Turn Off Ads?

View Poll Results: Trading Hernandez waving the white flag?

Voters
24. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes.

    1 4.17%
  • Wait. I want to see what Mes can offer

    0 0%
  • There had better be other deals/callups (Alonso, etc)

    3 12.50%
  • No. Trading Hernandez is a trading from a strength.

    20 83.33%
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 21

Thread: Hernandez

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    3,155

    Hernandez

    Because of the multiple threads mentioning him. I wanted to just get a poll question up. It is simple...

    Would trading Ramon Hernandez to (insert any number of teams) be considered waving the white flag or would you be willing to let Mes have a chance? Mes projects to be a "middle of the order bat" and could possibly provide a spark.

    Assuming a Surkamp (name mentioned often) and another prospect in the lower levels of minors.

    Assuming this is going to be the ONLY move for the sake of discussion.

    1 Yes.
    2 Wait. You would be willing to give Mes a shot.
    3 No. Trading Hernandez is just attempting to manage what resources we have.
    Quote Originally Posted by moewan View Post
    Barmaid to patron "Sir you are slurring, I am going to have to cut you off"

    Patron to barmaid "I'm not slurring, I'm speaking in cursive"


  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    -The Insider-
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    2,869

    Re: Hernandez

    I personally don't care one way or another. Mes is going to be up here by September at the latest. If they feel that they can get more in prospects than draft picks come the end of the year, then so be it. I don't think they could go wrong either way. I would rather they trade him, but that's just me and I won't be mad if they don't.

  4. #3
    BobC, get a legit F.O.! Mario-Rijo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Springfield, Ohio
    Posts
    9,052

    Re: Hernandez

    Umm, I'd say it wouldn't necessarily be waving the white flag unless it is the only deal.
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

    --Woody Hayes

  5. #4
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Oakwood, OH
    Posts
    11,685

    Re: Hernandez

    (1) If trading Ramon Hernandez ruins this team's chances this year, then those chances are pretty slim.

    (2) If trading a 35-yr-old catcher in an attempt to get a missing piece of the puzzle is bad, then just cease-and-desist with all trades.

    Ramon seems good at handling/communicating w/ the young pitchers. It is an asset that cannot be measured. He also has hit over .300 (excuse me for mentioning BA) this year. However, he is a part-time player and history does not favor a catcher at this age. Sell high. There are teams with needs for a catcher. Mes may not hit as well as Ramon, but the team can play .500 ball with or without Ramon. I am willing to take a chance on that missing piece with Mes sharing catcher duties in the hopes that a .500 team will get better. If it gets worse this year, then it makes little difference to this fan if they finish 4 games out of the playoffs or 10 games out of the playoffs. It will matter to this fan if they do not attempt to improve a team that still has a legit chance.
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

  6. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    2,079

    Re: Hernandez

    If they trade him for nothing than it can be seen as waving the white flag. If they trade him for a decent return that can help the team now or in the future, than it is just being a smart GM.
    "Today was the byproduct of us thinking we can come back from anything." - Joey Votto after blowing a 10-1 lead and holding on for the 12-11 win on 8/25/2010.

  7. #6
    HS Athletic Director alexad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Cleves, Ohio
    Posts
    1,212
    He is not a high paid player so I do not view it as a white flag. This team needs a major shake up before the hole to climb out of is too deep.
    Last edited by alexad; 07-19-2011 at 10:19 PM.
    Taylor High School
    Home of the "Yellowjackets"

  8. #7
    Party like it's 1990 Blitz Dorsey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Columbus, OH
    Posts
    4,716

    Re: Hernandez

    Hilarious how opinions can change in a week. I started a thread recently and roughly half the posters were up in arms like "How could you suggest that it would be smart to trade Ramon right now?"

    The answer was simple then and is simple now: Because we don't want to lose him for nothing ... and because we have the best minor league catcher in all of baseball.

  9. #8
    KungFu Fighter AtomicDumpling's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Hamilton, OH
    Posts
    2,701

    Re: Hernandez

    There are four scenarios from which to choose:

    1. Trade Hernandez for an upgrade at another position.
    2. Trade Hernandez for a legitimate prospect or two.
    3. Keep Hernandez.
    4. Trade Hernandez for peanuts so you don't have to pay him.

    I am OK with scenarios 1-3, but scenario 4 is unacceptable.

  10. #9
    SSG, Red Army Choir Guacarock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Santa Fe, New Mexico
    Posts
    1,130

    Re: Hernandez

    Now that we are waving the white flag, isn't it time to revisit the idea of trading Hernandez to a contender?

    The team most interested in him, the Giants, have gone 2-8 in their last 10 games. Their pitching remains strong, but their offense continues to sputter, even after the acquisitions of Beltran, Cabrera and Keppinger. They are barely clinging to first place over the Diamondbacks, and have made it known they want to add another bat or two. Hernandez would certainly provide them some needed pop while also filling a position where their offense has been especially woeful since Posey's injury.

    We have an added impetus to trade Hernandez so we can call up Mesoraco and see how he handles big league pitching. I wouldn't want to entertain any off-season trades involving Grandal, for instance, unless we were confident in Mesoraco's ability to adjust following his promotion. If we can get Mesoraco six weeks of playing time with the Reds, that's a lot better window than only seeing him in limited play after September call-ups.

