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View Poll Results: What's Next for Masset

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  • 8th inning duty in 2012

    12 26.67%
  • Replace Cordero as Closer in 2012

    0 0%
  • Platoon Closer in 2012

    1 2.22%
  • 7th inning or earlier in 2012

    14 31.11%
  • Don't resign in 2012

    18 40.00%
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Thread: Nick Masset: What's Next?

  1. #16
    Member Superdude's Avatar
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    Masset's career peripherals are eerily similar to his 2011. The one exception is his BABIP which is around .025 higher this year (.336) than over his career (.311.) I'd guess that it's likely his "real" BABIP is right around .300 (like it is for more pitchers) so if he returns to that level of BABIP next year, it will seem like he's a better pitcher.

    The best thing he could do peripheral-wise is cut down on the walks.
    His career totals are factoring in over 100 pretty sloppy innings earlier in his career. Masset's clearly taken a step back from what we've come to expect, BABIP or not.

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  3. #17
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    I'd keep him, but I'd put him in the type of role that Arredondo was in this year. Not high leverage sitautions.

  4. #18
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Nick has some filthy stuff when he's on. Simply put, he's had a bad year. I certainly don't give up on the guy. With the year he's had, his arbitration numbers should be pretty small I'd think. If it turns out he struggles next year, pull the plug on him for a while. But of all the relievers this year, he's had the most consistent struggles all year.

    In the second half, Logan & Billy have struggled too. But I'm completely chalking that up to heavy usage in the first 2 months of the year. The starters were imploding regularly. Leake was bad enough to be pushed to the pen, Wood & Volquez were bad enough to be sent to AAA, Bronson was bad all year, Cueto & Bailey were hurt and being replaced. That's a ton of innings for the pen to have to cover for. IMO, the results of the pen in the second half can be laid squarely at the feet of the starters in the first half.

    The only reliever I see that needs to be replaced next year is Chapman, but that's only because I want to see him stretched out for the rotation (either in AAA or with the Reds).

    LeCure proved himself to be very reliable as a long man, so he stays in that role.

    Bray was very solid most all year long as the lefty specialist. I think he should be used in a wider variety of situations though. Longer stints, fewer games.

    Arredondo was pretty steady all year but also pretty sub-par. But being another year away from TJ is a good thing. I leave him in a set-up role.

    Ondrusek was pretty much automatic in the first half this year, but was pretty much abused by the starters' ineffectiveness. A normal workload with some regular rest and I think he'll rebound nicely. I count on him as a very solid set-up guy.

    Cordero I bring back. Period. He wants to be here, and we need a closer. I know alot of people here thought Masset was the next closer, but with the year he just had...I bring back Coco for a short term contract. He may not be pretty, but he gets the job done more often than not. His K rate has gone down steadily, but he's also being more effective. I'll take that declining K rate.

    As for the rest of the pen...mix and match. As usual, just go with the hot hand at the time. Smith, Burton, Horst, Fisher, Boxberger, etc, etc. If Masset struggles again, pull someone from L'ville. But for now, keep him.
    2014 predictions:
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  5. #19
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Quote Originally Posted by Superdude View Post
    His career totals are factoring in over 100 pretty sloppy innings earlier in his career. Masset's clearly taken a step back from what we've come to expect, BABIP or not.
    I don't know what "we" expected but "I'm" unsurprised by his season.

    I don't think he's taken a step back nor is it "clear" that he's done so. I think this is the pitcher he his: highish K, high BB, low HR pitcher. It's still a useful piece of the bullpen given correct usage.

    Give him Cordero's BABIP this season and he'd look a lot like Mitchell Boggs or Wilton Lopez. Cut down on the walks a bit AND give him that BABIP and you'd basically have Heath Bell.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  6. #20
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Wow. I can't believe how many people want to let him walk.

    Yes, he had a rough year, particularly in high leverage situations, but he still put decent numbers. I don't know if he's tipping or just unlucky, but no way to I cut one of the pitchers we've got who can legitimately miss bats. That's just stupid. In fact, I'd happily bet that Masset will outpitch Cordero next year.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  7. #21
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    He's not gonna get much as an early stage arb. player. Bring him back on a cheap 1 yr deal.

  8. #22
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    I'm for bringing him back in a reduced role and hopefully he can fight his way back into the 8th inning. But I'm looking for help in the meantime.
    2015 Rotation: Cueto, Latos, Bailey, Leake, Cingrani

  9. #23
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    Wow. I can't believe how many people want to let him walk.

