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Thread: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

  1. #1
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    A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    ESPN's Jason Churchill speculates that Oakland could shop Gio Gonzalez in exchange for some offense this winter.
    The news should be taken with a grain of salt, as Gonzalez is coming off a season in which he finished ninth in the American League with 197 strikeouts and fourth in strikeouts per nine innings. If they A's were to sell high on his value, it would largely be due to the fact that he's arbitration eligible as a Super Two qualifier. The Rockies and Marlins are currently being thrown around as landing spots, with Logan Morrison being linked as a possible trading chip. Morrison fell out of favor with the Marlins last month when he filed grievance for what he believed was a wrongful demotion.

    If he is available then I want him more than Shields.

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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    Alonso for Gonzalez makes sense for both sides, IMO.
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
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  4. #3
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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    Not too sure. I think they have a few guys at the first base position in Daric Barton, Brandon Allen and Chris Carter. However, I don't think any are as good as Yonder.

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    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    I'm a skeptic where Gonzalez is concerned. High walk rate and and his HR/FB rate would go way up from the comfy AL West to the little league parks in the NL Central. Somehow I suspect if he and Volquez traded places, Volquez stat line would look a lot like Gio's and Gio's would look like EV's. He's worth pursuing in a reasonable deal, but I'd rather have Shields.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

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    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    People sure seem to have a thing for guys that have trouble throwing strikes. He'd be a nice addition, but if we're going for an upside, somebody who can really anchor the staff, he's not it.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    It's because there aren't any true aces available. So you have to consider the guys who are available.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

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    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vottomatic View Post
    It's because there aren't any true aces available. So you have to consider the guys who are available.
    I get it, but I wouldn't deal Alonso for him. I'm guessing he's over valued on the market and would require a bad deal to obtain him. In GABP, he's probably a 4th starter at best. He walks a ton of guys, moving from Oakland and its spaciious foul territory will raise the BABIP and the little league ball parks in the NL central will jump the HR rate. He will benefit from being able to pitch to the opposing pitcher, but I'm guessing a 4.50 to 5.00 ERA with frequent short outings that will tax the bullpen. The Reds will need to pinch hit for him and the walks will use up his pitch count so he probably will fall short of the 7th inning a lot of the time. I don't really see him providing what this team needs.

    I'd probably be OK with a deal involving Stubbs and Volquez for Gio and Ryan Sweeney, but I'm guessing some other sucker out there will pay more. I hope its not Walt Jocketty. The team should aim higher.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

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    .377 in 1905 CySeymour's Avatar
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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    Gio is intriguing, and I do hope Walt does due diligence and looks into him. However, I suspect Gio's decline is closer to happening then what would be good for the Reds.
    ...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound.

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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I get it, but I wouldn't deal Alonso for him. I'm guessing he's over valued on the market and would require a bad deal to obtain him. In GABP, he's probably a 4th starter at best. He walks a ton of guys, moving from Oakland and its spaciious foul territory will raise the BABIP and the little league ball parks in the NL central will jump the HR rate. He will benefit from being able to pitch to the opposing pitcher, but I'm guessing a 4.50 to 5.00 ERA with frequent short outings that will tax the bullpen. The Reds will need to pinch hit for him and the walks will use up his pitch count so he probably will fall short of the 7th inning a lot of the time. I don't really see him providing what this team needs.

    I'd probably be OK with a deal involving Stubbs and Volquez for Gio and Ryan Sweeney, but I'm guessing some other sucker out there will pay more. I hope its not Walt Jocketty. The team should aim higher.
    So what starting pitchers would you go after? And please don't say Felix Hernandez, CC Sabathia, or any other guy making $14M or more. Reds will never go there.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

    "Man do I miss the days where were didn't need a calculator and an encyclopedia of baseball metrics to enjoy a baseball game ... - MikeS21" - 8/2/12 game thread

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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    I like Gio as a target. Good, young, affordable, lefthanded.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  12. #11
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vottomatic View Post
    So what starting pitchers would you go after? And please don't say Felix Hernandez, CC Sabathia, or any other guy making $14M or more. Reds will never go there.
    Mark Buehrle, James Shields and Wandy Rodriguez are the top three I can think of. Beyond them, I might kick the tires on Edwin Jackson but would prefer someone more established. Roy Oswalt has too much injury risk. Guys like John Danks and Gavin Floyd seem only a little better than the in house options, but wouldn't mind them as a fall back because I don't think the talent cost would be so heavy.

    Buehrle would cost the most in Salary, but I think the Reds could swing it if they don't mess with spending on position players or marginal relief help. He has the advantage of costing no talent so the Reds could fill those needs from within.

