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Thread: SEC Football Discussion Thread

  1. #841
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Cedric View Post
    Luckily for you we all know how incompetent and void of integrity the NCAA is. They botch everything and will surely botch this. We also know that nobody closes ranks and covers cheating like Auburn and other SEC schools. They have plenty of practice.
    Yes. That is why Alabama has spent roughly two decades on probation and has been forced to vacate 29 wins since the early 90's-because the SEC is so good at covering their cheating.

    Listen Cedric, either come with some actual substance or at least be honest and admit you've formed a biased opinion and will not be swayed regardless of reality or fact.
    Last edited by jojo; 04-04-2013 at 10:39 PM.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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  3. #842
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Where there's smoke, there's fire. History repeats itself. Terry Bowden laughs!

    We will see. Auburn (Cam, baby) seems to be good at covering tracks. Some smart people there (of course not the athletes with bad grades). Right now it is just a report. Almost seems tough to prove something like changing grades or asst. coaches handing money to players. All words out of mouths of former players. Wonder why these former players seem hell bent on bringing down their former team? Especially if it is untrue. Perhaps there is a Terry Bowden thing related to these former players (screwed by the one that used to feed you). For those who do not know about Bowden... he was coach there and got fired b/c certain powers-to-be did not care for him. He led them to an undefeated season (while on probation, not his doing). Maybe these former players got screwed by AU... not given the money/girls/grades they were promised? Just speculation. But there is a lot of smoke in the southern parts of Alabama. As there has been many times in the past.
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Headline
    ESPN’s Auburn Synthetic Reefer Madness Report Has Some Major Flaws
    http://www.thebiglead.com/index.php/...ce=top-modules
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  5. #844
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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by RedFanAlways1966 View Post
    Where there's smoke, there's fire. History repeats itself. Terry Bowden laughs!

    We will see. Auburn (Cam, baby) seems to be good at covering tracks. Some smart people there (of course not the athletes with bad grades). Right now it is just a report. Almost seems tough to prove something like changing grades or asst. coaches handing money to players. All words out of mouths of former players. Wonder why these former players seem hell bent on bringing down their former team? Especially if it is untrue. Perhaps there is a Terry Bowden thing related to these former players (screwed by the one that used to feed you). For those who do not know about Bowden... he was coach there and got fired b/c certain powers-to-be did not care for him. He led them to an undefeated season (while on probation, not his doing). Maybe these former players got screwed by AU... not given the money/girls/grades they were promised? Just speculation. But there is a lot of smoke in the southern parts of Alabama. As there has been many times in the past.
    Where there is smoke there is smoke. There's a reason that the Smokey Mountains aren't called the On fire Mountains.

    It's intellectually lazy at best to argue smoke=fact. It's often just obfuscation in lieu of substantiating a claim.

    What former players are hellbent on bringing down Auburn? Most of the players Roberts named have vehemently denied that she accurately quoted them. Even McNeil won't substantiate Roberts' blog story-he was asked several times yesterday by reporters to do so. Again-lets stick to facts not impressions of headlines. The lawyers for McNeil and his partners tried to make this about a drug culture during the grand jury phase. McNeil is trying to stay out of prison. Roberts is trying to use McNeil as proof that an Auburn Football Secret Society exists and insidiously controls all branches of the government to enrich the athletic department. Reasonable people actually entertain this story?

    But then those that actually care to look at the facts concerning Auburn quickly realize that there really isn't even alot of smoke but mostly poofers echoing on the blogoshere.....(i.e. what many want to call smoke doesn't even stand the test of fact/accuracy). I heard Mike and Mike today describe Roberts blog story as the "Auburn cheating scandal". There is no Auburn cheating scandal. Those guys were editorializing about an issue for which their opinions were grossly uninformed.

    Seriously anyone who knows anything about Will M, would gag with laughter upon hearing a story about him embracing a player after a bad practice and handing the player $400 to perk him up. It would be more believable that Muschamp grabbed McNeil by his dreadlocks and planted his nose square into a tackling dummy.

