Ah, so you do have an addiction.
Ah, so you do have an addiction.
Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David
I do indeed. But are we actually trying to compare caffeine to alcohol or illegal drugs? Any 5 year old can go to a store and buy a can of Coca Cola and get caffeine in it, legally.Originally Posted by MWM
And at one point, any 5 yr old could buy Coca Cola that had cocaine derivatives in it.
At one time we thought the world was flat, it was ok to own slaves and believed there were witches with magical powers. What does it have to do with the conversation?
The vast majority of 21 year olds don't know anything, let alone that their life could be catastrophically altered in any way.
All I know at 30 is that I don't know enough to judge others for decisions they make that harm themselves. Everyone has a drastically different life and life experience. None of us know that if put into someone else's shoes we'd be able to do anything differently. How anyone can judge someone like Winehouse instead of pitying her is beyond me. Maybe because we think in this country money and fame should be able to conquer any personal problem, which is a perverse thought and probably completely backward from reality. Money and fame exacerbate already existing issues.
Life is hard for most people. We are pretty clearly hard wired to seek out conscious altering experiences if you look through history at human behavior. Combine the two things and you'll sometimes have tragedy, and it's sad.
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
The point is drug laws are pretty arbitrary. Caffeine could easily be illegal, and if it were I'm sure you'd be on this board preaching about how anyone could choose not to drink coffee.
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Good post.
Had they never started drinking coffee, I am confident that they could choose not to start. Lets not pretend that in 99.9% of cases that people are forced to start doing drugs/drinking alcohol. They aren't. It is a decision that they make to start doing.
I don't see the point.
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
You said that I would be saying people could choose to not drink coffee. I took that to imply that you believe the decision to not drink coffee wasn't an option.
No. People can choose not to do all sorts of things that are harmful to themselves, but sometimes they don't, because they are human.
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Sure. They are humans. Humans make poor decisions all the time. We all have done things we shouldn't have. But they are still choices we make and that has been my point all along. Drugs addicts are drug addicts because they made the choice to start using. Not for any other reason (in 99.9% of the cases that is). It is that persons own fault. They made the choice.
It is a sad situation. I have dealt with many addicted people in my life. I have seen what they can do to people and families. I have lost an uncle to a drug overdose. My best friends sister is a serious crack addict. It has ripped his family apart. I have multiple extended family members who are either coke addicts or big time pillheads. But at the end of the day, those people all have no one to blame but themselves.
Similar to how you refuse to let several other posters frame yours with theirs, you can not frame someone else's experience with your own.
I still don't see your point.
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
So these people didn't make the choice to start using? Is that what you are saying?
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