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Thread: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

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    Party like it's 1990 Blitz Dorsey's Avatar
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    Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Flashback to 9 years ago and the 2002 Reds draft. They completely botched their first two picks, taking Chris Gruler with the #3 overall pick (many thought the Reds were "punting" the pick since they didn't have the money to pay someone who deserved to be taken that high) and then taking Mark Schramek with their supplemental first-round pick.

    However, they got it right when the second-round rolled around. They drafted someone who is listed here as Joseph D. Votto, a catcher. Funny stuff. I had no idea Joey was a catcher in high school. I'm sure he played other positions too (like every good player does for their high school team ... hell, he probably pitched some too) but it's interesting he was officially listed as a catcher when the Reds drafted him:

    http://mlb.mlb.com/team/draft.jsp?c_id=cin&year=2002

    I knew Votto was a second-round pick and I remember the Gruler disaster in the first round. But I had forgotten they happened the same year. Funny how things work out.

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    OlafTheBlack Dan's Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    If you ever want to torture yourself, take a stroll back through some of the brutal drafts in the 1990s and 2000s, and see who the Reds could have had instead of who they picked.

    Probably the worst draft for any team in the history of baseball: Reds 1996.
    Sabermetrics is this: A batter's goal is to extend the inning. Extend enough innings and you're going to score runs. Extend more innings than your opponent and you're going to score more runs than him.

    Forget the rain. It's never an official game until the Reds piss away a run between third base and home plate. - Bluegrass Redleg

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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Quote Originally Posted by Blitz Dorsey View Post
    Flashback to 9 years ago and the 2002 Reds draft. They completely botched their first two picks, taking Chris Gruler with the #3 overall pick (many thought the Reds were "punting" the pick since they didn't have the money to pay someone who deserved to be taken that high) and then taking Mark Schramek with their supplemental first-round pick.

    However, they got it right when the second-round rolled around. They drafted someone who is listed here as Joseph D. Votto, a catcher. Funny stuff. I had no idea Joey was a catcher in high school. I'm sure he played other positions too (like every good player does for their high school team ... hell, he probably pitched some too) but it's interesting he was officially listed as a catcher when the Reds drafted him:

    http://mlb.mlb.com/team/draft.jsp?c_id=cin&year=2002

    I knew Votto was a second-round pick and I remember the Gruler disaster in the first round. But I had forgotten they happened the same year. Funny how things work out.
    Gruler wasn't perceived as "punting the pick"- that was Jeremy Sowers the previous year. Gruler and Kazmir were neck-in-neck the candidates for that selection, but the Reds took Gruler because he "had a better curveball than Tom Seaver" according to Johnny Bench. Kazmir who was viewed as a slightly tougher sign slipped to the Mets, and the rest is history. I was up in arms on Redszone over this choice. Schramek in the Sandwich round was seen as a giant reach for signability purposes.

    Votto was viewed as a catcher who would "probably move to 3B" when he was drafted. At the time he was also considered a reach, although 20-20 hindsight Yankee reporting indicates they were ready to pounce on him if the Reds didn't.
    Go BLUE!!!

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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan View Post
    Probably the worst draft for any team in the history of baseball: Reds 1996.
    Wow, that was brutal! Strange that 2 of their top 3 picks (McClendon and Carlyle) ended up in the Braves organization, especially since they were comp picks for the loss of Ron Gant.
    Go BLUE!!!

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    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Wow, that was brutal! Strange that 2 of their top 3 picks (McClendon and Carlyle) ended up in the Braves organization, especially since they were comp picks for the loss of Ron Gant.
    I wonder if anybody has had a draft where not a single player reached the majors...
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    OlafTheBlack Dan's Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Wow, that was brutal! Strange that 2 of their top 3 picks (McClendon and Carlyle) ended up in the Braves organization, especially since they were comp picks for the loss of Ron Gant.
    I think I remember being rather upset when Carlyle was traded for the great fireballer Marc Kroon. Jimbo loved his flame-throwers, that's for sure.
    Sabermetrics is this: A batter's goal is to extend the inning. Extend enough innings and you're going to score runs. Extend more innings than your opponent and you're going to score more runs than him.

    Forget the rain. It's never an official game until the Reds piss away a run between third base and home plate. - Bluegrass Redleg

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    OlafTheBlack Dan's Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Wow, that was brutal! Strange that 2 of their top 3 picks (McClendon and Carlyle) ended up in the Braves organization, especially since they were comp picks for the loss of Ron Gant.
    The other thing that gets me about that year is that every player without a (minors) link next to their name not only didn't sign with the Reds, no other team picked them up (either later or as free agents) to play in their minor league system. That's 3/4 of the Reds' picks. Contrast that with the Reds 1999 where at least every pick ended up playing in the minors.
    Sabermetrics is this: A batter's goal is to extend the inning. Extend enough innings and you're going to score runs. Extend more innings than your opponent and you're going to score more runs than him.

    Forget the rain. It's never an official game until the Reds piss away a run between third base and home plate. - Bluegrass Redleg

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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    The Reds had the money to sign Gruler as demonstrated when they did sign him.

    Kazmir was well liked on the board, but had signability issues, was considered an injury risk, and some thought he might end up as a reliever. He fell quite far so many teams felt the same way.

    Gruler was a high end prospect, but injuries ended it for him. It wasn't, at the time, considered a particularly poor pick.

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    Making sense of it all Matt700wlw's Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    From here on out, we will refer to Joey Votto as, Joseph D. Votto.

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    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Gruler was a high end prospect, but injuries ended it for him. It wasn't, at the time, considered a particularly poor pick.
    If I recall Johnny Bench said Gruler was going to be another Tom Seaver.
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

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    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt700wlw View Post
    From here on out, we will refer to Joey Votto as, Joseph D. Votto.
    That's MR. Joseph D. Votto, if you please.
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
    Bailey CYA winner
    Hamilton ROY & GG

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    Party like it's 1990 Blitz Dorsey's Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    The Reds had the money to sign Gruler as demonstrated when they did sign him.

    Kazmir was well liked on the board, but had signability issues, was considered an injury risk, and some thought he might end up as a reliever. He fell quite far so many teams felt the same way.

    Gruler was a high end prospect, but injuries ended it for him. It wasn't, at the time, considered a particularly poor pick.
    Right, like I said, the Reds had the money to sign Gruler. But they obviously didn't have the money to sign the player (Kazmir) that should have been taken in that spot. If you're not taking the best player on the board, then it's all about signability. "Punting" the pick is a bit strong, but Gruler was still viewed as a reach from day one. But hey, that draft went from disaster-to-success just based on Votto alone.

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    Louisville Bats Expert batsfan's Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    We also drafted Nick Markakis as a pitcher in the 23rd round...

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    Member medford's Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    I wonder if anybody has had a draft where not a single player reached the majors...
    I'll guess yes. The fail rate is so high its had to have happened several times would be my guess.

    getting just 1 guy as valuable as Votto makes that a very solid draft class. Had Grueler stayed healthy and made an impact in the show, that would have been an outstanding draft.

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    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: Joseph D. Votto, a catcher, drafted by Reds in 2nd round

    Dude is going to be a bust. Too soft.


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