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Thread: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

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    All work and no play..... Vottomatic's Avatar
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    What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    I think we can all agree that this current Reds offense is good enough with the potential to be better next year as guys mature and reach their potential. Health is always an issue.

    Starting pitching is really what this team needs. I'd even say the bullpen needs bolstering.

    I've started this thread for some potential deals that could be made. Obviously the Reds can't acquire Halladay, Lee, Hamels, Lincecum, Kershaw, Sabathia, etc. But what teams would consider a trade for their quality starters? Any ideas? The season is over and this could make for some fun discussion.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    I just don't see anyone out there via trade being available that would be a significant upgrade over what we have and what we would have to part with. I think the path to take is to find a quality hitter.

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    Retro-Gamer Krawhitham's Avatar
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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    the offense not being consistent is the problem

    they will score 42 runs in 4 games then 15 runs for 10 games. They average 4+ runs a game but they go 6-8 over the 14 games


    The Reds have had 89 quality starts this season. They also had 89 QS last season

    Most it not all the Reds pitching issues are Arroyo & EV. Without those two the team ERA is 3.87. Arroyo has a good chance of bouncing back (he has an offseason regimen set up to try to regain his fastball) , EV will not be a Red next season

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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    The team just strikes out too much, that makes it hard to be consistent. It isn't just Stubbs either, it's up and down the lineup. I don't see that changing.

    For the right deal I could see Tampa trading Shields. We'd have to give up some good talent though.

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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    Quote Originally Posted by Krawhitham View Post
    the offense not being consistent is the problem

    they will score 42 runs in 4 games then 15 runs for 10 games. They average 4+ runs a game but they go 6-8 over the 14 games


    The Reds have had 89 quality starts this season. They also had 89 QS last season

    Most it not all the Reds pitching issues are Arroyo & EV. Without those two the team ERA is 3.87. Arroyo has a good chance of bouncing back (he has an offseason regimen set up to try to regain his fastball) , EV will not be a Red next season
    Good stat.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

    "Man do I miss the days where were didn't need a calculator and an encyclopedia of baseball metrics to enjoy a baseball game ... - MikeS21" - 8/2/12 game thread

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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stray View Post
    The team just strikes out too much, that makes it hard to be consistent. It isn't just Stubbs either, it's up and down the lineup. I don't see that changing.

    For the right deal I could see Tampa trading Shields. We'd have to give up some good talent though.
    I wouldn't mind having Shields, but to me TB would be sheer idiots to deal him. You don't find pitchers like him that often and at a reasonable contract.

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    All work and no play..... Vottomatic's Avatar
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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    I read somewhere, a good analysis that said Tampa has some good starting pitching in their minors, and that management considers and favors Price and Hellickson as their top 2 starters. Davis, Niemann and Moore are all young up and comers, and Shields is about 30 years old. They have 7 players arbitration eligible. They have options on Shields for '12 thru '14 but he is about to become expensive. They also have positional needs to fill that Shields could help them obtain. Upton is about to become expensive as he is arb eligible. They also have options on Shoppach, Zobrist. Longoria, Wade Davis that all amount to pay increases. Their $42M payroll is about to balloon $10 or $20M and ownership wants to keep it down while filling their holes in the lineup.

    Look for Shields to be dealt in the offseason unless the Rays can't get fair return.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

    "Man do I miss the days where were didn't need a calculator and an encyclopedia of baseball metrics to enjoy a baseball game ... - MikeS21" - 8/2/12 game thread

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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    I say we make it known that Votto & Stubbs are available and see what becomes available.

    Someone might be foolish enough to think Stubbs is going to figure it out and partnering a bona fide stud in Votto with a bona fide dud in Stubbs might net us someone like David Price.

    I feel like Alonzo at first would give you somewhere between 90 and 100 RBI. If you consider that you may be able to add a starter that allows 1 fewer run per start than the slot he replaces, then that is 33 fewer runs you have to make up. The difference between Votto & Alonzo then becomes a wash.

    Then, you Give Heisey & Sappelt left & center.

    Those 2 would be less defensively, but both of them combined would equal the strike out total of Stubbs.

    If Heisey were just given left field like Gomes was and allowed to have 600 at bats......30 homers.

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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    Problem with trading Votto is you will never get equal value in return since any team getting him knows they won't have him that long.

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    ZCTRMTP!!!!! texasdave's Avatar
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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    Arroyo has a good chance of bouncing back (he has an offseason regimen set up to try to regain his fastball).
    There is this guy who goes by the name of Father Time. He also has this off-season regimen. It is a very effective regimen. Works just about every time. Good luck, Bronson.