    The local police and judges are conspiring with Chizik to railroad McNeil to deflect attention from Cam and apparently Chizik targeted McNeil because Chizik is a racist and doesn't like dredlocks? Seriously Mike and Mike-that didn't seem like something to question? I doubt they even read Roberts' blog. In fact I know there is no way they could have given their superficial treatment.

    And that's the point. Alot of this smoke is echoes across the internet of people editorializing about something they really aren't familiar with or qualified to discuss factually.

    BTW, grade changes are extremely easy to verify because there is a rock solid paper trail. There's probably a good reason that Roberts decided to take McNeil's word rather than do some simple checking. Literally a grade change is time stamped, it is crystal clear which administrator made the change and incredibly easy to find the justification.

    But ya, you're "just speculation" speaks volumes (and this isn't a commentary directed at you) because it's very easy to speculate anything. It's even easier than a scout dreaming on a high school pitcher because at least the pitcher generally has some stuff.

    For instance, OSU got nailed after the NCAA poked into emails and records etc. We know for a fact there was fire generating the smoke at OSU-its' factually documented. It's very easy to speculate that OSU got off easy though because they had plently of time to completely erase all evidence of the truly big, bad stuff that was going on and to thus cauterize the wounds. It's possible that the athletic department was providing high class call girls to recruits. This is leagal in Las Vegas and OSU has a jet plane that could easily be used to fly them back and forth. I could imagine that OSU bought several houses for the parents of their star players. There might even be a subdivision in Columbus, a gated community of illegal gift houses if you will. College football is big business and OSU constantly battles their rivals Michigan and PSU for the top recruits. They also seem to be branching out into non-traditional recruiting waters so surely they are outbidding all of those other cheating schools in the "where there is smoke there is fire hotbeds" like Mobile. Why would a recruit go to OSU for free when Georgia, Bama, Auburn and LSU are handing out $200,000 checks? Heck OSU brought in a mastermind of the "cheaters too smart to get caught" from the SEC to be their coach! But why wouldn't any of this be easy to trace by follwoing a money trail? Well obviously it's because the OSU athletic department is funding this through orchestrating a cocaine dealing ring. They guys getting the free tattos? They were really selling the cocaine and the tatoo shop was the front for the OSU recruiting program. This goes deep as it's likely local politicians, judges and police officers are somehow involved in the coverup. That's how OSU was able to hide everything because they got plenty of advanced warning.

    See how easy but unfair it is?
    Last edited by jojo; 04-05-2013 at 10:14 AM.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    Thousands of people at Auburn have been paid and continue to get paid biweekly and monthly.

    But if you want to talk about something that happened in the early 90's as part of a probe into my objectivity, i'd say the discussion actually says much more about you and it also ignores just about every contribution I've made to a discussion about Auburn on redszone.

    But ya, Auburn has a culture of changing grades but wouldn't let a 5 star prospect into school because they didn't like an English grade he had gotten and Auburn suspended a player accused of armed robbery as way to deflect attention from Cam. It's all perfectly logical.
    Have any football players at Auburn been paid illegally by boosters.

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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Gack View Post
    Have any football players at Auburn been paid illegally by boosters.
    I have no knowledge of any such payments. Do you?

    Have any football players at OSU been paid illegally by boosters?
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    I have no knowledge of any such payments. Do you?

    Have any football players at OSU been paid illegally by boosters?
    I'm asking you believe at any point they've been paid. I don't want you to show me proof. I'm just asking, in your personal opinion, if you believe Auburn football players have ever been 'paid' to play football at Auburn.

  9. #848
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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Gack View Post
    I'm asking you believe at any point they've been paid. I don't want you to show me proof. I'm just asking, in your personal opinion, if you believe Auburn football players have ever been 'paid' to play football at Auburn.
    In the history of Auburn football?

