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Thread: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

  1. #46
    always ask questions bigredmechanism's Avatar
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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
    Usually, but not always. For one year, I taught a 13 year old boy who was in foster care that was a heroin addict. His parents were heroin addicts, and when he was a baby, they would get high in their apartment. To keep him and his brother quiet, they would inject them with heroin so that they wouldn't cry. When the police found them, he was literally doped up on heroin in a shoebox under his parent's bed. That wasn't a choice that he ever made. I know that's the exception rather than the rule, but stories like his do exist. Perhaps even sadder, due to the drugs' effect on his brain, he was also a convicted sex offender at age 11.
    Jesus that is horrifying and depressing.

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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Yeah, not everyone who turns to drugs and alcohol is a well adjusted, fully responsible young person who just wants to get some kicks at the expense of their better judgment. There are terrible situations people are born into that can lead a young person to a crowd or environment where drugs and alcohol come included with family and belonging. Usually by the time you are old enough to know better, you're already addicted or it has already become a routine part of your family/social/personal life.

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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by frenetic wave View Post
    Yeah, not everyone who turns to drugs and alcohol is a well adjusted, fully responsible young person who just wants to get some kicks at the expense of their better judgment. There are terrible situations people are born into that can lead a young person to a crowd or environment where drugs and alcohol come included with family and belonging. Usually by the time you are old enough to know better, you're already addicted or it has already become a routine part of your family/social/personal life.
    I don't buy into this much, at least for 99% of addicts. With the way schools preach about drugs and alcohol by the time one is old enough to be in a situation to choose to drink or start doing a drug they know better.

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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    I don't buy into this much, at least for 99% of addicts. With the way schools preach about drugs and alcohol by the time one is old enough to be in a situation to choose to drink or start doing a drug they know better.
    By the time most kids are legal to drink, they still don't "know better."
    When all is said and done more is said than done.

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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by dabvu2498 View Post
    By the time most kids are legal to drink, they still don't "know better."
    Oh they know better, they just don't care because it's what everyone does. Or they believe that can control it (and a lot of people can) to a point where they don't have a problem.

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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
    Usually, but not always. For one year, I taught a 13 year old boy who was in foster care that was a heroin addict. His parents were heroin addicts, and when he was a baby, they would get high in their apartment. To keep him and his brother quiet, they would inject them with heroin so that they wouldn't cry. When the police found them, he was literally doped up on heroin in a shoebox under his parent's bed. That wasn't a choice that he ever made. I know that's the exception rather than the rule, but stories like his do exist. Perhaps even sadder, due to the drugs' effect on his brain, he was also a convicted sex offender at age 11.
    I'm not sure if anyone could ever make up a story as awful as this one.

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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Oh they know better, they just don't care because it's what everyone does. Or they believe that can control it (and a lot of people can) to a point where they don't have a problem.
    Your perspective works for you, and it has kept you (I'm assuming) from becoming addicted, so that is a great and valid perspective for you. But it's hard to project a personal perspective into a universal one. Some people's lives are just different and poor, stupid decision from your vantage point may be a lesser of several evils from another's. There are 17 year olds who can barely read, which seems impossible and ridiculous, so I can surely imagine that a 14 year old can get wrapped up in drugs/alcohol to escape their situation or to belong to a social family without fully understanding what the lifelong consequences are. It's pretty wild how some people live and I'm glad drinking and smoking and drugs has always been a very deliberate and clear choice for me and others here. It means we're lucky and privileged.
    Last edited by frenetic wave; 08-04-2011 at 09:44 PM.

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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Oh they know better, they just don't care because it's what everyone does. Or they believe that can control it (and a lot of people can) to a point where they don't have a problem.
    Just because you think it doesn't make it true. The world is a lot more complicated and a lot less black and white than you seem to think. Opening up your mind to the possibility that alternate points of view might, in some cases, have some validity is a healthy thing. You really ought to try it.
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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by pedro View Post
    Just because you think it doesn't make it true. The world is a lot more complicated and a lot less black and white than you seem to think. Opening up your mind to the possibility that alternate points of view might, in some cases, have some validity is a healthy thing. You really ought to try it.
    You aren't going to convince me that by the time someone is old enough to legally drink that they don't know the issues that it could cause. That isn't some closed minded thought process, its faith that people aren't actually that uneducated about it. Whether they choose to ignore such knowledge for whatever reason, I will accept. But to suggest that someone 21 years old doesn't know what alcohol can do to them, I just won't accept that 99.9% of people in that age group haven't been told about the side effects of it by that point in their life, at least in first world countries.