    My only questions:

    1. Can Hernandez successfully pass through the waiver wire or will the Diamondbacks or another contender put in a claim to block the Giants getting him?

    2. And now that we squandered the opportunity to trade Hernandez before the deadline, what kind of return can we expect for him, either from a claimant or the Giants? LH pitching prospect Surkamp probably is too high a price for the Giants to pay, but then again, they are floundering and desperately need at least one more piece to contend. If we can still score Surkamp, even if we have to sweeten the deal by trading another prospect along with Hernandez, we need to pull the trigger.

  11. #10
    Member Ron Madden's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    5,815

    Re: Hernandez

    I can't see how trading Hernandez (with Mesoraco wating in the wings) could be viewed as waving the white flag.

    I'd rather trade him for minor league filler than let him walk away with nothing in return at the end of the season.

  12. #11
    Brett William Moore Will M's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Crescent Springs KY
    Posts
    3,589

    Re: Hernandez

    if he gets claimed by the Giants or simply passes through waivers then deal him to the Giants. should have been done in July. if it can still be done its a 'no brainer'.

    reasons not to:
    1)if the team plans to re-sign Ramon to pair with Mes in 2012 & deal Hanigan. this scenario seems pretty unlikely.
    2) the team plans to offer him arbitration in the hopes of getting draft pick compensation. it seems like he'd accept & get a bigger contract than the team would want.
    .

  13. #12
    Member Ron Madden's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    5,815

    Re: Hernandez

    Quote Originally Posted by Will M View Post
    if he gets claimed by the Giants or simply passes through waivers then deal him to the Giants. should have been done in July. if it can still be done its a 'no brainer'.

    reasons not to:
    1)if the team plans to re-sign Ramon to pair with Mes in 2012 & deal Hanigan. this scenario seems pretty unlikely.
    2) the team plans to offer him arbitration in the hopes of getting draft pick compensation. it seems like he'd accept & get a bigger contract than the team would want.
    Agreed, I thought sure Walt would trade Hernandez before the deadline.

    In my opinion it would be foolish to offer him arbitration.

  14. #13
    SSG, Red Army Choir Guacarock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Santa Fe, New Mexico
    Posts
    1,130

    Re: Hernandez

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Madden View Post
    I can't see how trading Hernandez (with Mesoraco wating in the wings) could be viewed as waving the white flag.

    I'd rather trade him for minor league filler than let him walk away with nothing in return at the end of the season.
    I guess I should clarify myself. For the balance of this season, we ought to be giving as many at bats as we can to the prospects we either intend to play in 2012 or trade this off-season.

    In the case of the keepers, we'll be giving them a leg up to succeed next year. In the case of those we might trade, we'll be giving them one long last, hard look so we don't mistakenly deal them off when we should have continued to stockpile them.

    We don't want to repeat the kind of boner that Brewers' GM Doug Melvin committed when he worked a deal with the Rangers to acquire Francisco Cordero for Carlos Lee, and then added Nelson Cruz as a throw-in.

    Is this sorting out process absolutely necessary? Yes.

    Is it a capitulation for this season, a case of waving the white flag? Yes and no. Not if the prospects outperform the guys they're bumping, but yes if we see more bumps as the kids grapple with the learning curve. We won't know which it will be until we go there, but it is time to go there.

  15. #14
    Member Ron Madden's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    5,815

    Re: Hernandez

    Quote Originally Posted by Will M View Post
    if he gets claimed by the Giants or simply passes through waivers then deal him to the Giants. should have been done in July. if it can still be done its a 'no brainer'.

    reasons not to:
    1)if the team plans to re-sign Ramon to pair with Mes in 2012 & deal Hanigan. this scenario seems pretty unlikely.
    2) the team plans to offer him arbitration in the hopes of getting draft pick compensation. it seems like he'd accept & get a bigger contract than the team would want.
    The only reason I can see for resigning Hernandez and trading Hanigan is IMHO Hanigan has more trade value.

    I hope Hanigan is still here as a back up to Mesoraco next season.

    .
    Last edited by Ron Madden; 08-08-2011 at 02:16 AM.

  16. #15
    Member Ron Madden's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    5,815

    Re: Hernandez

    Quote Originally Posted by Guacarock View Post
    I guess I should clarify myself. For the balance of this season, we ought to be giving as many at bats as we can to the prospects we either intend to play in 2012 or trade this off-season.

    In the case of the keepers, we'll be giving them a leg up to succeed next year. In the case of those we might trade, we'll be giving them one long last, hard look so we don't mistakenly deal them off when we should have continued to stockpile them.

    We don't want to repeat the kind of boner that Brewers' GM Doug Melvin committed when he worked a deal with the Rangers to acquire Francisco Cordero for Carlos Lee, and then added Nelson Cruz as a throw-in.

    Is this sorting out process absolutely necessary? Yes.

    Is it a capitulation for this season, a case of waving the white flag? Yes and no. Not if the prospects outperform the guys they're bumping, but yes if we see more bumps as the kids grapple with the learning curve. We won't know which it will be until we go there, but it is time to go there.
    It's me that should have made myself more clear.

    I agree with both of your post in this thread. I was referring to the question asked by Slyder in the first post of this thread.

    Would trading Hernandez be considered waving the white flag?


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25