" in each of Cal's three years. This year its Miller, last year Harrellson, year before Stevenson and Harris. The player transferring in is Ryan Harrow from NC State and he will likely be the starting PG next season. Another player that might be an interesting transfer option that might give UK that piece would be Alex Oriahki from UConn, who is transferring since UConn is missing the tournament next season.

    2: Not just because I am a UK fan but saying this anyway, if Cal leaves a job like UK "and" the place where he has put UK back into college basketball, it would be one of the dumbest moves ever IMO.
    I just think guys like Pitino and Cal are exceptional college coaches who have the 2 ingredients to make a great college coach : Recruiter and motivator.
    He does have the dribble drive but I dont think he could go to Miss State for example and turn them into a power with it. He would have to do what Cal does along with others like Pitino and Williams etc and that is recruit.
    In the NBA, you are stuck with who you have. The Wizards picked Wall but are still struggling. The Kings recently have got guys like Evans-Cousins-Jimmer and still struggle.
    The bolded point is referenced because Cal took a team at Memphis that is in one of the worst conferences in America and turned it into a powerhouse. He recruited DaJuan Wagner, Derrick Rose, Tyreke Evans, Xavier Henry, and DeMarcus Cousins to Memphis and took the Derrick Rose team to the National Championship. I'm not including UMass because it was pre-dribble drive but the UMass years should be a reflection on Cal's coaching. Kids would follow Cal to India if it meant getting into the NBA.

    The dribble drive is what separates Cal from Pitino. Cal has a niche that would work at the next level and has been adopted in some forms by NBA teams, notably Doc Rivers in Boston. Cal flamed out in New Jersey for the same reasons Pitino did in Boston, and that was for the reasons you listed (and I think Pitino would flame out again). You can't win through trying to motivate players who make more money than you do, you have to have something they want.

    Now if a coach steps into a high profile NBA job already established like LA,Dallas, Bulls etc, yeah he could win. But a coach isnt going to take over the Bobcats and make them a winner overnight. If it takes 3-5 years, there is a good chance that coach will be fired beforehand.
    Plus in the NBA, all it takes is one star player disgruntled and it is Bye-Bye coach.
    I don't think Cal would ever leave Kentucky for the Charlotte Bobcats or Toronto Raptors. The Knicks is one of the top jobs in the NBA and is a real possibility. I mentioned the Wizards because of John Wall and the possibility of adding a top 5 pick, which could be MKG or Davis.

    I think guys like Coach K (who I am not a big fan of because of Duke) and Williams have shown extreme smarts in sticking at these high profile jobs where they can dominate year in and year out. I always have said that he might not admit it but I bet deep inside, Pitino knows leaving UK was one of the dumbest things he could have done. Guys like him and Cal- K--Williams-Self and a few others are always going to be able to get top talent into their program as opposed to an NBA job.
    I never had a problem with Pitino for leaving. He re-established Kentucky back to relevancy and for that UK fans should be grateful. Pitino is from the New England area and was getting a chance to coach in one of the top jobs in the NBA and land a future HOF center in Tim Duncan. My problem with Pitino was taking the Louisville job, knowing he would burn any bridge he ever built in the Bluegrass State.

    Also...it is hard to see Cal run and up and jumping on sidelines in NBA the way he does in college. Look at the top NBA coaches over the years, Rivers-Jackson-Popavich etc. They are pretty and tame and stoic on sideline and some like Phil Jackson you practically never seen move off the bench.
    Even if Cal does win it all, he has the chance to put together a nice reign at UK. Maybe not a Final Four every year but a basketball power every year nonetheless.
    I don't disagree, but Rivers, Jackson, and Poppovich are also dealing with grown men and not college students. That would probably explain a lot.
    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Back to the Final Four!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
    "Cheering for Kentucky is like watching Star Wars and hoping Darth Vader chokes an ewok"


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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    The Kentucky-Louisville Final Four match-up has a chance to be absolutely crazy. For a week. Dieng is as close to Davis as anyone has in CBB (at least defensively), Benahan is a man at power forward, and Siva isn't killing them at point.

    If Louisville somehow finds a way to beat Kentucky...

