Turn Off Ads?
Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 54

Thread: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    119

    Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    I am on several other boards, and i hear the same tired routine every single day from reds fans there. "FIRE DUSTY", "DUSTY DESTROYS ARMS", yadda yadda yadda. If someone actually gave a legitmate reason that was supported by facts, i wouldnt mind, but its always opinionated crap.

    Here are a few arguments i have heard.

    "Dusty doesnt like young guys, only older players"
    Two starters the other night were 30 or older, BP and Hernandez. Two of our best players. a majority were in the mid 20's.

    "Dusty always benches a guy after he has a good game"
    Ive seen this tons of times. Ive also come to find out, that when you look stat wise at how a batter does against the opposing starting pitcher, or the type of pitches he throws, the benching is 90% warranted. people act like Dusty, and only Dusty, has any input on this. I'm sure every single team has people watching tape, and using stats to decide the best course of action.

    "Dusty destroys arms"
    Most peoples default argument against him. Hard to believe someone would actually take a cities excuse for losing pitchers as a fact. This is the same city that believed one foul ball ruined their chances for a world series. Especially when Mark Prior came out publicly and said it wasnt Dustys fault. Then we get the people who tell us to look at the fact that we have had pitchers on the DL this year. If we were the only team that had this issue, then maybe i would believe you. but when asked about the amount of other pitchers who have spent time on the DL in the past 3-5 years, most "Dusty haters" wont change their tune.

    "Dusty costs us close games"
    just look at our teams RISP in those games and tell me who's fault it is.


    There are plenty more, but i'm getting tired of typing. The fact is, Dusty doesnt really do much. We have pitching coaches who work with pitchers (Blaming dusty for a pitchers issues), Hitting coaches who work with hitters (Blaming dusty for batters not hitting the ball), a man above dusty who is responsible for the players in the dugout (People actually blaming dusty for trades not being made and players not being brought up. I'm serious, ive heard this a few times). There was even a person who blamed dusty for cueto being sick.

    Dusty does mess up, and he has made mistakes, we all do. But to blame him for every single issue on this team shows a lack of baseball knowledge. Blame the batters for not making contact. Blame the major league pitchers for not being able to throw a strike and do their only job. Blame the closer for blowing games. Blame the hitting coach for players not being able to bunt, or for players having the same broken swing for months. A managers job is way overhyped and he doesnt do much besides be a punching bag.

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    Member mroby85's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    2,282

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Quote Originally Posted by Skreep View Post
    I am on several other boards, and i hear the same tired routine every single day from reds fans there. "FIRE DUSTY", "DUSTY DESTROYS ARMS", yadda yadda yadda. If someone actually gave a legitmate reason that was supported by facts, i wouldnt mind, but its always opinionated crap.

    Here are a few arguments i have heard.

    "Dusty doesnt like young guys, only older players"
    Two starters the other night were 30 or older, BP and Hernandez. Two of our best players. a majority were in the mid 20's.

    "Dusty always benches a guy after he has a good game"
    Ive seen this tons of times. Ive also come to find out, that when you look stat wise at how a batter does against the opposing starting pitcher, or the type of pitches he throws, the benching is 90% warranted. people act like Dusty, and only Dusty, has any input on this. I'm sure every single team has people watching tape, and using stats to decide the best course of action.

    "Dusty destroys arms"
    Most peoples default argument against him. Hard to believe someone would actually take a cities excuse for losing pitchers as a fact. This is the same city that believed one foul ball ruined their chances for a world series. Especially when Mark Prior came out publicly and said it wasnt Dustys fault. Then we get the people who tell us to look at the fact that we have had pitchers on the DL this year. If we were the only team that had this issue, then maybe i would believe you. but when asked about the amount of other pitchers who have spent time on the DL in the past 3-5 years, most "Dusty haters" wont change their tune.

    "Dusty costs us close games"
    just look at our teams RISP in those games and tell me who's fault it is.


    There are plenty more, but i'm getting tired of typing. The fact is, Dusty doesnt really do much. We have pitching coaches who work with pitchers (Blaming dusty for a pitchers issues), Hitting coaches who work with hitters (Blaming dusty for batters not hitting the ball), a man above dusty who is responsible for the players in the dugout (People actually blaming dusty for trades not being made and players not being brought up. I'm serious, ive heard this a few times). There was even a person who blamed dusty for cueto being sick.

    Dusty does mess up, and he has made mistakes, we all do. But to blame him for every single issue on this team shows a lack of baseball knowledge. Blame the batters for not making contact. Blame the major league pitchers for not being able to throw a strike and do their only job. Blame the closer for blowing games. Blame the hitting coach for players not being able to bunt, or for players having the same broken swing for months. A managers job is way overhyped and he doesnt do much besides be a punching bag.
    yep lol

  4. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    487

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Quote Originally Posted by Skreep View Post
    I am on several other boards, and i hear the same tired routine every single day from reds fans there. "FIRE DUSTY", "DUSTY DESTROYS ARMS", yadda yadda yadda. If someone actually gave a legitmate reason that was supported by facts, i wouldnt mind, but its always opinionated crap.