    Yes, he had a rough year, particularly in high leverage situations, but he still put decent numbers. I don't know if he's tipping or just unlucky, but no way to I cut one of the pitchers we've got who can legitimately miss bats. That's just stupid. In fact, I'd happily bet that Masset will outpitch Cordero next year.
    If he accepts the same salary he got this year, fine. But his production should be easy to replace for close to league minimum. No way I go to arbitration with him.

    And saying he'd be better than Cordero is like saying he'd be funnier than Dane Cook.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

  10. #24
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    In fact, I'd happily bet that Masset will outpitch Cordero next year.
    He said at the beginning of the 2011 season.

    Masset lost 4 out of the first 5 games of the season. That's a hard thing to forget.
    The widow is gathering nettles for her children's dinner; a perfumed seigneur, delicately lounging in the Oeil de Boeuf, hath an alchemy whereby he will extract the third nettle and call it rent. ~ Carlyle

  11. #25
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Quote Originally Posted by mdccclxix View Post
    I'm for bringing him back in a reduced role and hopefully he can fight his way back into the 8th inning. But I'm looking for help in the meantime.
    That sounds about right. But if we let CoCo walk and make Chapman a starter, we're in need of an eighth inning guy and a closer. BP needs a serious re-boot.
    The widow is gathering nettles for her children's dinner; a perfumed seigneur, delicately lounging in the Oeil de Boeuf, hath an alchemy whereby he will extract the third nettle and call it rent. ~ Carlyle

  12. #26
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    I don't know what "we" expected but "I'm" unsurprised by his season.

    I don't think he's taken a step back nor is it "clear" that he's done so. I think this is the pitcher he his: highish K, high BB, low HR pitcher. It's still a useful piece of the bullpen given correct usage.

    Give him Cordero's BABIP this season and he'd look a lot like Mitchell Boggs or Wilton Lopez. Cut down on the walks a bit AND give him that BABIP and you'd basically have Heath Bell.
    No offense, but I could give a flying fig what his BABIP is.

    All I know is that whenever he comes into the game, I never feel likevthe other team won't score. In fact, I feel like there's a fifty-fifty chance that they will. I don't mind that in a middle reliever getting league minimum, but don't want that in a late inning reliever getting arbitration money.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

  13. #27
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    I don't know what "we" expected but "I'm" unsurprised by his season.

    I don't think he's taken a step back nor is it "clear" that he's done so. I think this is the pitcher he his: highish K, high BB, low HR pitcher. It's still a useful piece of the bullpen given correct usage.
    His xFIP ballooned from 3.27 to 3.84, and the fact that most of that decline stemmed from his K rate is somewhat concerning. I had him pegged as a solid heir apparent to Cordero, but after Masset's struggles, I'm not feeling overly optimistic about the back end of the bullpen. Come on Boxberger!

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    Give him Cordero's BABIP this season and he'd look a lot like Mitchell Boggs or Wilton Lopez. Cut down on the walks a bit AND give him that BABIP and you'd basically have Heath Bell.
    I think I could have put up a pretty nice season with Cordero's BABIP.

  14. #28
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    No offense, but I could give a flying fig what his BABIP is.
    It contributes more to the explanation of his season than ERA, WHIP and seasonal splits thereof.

    All I know is that whenever he comes into the game, I never feel likevthe other team won't score. In fact, I feel like there's a fifty-fifty chance that they will. I don't mind that in a middle reliever getting league minimum, but don't want that in a late inning reliever getting arbitration money.
    Great!

    I'm not talking about "emotional response," I'm talking about individual production.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  15. #29
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Quote Originally Posted by Superdude View Post
    His xFIP ballooned from 3.27 to 3.84, and the fact that most of that decline stemmed from his K rate is somewhat concerning.
    I don't think it's a decline as much as a regression to the mean. That is to say, I don't think he got worse, I simply think the numbers "caught up" with him.

    I had him pegged as a solid heir apparent to Cordero, but after Masset's struggles, I'm not feeling overly optimistic about the back end of the bullpen. Come on Boxberger!
    Well, I'll leave your expectations up to you. I still think he's a useful piece.

    I think I could have put up a pretty nice season with Cordero's BABIP.
    Nick Masset with normal BABIP = Blake Wood of the Royals.
    Nick Masset with an otherwordly BABIP = Neftali Feliz.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

  16. #30
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    Re: Nick Masset: What's Next?

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    Great!

    I'm not talking about "emotional response," I'm talking about individual production.
    My emotional response is based on Masset's production.

    This season, he has given up a run in 1 out of every 4 games he has pitched in. It wasn't much better the year before: 1 in 5 games.

    That's terrible for a late inning guy. It's marginally passable for a middle reliever. Late inning relievers should be close to automatic if you want your team to contend.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.


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