    Calipari would lose luster across the nation. Those questions about Calipari's coaching acumen would become shouts. Some (idiotic) Kentucky fans would start calling for "new blood" at UK. Vitale would once again be able to dog Kentucky fans while defending one of his "favorite coaches". Recruiting could take a major dip, and the whole meme about one-and-done recruits being not only bad for CBB (debateable) but likely to choke in a tournament would gain new traction. The Dribble Drive would be passe.

    Pitino, meanwhile, would once again be in that conversation for best CBB coach. He'd become one of the Old Guard Masterminds, a la Dean Smith and John Wooden. Vitale would tell the nation that he knew it was only a matter of time for one of his "favorite coaches" and that all the naysayers were always full of crap. His recruiting would pick up a great deal, as Louisville would become one of the cool places to go once again. The 3 and full court handcheck would come back into style (in places other than the Big East).

    Such a juicy storyline-- I almost wish I was back in the newsroom.

    Expect national coverage likening people in the state of Kentucky to redneck basketball savants. Expect to hear even more about Pitino "helping" Calipari gain the UMass job. Expect to hear all about Calipari's chippiness since then. Expect to hear about Calipari not being able to win the big one. Expect to hear about Kentucky's shame, Calipari's World Wide Wes connection, Pitino's resuscitating a program on life support, how many Final Fours each has been to (and those that are vacated). Expect to hear about those not-so-subtle jabs both coaches make at each other. Expect to hear at least one of those jabs over the next few days. (Cal won't be able to help himself-- he's too much of a smart aleck.)

    Expect it to be crazy.
    Last edited by Scrap Irony; 03-25-2012 at 05:18 PM.
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Recruiting would take a major dip? No.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
    "Cheering for Kentucky is like watching Star Wars and hoping Darth Vader chokes an ewok"


  7. #666
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    The Kentucky-Louisville Final Four match-up has a chance to be absolutely crazy. For a week. Dieng is as close to Davis as anyone has in CBB (at least defensively), Benahan is a man at power forward, and Siva isn't killing them at point.

    If Louisville somehow finds a way to beat Kentucky...

    Calipari would lose luster across the nation. Those questions about Calipari's coaching acumen would become shouts. Some (idiotic) Kentucky fans would start calling for "new blood" at UK. Vitale would once again be able to dog Kentucky fans while defending one of his "favorite coaches". Recruiting could take a major dip, and the whole meme about one-and-done recruits being not only bad for CBB (debateable) but likely to choke in a tournament would gain new traction. The Dribble Drive would be passe.

    Pitino, meanwhile, would once again be in that conversation for best CBB coach. He'd become one of the Old Guard Masterminds, a la Dean Smith and John Wooden. Vitale would tell the nation that he knew it was only a matter of time for one of his "favorite coaches" and that all the naysayers were always full of crap. His recruiting would pick up a great deal, as Louisville would become one of the cool places to go once again. The 3 and full court handcheck would come back into style (in places other than the Big East).

    Such a juicy storyline-- I almost wish I was back in the newsroom.

    Expect national coverage likening people in the state of Kentucky to redneck basketball savants. Expect to hear even more about Pitino "helping" Calipari gain the UMass job. Expect to hear all about Calipari's chippiness since then. Expect to hear about Calipari not being able to win the big one. Expect to hear about Kentucky's shame, Calipari's World Wide Wes connection, Pitino's resuscitating a program on life support, how many Final Fours each has been to (and those that are vacated). Expect to hear about those not-so-subtle jabs both coaches make at each other. Expect to hear at least one of those jabs over the next few days. (Cal won't be able to help himself-- he's too much of a smart aleck.)

    Expect it to be crazy.
    Now let's read the storyline if UK wins?
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
    "Cheering for Kentucky is like watching Star Wars and hoping Darth Vader chokes an ewok"


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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by WMR View Post
    Now let's read the storyline if UK wins?
    If UK wins they did what they were supposed to do. Louisville has nothing to lose in this game. The fans are happy with an over achieving postseason and recognize UK for the dominant team that they are. Not to mention the matchup problems UofL will have in the championship if they advance that far.