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    always ask questions bigredmechanism's Avatar
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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    But to suggest that someone 21 years old doesn't know what alcohol can do to them, I just won't accept that 99.9% of people in that age group haven't been told about the side effects of it by that point in their life, at least in first world countries.
    I completely disagree.

    A 21 year old may have an idea of the physical effects of drinking, sure. But most people that age have absolutely no clue about alcoholism and addiction unless they have experienced it firsthand or through their family. School education about drugs and alcohol is an absolute joke. Being able to recite all the types of cancer that smoking cigarettes causes does not necessarily demonstrate an understanding of the subject, it just shows that they were taught certain aspects.

    But how can you actually teach someone addiction?

    Granted, they know the word and understand it's definition, but in reality most people have little clue of the consequences of it, and most people will never really know the struggles unless they have the genetic misfortune for addiction propensity.

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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by bigredmechanism View Post
    I completely disagree.

    A 21 year old may have an idea of the physical effects of drinking, sure. But most people that age have absolutely no clue about alcoholism and addiction unless they have experienced it firsthand or through their family. School education about drugs and alcohol is an absolute joke. Being able to recite all the types of cancer that smoking cigarettes causes does not necessarily demonstrate an understanding of the subject, it just shows that they were taught certain aspects.

    But how can you actually teach someone addiction?

    Granted, they know the word and understand it's definition, but in reality most people have little clue of the consequences of it, and most people will never really know the struggles unless they have the genetic misfortune for addiction propensity.
    Good post.

    Some people are just less likely to take things seriously. And, imo, unless someone has some kind of personal experience with addiction they're more likely to act like it's something they shouldn't worry about. Besides, alot of people think things won't happen to them when there's no reason to think that. (The 'that only happens to other people' mentality) That young people tend to feel invincible doesn't help either. Young people are just more likely to engage in risky behavior because they're less likely to take the consequences seriously.

    I remember when I was in high school and we had to take a survey about different things we had done (like alcohol, specific drugs, casual sex, etc). And I remember some of my classmates took it as a joke.

    "Yes I have done that."
    "Oh Yeah I do that all the time."
    "I haven't done that but I think I'd like to. I mean, hey, that sounds like fun!"
    "No, I haven't done that but I've answered 'yes' to everything else so why not."

    etc etc etc

    Then again, I also remember one guy that told me that he just made a Christmas tree when he took his SAT's.
    Last edited by redsfandan; 08-05-2011 at 07:13 AM.
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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by bigredmechanism View Post

    But how can you actually teach someone addiction?

    Granted, they know the word and understand it's definition, but in reality most people have little clue of the consequences of it, and most people will never really know the struggles unless they have the genetic misfortune for addiction propensity.
    If you understand the definition, then you know enough to understand that there could be consequences for starting. Choosing to ignore it because "it won't happen to me" doesn't change that you understand it.

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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    If you understand the definition, then you know enough to understand that there could be consequences for starting. Choosing to ignore it because "it won't happen to me" doesn't change that you understand it.
    So you're saying you've NEVER partaken of any substance considered addictive? Tobacco, alcohol, coffee, caffeine, etc....
    Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David

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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    You aren't going to convince me that by the time someone is old enough to legally drink that they don't know the issues that it could cause. That isn't some closed minded thought process, its faith that people aren't actually that uneducated about it. Whether they choose to ignore such knowledge for whatever reason, I will accept. But to suggest that someone 21 years old doesn't know what alcohol can do to them, I just won't accept that 99.9% of people in that age group haven't been told about the side effects of it by that point in their life, at least in first world countries.
    You're right. I'm not going to convince you of anything. You already know it all.
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    Re: Singer Amy Winehouse found dead in London home, Sky News reports

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM View Post
    So you're saying you've NEVER partaken of any substance considered addictive? Tobacco, alcohol, coffee, caffeine, etc....
    Caffeine, yes. I drink cola's. Never had tobacco, alcohol or coffee. Not that I am opposed to coffee, I just think it smells terrible so the idea of drinking it seems like a poor one for me.

    And yes, I have a slight addiction to caffeine. Certainly get headaches if I haven't had some after about 8 hours of being awake.


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