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Thread: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC (Spoilers!)

  1. #181
    always ask questions bigredmechanism's Avatar
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Introducing insanity like this is just lazy writing, it allows you to do anything with no need for believability. Again, like a telenovela.

    There are ways to use insanity that maintains believability, it seems like the writers are struggling to keep the plot interesting, and are throwing out believability to do so. To be fair, this is fairly common for shows after their third season, but I expected more from this show.
    I'm not sure it's lazy writing. He's turning bad; it's the name of the show.

    He wants an empire.

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  3. #182
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Introducing insanity like this is just lazy writing, it allows you to do anything with no need for believability. Again, like a telenovela.

    There are ways to use insanity that maintains believability, it seems like the writers are struggling to keep the plot interesting, and are throwing out believability to do so. To be fair, this is fairly common for shows after their third season, but I expected more from this show.
    I wholeheartedly disagree with you here. The whole premise of the show has been building up his insanity for five seasons. It's gotten progressively worse. There have been times where they'd pull back a bit, but for the most part, it's been getting more and more pronounced.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  4. #183
    Member ervinsm84's Avatar
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    I'd get the criticism of him becoming too irrational if it hadn't come into play repeatedly throughout the seasons with a gradual build to this point. But it's something that has built up from S1 throughout each year. I guess maybe it's too big of a leap for someone to buy, but Idk why this one would jump out more than multitude of other things he's done that a rational person would never do.

    I mean, I think the biggest leap of logic if we want to nitpick would have been him turning down a really good job with Gray Matter in S1 and having all of his health care taken care of and instead he chose to go cook crystal meth. What was the reason he did that? His pride, ego and arrogance wouldn't let him take charity and the added backstory of how he sold his shares for 5k along with some type of fall out with Elliot and the other partner in the company. Even though it was definitely the best decision for his family to take the position at Gray Matter. Any rational person in that spot would snap accept that offer given the situation, especially when the alternative is cooking crystal meth.

    They've gradually pushed the idea of Walt's ego becoming bigger and bigger to the point that it's out of control and he thinks he's untouchable. ("Because I said so" line comes to the foreground this season) He gets all of his self worth and pride in feeling like "the man" when he's Heisenberg, the big bad meth king, bc in his regular life before this, he was just an underachieving, stuck in a rut guy who was struggling from pay check to pay check with a wife who bossed him around and wasn't far from being just an emasculated coward.

    Walt's ego needs to be fed and fed again. He truly believes and has lived with the regret of not having kept his shares in Gray Matter that he should be the owner of a company worth billions. The only way at this point for him to achieve any level of self worth and ego fuel of that level is to run a meth empire.

    Is it fanciful? Sure. Any rational person would not do this. Just like any rational person would not return to cooking meth when offered a lucrative salaried position with full health care. Just like any rational person wouldn't walk into Tuco's headquarters in S1 with a bag full of fake blue meth that's explosive and try to blow up the place. Just like a rational person doesn't go and proposition/black male some drug dealer kid he taught in high school cook meth together. Just like a rational person doesn't go and try to steal a barrel of methylamine from some company with his only accomplice being a drug addict. Just like any rational person wouldn't try and bug a freaking DEA agents office when he leaves the room to get a cup of coffee. Especially when that DEA agent is his brother in law.

    There's tons of other examples like this that built up over the seasons. A rational person doesn't go to the lengths he did to ensure that Jessie was always involved in the business when Gus initially wanted nothing to do with Jessie due to his drug problem.
    Last edited by ervinsm84; 08-21-2012 at 10:34 PM.
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  5. #184
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    Quote Originally Posted by ervinsm84 View Post
    They've gradually pushed the idea of Walt's ego becoming bigger and bigger to the point that it's out of control and he thinks he's untouchable. ("Because I said so" line comes to the foreground this season) He gets all of his self worth and pride in feeling like "the man" when he's Heisenberg, the big bad meth king, bc in his regular life before this, he was just an underachieving, stuck in a rut guy who was struggling from pay check to pay check with a wife who bossed him around and wasn't far from being just an emasculated coward.

    Walt's ego needs to be fed and fed again. He truly believes and has lived with the regret of not having kept his shares in Gray Matter that he should be the owner of a company worth billions. The only way at this point for him to achieve any level of self worth and ego fuel of that level is to run a meth empire.
    I think you have explained that quite well.