    Here are a few arguments i have heard.

    "Dusty doesnt like young guys, only older players"
    Two starters the other night were 30 or older, BP and Hernandez. Two of our best players. a majority were in the mid 20's.

    "Dusty always benches a guy after he has a good game"
    Ive seen this tons of times. Ive also come to find out, that when you look stat wise at how a batter does against the opposing starting pitcher, or the type of pitches he throws, the benching is 90% warranted. people act like Dusty, and only Dusty, has any input on this. I'm sure every single team has people watching tape, and using stats to decide the best course of action.

    "Dusty destroys arms"
    Most peoples default argument against him. Hard to believe someone would actually take a cities excuse for losing pitchers as a fact. This is the same city that believed one foul ball ruined their chances for a world series. Especially when Mark Prior came out publicly and said it wasnt Dustys fault. Then we get the people who tell us to look at the fact that we have had pitchers on the DL this year. If we were the only team that had this issue, then maybe i would believe you. but when asked about the amount of other pitchers who have spent time on the DL in the past 3-5 years, most "Dusty haters" wont change their tune.

    "Dusty costs us close games"
    just look at our teams RISP in those games and tell me who's fault it is.


    There are plenty more, but i'm getting tired of typing. The fact is, Dusty doesnt really do much. We have pitching coaches who work with pitchers (Blaming dusty for a pitchers issues), Hitting coaches who work with hitters (Blaming dusty for batters not hitting the ball), a man above dusty who is responsible for the players in the dugout (People actually blaming dusty for trades not being made and players not being brought up. I'm serious, ive heard this a few times). There was even a person who blamed dusty for cueto being sick.

    Dusty does mess up, and he has made mistakes, we all do. But to blame him for every single issue on this team shows a lack of baseball knowledge. Blame the batters for not making contact. Blame the major league pitchers for not being able to throw a strike and do their only job. Blame the closer for blowing games. Blame the hitting coach for players not being able to bunt, or for players having the same broken swing for months. A managers job is way overhyped and he doesnt do much besides be a punching bag.
    Logical, well thought out posts like this are not welcome by the Bash Dusty clowns on Sun Deck. They would probably be here crying about your post but my guess is that they are over in the game thread whining about tonight's lineup.

  5. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Virginia Beach
    Posts
    300

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Some of this is true but...

    Renteria bats 2nd nearly every time he plays. Stupidity.

    He will play a guy based on "match ups." This has included a guy being 2-4 or 4-7 or some small sample size against a certain pitcher instead of just playing the better or hotter player more frequently.

    He doesn't reralize how bad guys like BP and Stubbs are against righies but yet he led Stubbs off most of the year and bats BP cleanup no matter what, so his "match up" talk doesn't hold water.

    Alot of things are not Dusty's fault but he sure is an absolute moron. Ask Giants and Cubs fans. Ok forget the Cubs. :-)

    P.S. Corey Patterson playing at all, Janish also batting 2nd, etc and so forth.

  6. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    119

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Quote Originally Posted by CWRed View Post
    Some of this is true but...

    Renteria bats 2nd nearly every time he plays. Stupidity.

    He will play a guy based on "match ups." This has included a guy being 2-4 or 4-7 or some small sample size against a certain pitcher instead of just playing the better or hotter player more frequently.

    He doesn't reralize how bad guys like BP and Stubbs are against righies but yet he led Stubbs off most of the year and bats BP cleanup no matter what, so his "match up" talk doesn't hold water.

    Alot of things are not Dusty's fault but he sure is an absolute moron. Ask Giants and Cubs fans. Ok forget the Cubs. :-)

    P.S. Corey Patterson playing at all, Janish also batting 2nd, etc and so forth.
    a lot of the matchup material i have seen is going against the type of pitcher (mainly fastball, mainly breaking ball, etc..) and who else would you bat at cleanup? everyone cried for bruce to be there, but then got mad at dusty when that didnt work. Rolen has been a DP machine this year. who do you think honestly would improve that spot?

  7. #6
    throws 106. NBD.
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    1,193

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Quote Originally Posted by Skreep View Post
    a lot of the matchup material i have seen is going against the type of pitcher (mainly fastball, mainly breaking ball, etc..) and who else would you bat at cleanup? everyone cried for bruce to be there, but then got mad at dusty when that didnt work. Rolen has been a DP machine this year. who do you think honestly would improve that spot?
    I'd stick Frazier there for the rest of the season. Move BP up to 2nd and drop Janish/Renteria down to 8th.

  8. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    South Charleston, Ohio
    Posts
    413

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    I don't bash Dusty, but ignoring the stupid decisions he makes is not something I am willing to do. Paul Janish should never ever, ever, ever, ever bat 2nd in any lineup. I wouldn't hit Janish second on my beer league softball team.