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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by joshnky View Post
    If UK wins they did what they were supposed to do. Louisville has nothing to lose in this game. The fans are happy with an over achieving postseason and recognize UK for the dominant team that they are. Not to mention the matchup problems UofL will have in the championship if they advance that far.
    I know, Scrap's little editorial there was just reading like something out of the National Enquirer to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
    "Cheering for Kentucky is like watching Star Wars and hoping Darth Vader chokes an ewok"


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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by WMR View Post
    Now let's read the storyline if UK wins?
    Against Louisville? Not much.

    The whole thing?

    The meme about Calipari not being a great coach finally goes away, but the shouts from the Peanut Gallery about his being "shady" or "dirty" intensify. Yahoo Sports' Pat Forde may camp out in front of Memorial Coliseum. Some national writer will opine about why this is the worst thing that has ever happened to amateur athletics. Kentucky will continue to rake in the top recruits. UK's 15th Final Four will bring at least one writer to discuss who the team of the aughts is. World Wide Wes will once again be a major story. (For whatever reason.) LeBron will tweet congratulations and don some sort of UK gear, confirming to many their hatred of LeBron and making him an honorary Cat to the BBN.

    Pitino will slide permanently into that second tier of top coaches. Louisville has verifiable evidence once again that it's become the state's secondary program. (The two programs were, for all intents and purposes, even for a decade; that was before Calipari.) Secondary recruits (Top 30-70, those in the four star range) will be interested, but, by and large, the top ten guys will choose the "more fun" style of play at places like Kentucky, North Carolina, IU (at least with Crean there), and (if you're a guard) Duke. (Arizona might also be in the mix for those in the midwest and further to the Pacific.)

    In short, pretty much what's happening now. Kentucky won't get much bounce from winning the NCAA, even. Thanks to the national media's motif about how much more talented UK is than anyone else (patently false), most observers feel that only a championship will suffice. While that's crazy, it's the perception. And, as Kentucky is (right now) the hottest ticket in CBB (in terms of passion, facilities, push, exposure, and NBA "cool factor"), a championship will only confirm it.
    Last edited by Scrap Irony; 03-25-2012 at 05:45 PM.
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Pretty fun reads. IDK if I agree with all of it, but I can see why you were in newspaper writing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
    "Cheering for Kentucky is like watching Star Wars and hoping Darth Vader chokes an ewok"


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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by joshnky View Post
    If UK wins they did what they were supposed to do. Louisville has nothing to lose in this game. The fans are happy with an over achieving postseason and recognize UK for the dominant team that they are. Not to mention the matchup problems UofL will have in the championship if they advance that far.
    Shades of 1984?
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
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  13. #672
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    I must say, UK looked extremely impressive today.
    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by WMR View Post
    Back to the Final Four!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    I'm glad to be back but to be honest nowhere near as excited as last year. This year was expected and we got a cakewalk to the FF. Last year was an unbelievable run that made up for the previous years chokejob in the Elite Eight and was the first Final Four in 13 years.

    This year making it to the Final Four, meh. Now lets win the whole thing and I'll be celebrating. I'm off work on Saturday and putting in to get Monday off.
    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
    I've read books about sparkling vampires who walk around in the daylight that were written better than a John Fay article.

  15. #674
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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    Many was saying we had one of thougher regions to start with. Of course they were going by the names on the jerseys like UConn- Duke etc.
    I think UK just played at higher level and made the ISU and Baylor games look like a pushover. The way Indiana played and had been on a roll, if they had beat UK, it wouldnt have surprised me to see them win it all. Not to take anything away from the other teams remaining, but that game "could" prove to be UK's toughest in the tourney.

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    Re: University of Kentucky Men's Basketball -- 7th Edition

    So after 3 years, here is what Cal has given us:

    100-14 (.877)
    48-9 conference record
    Elite 8
    2 Final Fours
    4 All-Americans
    2 National Players of the Year
    9 All-SEC players
    9 NBA Draft picks
    Tied Vanderbilt for highest APR in the SEC
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
    "Cheering for Kentucky is like watching Star Wars and hoping Darth Vader chokes an ewok"



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