    I think he also does it for the rush. The rush of doing something risky where if it goes wrong he could die or be sent to prison. I also think he wants to show everyone he is the smartest guy in the room. He wants people to appreciate his genius but it is something that can't be shown to everyone. It's like when he got drunk at Hank and Marie's and told Hank that Gale wasn't Heisenberg. He couldn't stand Gale getting the credit for his work, his genius. Speaking of Gale, I think that had something to do with Gale being fired as his partner. It wasn't necessarily because of his affection for Jesse, it was because Gale was too perfect. He couldn't boss him around because Gale knew about as much as he did.
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  6. #185
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    I understand the gradual decent into insanity, and it worked until the last two seasons. I just think this particular plot twist is too contrived and over the top. I thought the same thing last season, but to a lesser extent.

    Like I said, I expected better from the writers.
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  7. #186
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    I think you have explained that quite well.

    I think he also does it for the rush.The rush of doing something risky where if it goes wrong he could die or be sent to prison. I also think he wants to show everyone he is the smartest guy in the room. He wants people to appreciate his genius but it is something that can't be shown to everyone. It's like when he got drunk at Hank and Marie's and told Hank that Gale wasn't Heisenberg. He couldn't stand Gale getting the credit for his work, his genius. Speaking of Gale, I think that had something to do with Gale being fired as his partner. It wasn't necessarily because of his affection for Jesse, it was because Gale was too perfect. He couldn't boss him around because Gale knew about as much as he did.
    Agree with all this, but especially the bolded

    I also wonder how many times he's said something along the lines of "MYYYY RECIPE!!!!" as if he was doing some great work of scientific achievement.

    The show is a very interesting look into the entire psyche of the male ego.
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  8. #187
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    I think you have explained that quite well.

    I think he also does it for the rush. The rush of doing something risky where if it goes wrong he could die or be sent to prison. I also think he wants to show everyone he is the smartest guy in the room. He wants people to appreciate his genius but it is something that can't be shown to everyone. It's like when he got drunk at Hank and Marie's and told Hank that Gale wasn't Heisenberg. He couldn't stand Gale getting the credit for his work, his genius. Speaking of Gale, I think that had something to do with Gale being fired as his partner. It wasn't necessarily because of his affection for Jesse, it was because Gale was too perfect. He couldn't boss him around because Gale knew about as much as he did.
    I think the Gale thing was a combination of his affinity for Jesse, the fact Gale was intelligent and also that he knew Gale's learning would make Walt expendable to Gus.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  9. #188
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    Vince said Grey Matter will be further explored this season and why he was bought out. I am betting he was basically fooled into a "Buyout" like he is going to fool Mike and Jessie.
    Last edited by 19braves77; 08-21-2012 at 11:15 PM.
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  10. #189
    Bread Gloves Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    I think the Gale thing was a combination of his affinity for Jesse, the fact Gale was intelligent and also that he knew Gale's learning would make Walt expendable to Gus.
    Also, wasn't that to keep Jesse from going after Hank?

  11. #190
    Member ervinsm84's Avatar
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    I understand the gradual decent into insanity, and it worked until the last two seasons. I just think this particular plot twist is too contrived and over the top. I thought the same thing last season, but to a lesser extent.

    Like I said, I expected better from the writers.
    I think the other thing they are trying to hammer home though is to remove any of the Walt apologist out there who might have tried to claim all of his problems have been due to mostly circumstances out of his control. I think he truly started down the "breaking bad" path when he turned down the Gray Matter position to the point that he's no longer "breaking bad," he just is simply "bad." I thought they've done enough to show that transformation, but I understand why someone may think otherwise bc well, Jessie would say 5 mill is 5mill. I guess we'll just agree to disagree.
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  12. #191
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    Quote Originally Posted by Razor Shines View Post
    Also, wasn't that to keep Jesse from going after Hank?
    I think you're right. I can't remember the exact timing of Jesse's threats, but that sounds correct.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  13. #192
    Public Enemy #1 Tom Servo's Avatar
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    Walt has been shown to be stubborn and thickheaded forever. He refuses to walk away with less than what he could possibly make like he walked away from Gray Matter.
    "Since I've been with the Reds in 1989, we've never had a farm system this loaded," Bowden said. "If we were the New York Yankees and had unlimited dollars, we could have traded for Colon, (Jeff) Weaver, Rolen, (Cliff) Floyd, (Kenny) Rogers and Finley and gotten them all -- and still held onto our top five prospects. That's an amazing statement."

  14. #193
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    the dinner scene was amazing

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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    I keep coming back to the ricin hidden in Walt's room. I think that's going to come back in the end.

    And yes, the dinner scene was absolutely hilarious.
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  16. #195
    Member 757690's Avatar
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    Re: Breaking Bad Season 4 Premiere Sun 10pm AMC

    IIRC, the Gray Matter deal had something to do with another woman and Skylar. She was played by Jessica Hecht (Ross's ex-wife's lesbian lover from Friends). Anybody remember that, or am I remembering it wrong.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.


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