  9. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    119

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Quote Originally Posted by justincredible View Post
    I'd stick Frazier there for the rest of the season. Move BP up to 2nd and drop Janish/Renteria down to 8th.
    i dont know what to say to that. you dont want Renteria there, but you're fine with someone batting .237 there? yea, he hits for a little power, but wouldnt you want that a little farther up in the lineup since we dont have a dependable leadoff batter?

  10. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    654

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    how about a squeeze play with a 2-2 count is that OK also to think the scoreboard is incorrect

  11. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    119

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Quote Originally Posted by nux fan View Post
    how about a squeeze play with a 2-2 count is that OK also to think the scoreboard is incorrect
    with the way this team is hitting? i dont fault him for trying it. no one would expect it, kind of like the spanish inquistion

  12. #11
    Member CrosleyField's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    175

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Neutral on Dusty. I do think he is criticized too much. I posted the other day about double switches. Its the national league its going to happen. He gets criticized for playing not playing small ball and when he does bunt he gets criticized for giving up outs. Can't win with the fans.

    My real complaint is pitching. Two years ago the 18 inning game against the Padres he pitched Harang and Volquez with little or no rest over four innings each. probably should have let an outfielder pitch and called it a day. Harang never recovered that year.

    I despise Renteria, but that is another story.

  13. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    119

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Quote Originally Posted by CrosleyField View Post
    Neutral on Dusty. I do think he is criticized too much. I posted the other day about double switches. Its the national league its going to happen. He gets criticized for playing not playing small ball and when he does bunt he gets criticized for giving up outs. Can't win with the fans.

    My real complaint is pitching. Two years ago the 18 inning game against the Padres he pitched Harang and Volquez with little or no rest over four innings each. probably should have let an outfielder pitch and called it a day. Harang never recovered that year.

    I despise Renteria, but that is another story.
    i have mixed feelings about that game with harang pitching. Harang offered to pitch, but he was never the same after that. Plus, the amount of crap he got for "giving up" in the phillies game this year would have been the same thing.

  14. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Hamilton, OH
    Posts
    62

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Quote Originally Posted by CrosleyField View Post
    Neutral on Dusty. I do think he is criticized too much. I posted the other day about double switches. Its the national league its going to happen. He gets criticized for playing not playing small ball and when he does bunt he gets criticized for giving up outs. Can't win with the fans.

    My real complaint is pitching. Two years ago the 18 inning game against the Padres he pitched Harang and Volquez with little or no rest over four innings each. probably should have let an outfielder pitch and called it a day. Harang never recovered that year.

    I despise Renteria, but that is another story.
    Saw David Weathers yelling and throwing things a couple of years ago in the bullpen in a tie game because in an obvious bunt situation Dusty had a weak hitter not bunting. He yelled rather loudly towards the dugout, "Bunt him! That's bad baseball!" It was hilarious!

  15. #14
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    119

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    Quote Originally Posted by dthomas24 View Post
    Saw David Weathers yelling and throwing things a couple of years ago in the bullpen in a tie game because in an obvious bunt situation Dusty had a weak hitter not bunting. He yelled rather loudly towards the dugout, "Bunt him! That's bad baseball!" It was hilarious!
    bringing david weathers into a game was bad baseball. my wife would leave the room if he came into a game

  16. #15
    Retro-Gamer Krawhitham's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    1,719

    Re: Do people always cry about Dusty here too?

    This team has a +32 run differential, with that run differential and an average manager they should be 7 games over .500

    Anything above the pythagorean expectation you credit to a good manager, anything below is a bad manager

    The Reds are 5 games under .500, that is a 12 swing from pythagorean expectation. Dusty is not the worse manager but he is by no means a good or even average manager

    In 18 years he has won a grand total of 1 Pennant, In 18 years his teams have finish in 1st place just 4 times and 2 of them were powered by Baroid.

    Two starters the other night were 30 or older, BP and Hernandez. Two of our best players. a majority were in the mid 20's.
    It is not like he had many other options, But people are talking about Gomes over Hi-C, Patterson over younger guys, Taveras over younger guys, Rolen over anyone who could swing a bat with full motion

    "Dusty always benches a guy after he has a good game"
    And he does you admit that, you have play the hot hand most sample sizes for BVP are too small to make a good judgment. Who cares if someone is 0-4 vs a pitcher, if the hitter goes 2-2 he is suddenly a .333 hitter vs the pitcher. It does take some guys more at bats before feeling comfortable against a pitcher. But all 0-4 means is the pitcher either had a good day or the hitter had a bad day, it does not mean the hitter will always struggle against him

    "Dusty destroys arms"
    Have you seen the bullpen lately? He has wore them to the bone. And destroy is such a terminate term, some pitchers are just side lined for a few years like Harang & Wood. He did destroy Prior arm and the jury is still out on EV

    "Dusty costs us close games"
    just look at our teams RISP in those games and tell me who's fault it is.
    Who hired the hitting coach, who makes out the lineup. Why do most players over time do worse on RISP the more time the spend around dusty and his coaches?


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25