    Im sure some have.

    Now what is your point again?
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  10. #849
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    But ya you're "just speculation" speaks volumes.
    And a true AU fan who lives in intellectual reality is willing to admit that the crap happens (and happens at lots of places). It speaks volumes about those who pretend is does not happen or truly believe it does not happen. Tell us about the history of cheating at AU or the fact that AU running back James Brooks was illiterate yet never ineligible (FACTS... don't you love it?). I am an avid Ohio State supporter, but I know damn well crap happens there too. I live in the real world (me gots intellects) and I am not blinded by my support.

    This is a MESSAGE BOARD. Opinions are given. Like the DH in the NL. A lot of things are opinion. This next AU story is in the sports headlines. It will be discussed and opinions are given on a message board, radio and TV. Got a problem with that... welcome to reality (imagine that). Your dedication and blind(?) loyalty is appreciated lol.
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    In the history of Auburn football?

    Im sure some have.

    Now what is your point again?
    Why did you have to make it so difficult?

    I'm just asking if you actually believe any football players at AU ever been paid. I'm not trying to put down Auburn for trying to pay Newton. I'm just amused that you think the most overrated player in the NFL probably wasn't paid at Auburn. Maybe you are that naive.

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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Gack View Post
    Why did you have to make it so difficult?

    I'm just asking if you actually believe any football players at AU ever been paid. I'm not trying to put down Auburn for trying to pay Newton. I'm just amused that you think the most overrated player in the NFL probably wasn't paid at Auburn. Maybe you are that naive.
    Maybe if the NCAA hadn't exhaustively investigated this very point, I wouldn't conclude that Cam's recruitment was legal.

    But since the NCAA did exhaustively investigate this very point, you have a very high bar to overcome when arguing that Cam was paid. You also have to admit you have zero factual basis supporting your conclusion.

    Then again maybe you are that cynically biased?
    Last edited by jojo; 04-05-2013 at 10:48 AM.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  14. #852
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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by RedFanAlways1966 View Post
    It speaks volumes about those who pretend is does not happen or truly believe it does not happen.
    It speaks volumes that you keep trying to kick strawmen in the nads.

    Quote Originally Posted by RedFanAlways1966 View Post
    This is a MESSAGE BOARD. Opinions are given. Like the DH in the NL. A lot of things are opinion. This next AU story is in the sports headlines. It will be discussed and opinions are given on a message board, radio and TV. Got a problem with that... welcome to reality (imagine that). Your dedication and blind(?) loyalty is appreciated lol.
    This is a message board. Opinions are given. And poorly constructed, unsubstantiated opinions are revealed as being just that-invalid and not equal to ones based upon fact.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  15. #853
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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    And I'd just like to point out the Red Elephant in Auburn's closet.... Auburn's 2012 does not happen if a coaching staff has created a "culture of fear" like Roberts alledges and "controls its players too much".
    Here's an even bigger "Red Elephant" in my mind: Chizik won a national championship 2 years ago and is currently unemployed.
    When all is said and done more is said than done.

  16. #854
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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by dabvu2498 View Post
    Here's an even bigger "Red Elephant" in my mind: Chizik won a national championship 2 years ago and is currently unemployed.
    Thats pretty easy to explain. I don't think Chizik can create a culture where players develop and excel.

    He inherited a culture and added some key parts but after 2010 there was an exodus of "cultural memory" as the upperclassman left. Coupled with the Tubby bubble (his last two very poor recruiting classes) there was a void in leadership by example and Chizik's way of doing business wasn't compensating. This really exposed Chizik's weaknesses as a HC. Great DC. Not great HC.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  17. #855
    On the brink wolfboy's Avatar
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    Re: SEC Football Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    I have no knowledge of any such payments. Do you?

    Have any football players at OSU been paid illegally by boosters?
    No.

    http://now.msn.com/maurice-clarett-s...o-state-to-ufl
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