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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    Erik Bedard (33)
    Mark Buehrle (33)
    Chris Capuano (33)
    Bruce Chen (35)
    Bartolo Colon (39)
    Aaron Cook (33) - $11MM mutual option with a $500K buyout
    Kyle Davies (28)
    Doug Davis (36)
    Ryan Dempster (35) - $14MM player option, no buyout
    Zach Duke (29) - $5.5MM club option with a $750K buyout
    Jeff Francis (30)
    Freddy Garcia (36)
    Jon Garland (32) - $8MM club option with a $500K buyout
    Aaron Harang (34) - $5MM mutual option with a $500K buyout
    Rich Harden (30)
    Livan Hernandez (37)
    Hisashi Iwakuma (31)
    Edwin Jackson (28)
    Kenshin Kawakami (37)
    Scott Kazmir (28) - $13.5MM club option with a $2.5MM buyout
    Hiroki Kuroda (37)
    Rodrigo Lopez (36)
    Paul Maholm (30) - $9.75MM club option with a $750K buyout
    Jason Marquis (33)
    Kevin Millwood (37)
    Sergio Mitre (31)
    Roy Oswalt (34) - $16MM mutual option with a $2MM buyout
    Brad Penny (34)
    Oliver Perez (30)
    Joel Pineiro (33)
    C.C. Sabathia (31) - may opt out of remaining four years, $92MM
    Javier Vazquez (35)
    Tsuyoshi Wada (31)
    Adam Wainwright (30) - $10MM*vesting option for '12, $12MM for '13*
    Tim Wakefield (45)
    Chien-Ming Wang (32)
    Brandon Webb (33)
    Dontrelle Willis (30)
    C.J. Wilson (31)

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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    the list i just posted are all the 2012 free agent starting pitchers.

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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    Quote Originally Posted by texasdave View Post
    There is this guy who goes by the name of Father Time. He also has this off-season regimen. It is a very effective regimen. Works just about every time. Good luck, Bronson.
    If Bronson was a power pitcher I would agree, but he is not. As Jamie Moyer showed, with the style of pitcher Bronson is, he could have a very nice career into his 40's.

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    ZCTRMTP!!!!! texasdave's Avatar
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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    Quote Originally Posted by brm7675 View Post
    If Bronson was a power pitcher I would agree, but he is not. As Jamie Moyer showed, with the style of pitcher Bronson is, he could have a very nice career into his 40's.
    People always bring this up. And for what reason I have no idea. If Bronson really is another Jamie Moyer, and he is not, then why did losing 1 MPH on his fastball so negatively affecting his pitching? And why is Bronson setting up a regimen already and being so gung-ho in his approach to get that 1 MPH on his fastball back? Good questions, I know. Obviously, Bronson feels he needs that extra bit of oomph on his cheese. Maybe you should get in touch with him and tell him he doesn't need to relax and enjoy his off-season. Tell him that he is another Jamie Moyer and relax. That will work.

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    Re: What QUALITY starting pitchers are obtainable by trade or free agency?

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfan1995 View Post
    Erik Bedard (33) - way overrated
    Mark Buehrle (33) - Sox would never part with him
    Chris Capuano (33) - Not that much better then what we have
    Bruce Chen (35) - Really?
    Bartolo Colon (39) - Please stop
    Aaron Cook (33) - $11MM mutual option with a $500K buyout
    Kyle Davies (28)
    Doug Davis (36)
    Ryan Dempster (35) - $14MM player option, no buyout
    Zach Duke (29) - $5.5MM club option with a $750K buyout
    Jeff Francis (30)
    Freddy Garcia (36)
    Jon Garland (32) - $8MM club option with a $500K buyout
    Aaron Harang (34) - $5MM mutual option with a $500K buyout
    Rich Harden (30)
    Livan Hernandez (37)
    Hisashi Iwakuma (31)
    Edwin Jackson (28)
    Kenshin Kawakami (37)
    Scott Kazmir (28) - $13.5MM club option with a $2.5MM buyout
    Hiroki Kuroda (37)
    Rodrigo Lopez (36)
    Paul Maholm (30) - $9.75MM club option with a $750K buyout
    Jason Marquis (33)
    Kevin Millwood (37)
    Sergio Mitre (31)
    Roy Oswalt (34) - $16MM mutual option with a $2MM buyout
    Brad Penny (34)
    Oliver Perez (30)
    Joel Pineiro (33)
    C.C. Sabathia (31) - may opt out of remaining four years, $92MM
    Javier Vazquez (35)
    Tsuyoshi Wada (31)
    Adam Wainwright (30) - $10MM*vesting option for '12, $12MM for '13*
    Tim Wakefield (45)
    Chien-Ming Wang (32)
    Brandon Webb (33)
    Dontrelle Willis (30)
    C.J. Wilson (31)
    There isn't 1 pitcher on that list that I would give up much for..


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