    Wandy is a little pricey, but I think he could be had without dealing any of the Reds who don't have adequate internal alternatives like Alonso, Votto or Bruce. Maybe Stubbs, Volquez, Janish or something fairly painless along those lines could get that done. They need help in the OF and a stopgap at SS. Volquez would be a nice gamble for them and they would save some money.

    Shields has the best contract situation and might be the best pitcher, but I'm thinking Alonso, Grandal plus would be needed to get him and it would force the Reds to get somebody who can play LF and hit in the middle of the order in a second move (but with Shields at just $7 Million in 2012 the Reds may be able to do it).

    Gio would be better than the Reds had last year, and is best from a money and years of control standpoint, but guys who walk so many in GABP seem like a bad idea. I get the allure of Gio. He's yoiung, has had a couple of decent years in a row, and would be under control for multiple seasons. He's the kind of guy I'd normally like to see them get too. I just think Oakland is the most favorable pitching situation there is besides Petco and the move to GABP might really bump both his hits and HRs allowed. I could see his ERA jumping 1.50 to 2.00 runs per game with the switch. As I said earlier, he may look a lot Volquez in GABP. If he could be had for expendable guys like Stubbs, Volquez and Janish, I'd be happy with a deal for him, but wonder if it would be enough to put the Reds ahead of the Cards or Brewers. Because of the cost in money and or talent, the Reds may only get one shot to upgrade the rotation and they should aim high IMO. I'm not sure that Volquez wouldn't be better in Oakland than Gio will be in Cincy, but Gio's age, home park aided stats and contract situation probably would make him pretty painful to acquire from a talent standpoint.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  13. #12
    Member klw's Avatar
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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    For a top young arm, Gio is sure traded alot. The Brett Wallace of pitchers.

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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    I watched a replay of a Gio start vs the Jays recently. It was a highlight game for him, but Bautista was out of the lineup. He went 8 innings, and was left in with 1 out in the 8th and a runner on 2nd with a 2-1 lead. He struck out the final 2 I believe.

    As for the repertoire, decent velo on the FB, around 92. He is a bit of nibbler on the outside of the plate. He didn't throw inside very often. I thought he did a good job changing the eye level while living on the outside of the plate with a FB, curveball combo. His curveball is a sight to see. OAKLAND A'S TV - "CURVEBALL" - YouTube
    That video pays it homage. He had the Jays whiffing at everything and kept control of the lineup throughout the game. The Jays were hacking.

    I also watched some of a poor start to see where he gets derailed. I watched him vs KC, who according to the broadcast team hits him well. He tried to establish the inside of the plate and gave up HR, HR, 2b to start an inning. His FB just isn't that hard to hit, so if he misses just a bit, it was getting tatooed.

    I really like his curveball and other breaking stuff. I think he locates his FB better than Volquez, so if has control problems my guess is it isn't due to "wildness" like Volquez, who sometimes doesn't know which pitch has a remote chance of being a strike. Not sure he's worth a haul of prospects, honestly, but his high K numbers and really pretty breaking stuff makes him an upgrade and a sure #2 on the Reds. A really enjoyable #3 if Leake or Bailey can command their talents.
    2015 Rotation: Cueto, Latos, Bailey, Leake, Cingrani

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    Re: A's to shop Gio Gonzalez?

    Quote Originally Posted by mdccclxix View Post
    I watched a replay of a Gio start vs the Jays recently. It was a highlight game for him, but Bautista was out of the lineup. He went 8 innings, and was left in with 1 out in the 8th and a runner on 2nd with a 2-1 lead. He struck out the final 2 I believe.

    As for the repertoire, decent velo on the FB, around 92. He is a bit of nibbler on the outside of the plate. He didn't throw inside very often. I thought he did a good job changing the eye level while living on the outside of the plate with a FB, curveball combo. His curveball is a sight to see. OAKLAND A'S TV - "CURVEBALL" - YouTube
    That video pays it homage. He had the Jays whiffing at everything and kept control of the lineup throughout the game. The Jays were hacking.

    I also watched some of a poor start to see where he gets derailed. I watched him vs KC, who according to the broadcast team hits him well. He tried to establish the inside of the plate and gave up HR, HR, 2b to start an inning. His FB just isn't that hard to hit, so if he misses just a bit, it was getting tatooed.

    I really like his curveball and other breaking stuff. I think he locates his FB better than Volquez, so if has control problems my guess is it isn't due to "wildness" like Volquez, who sometimes doesn't know which pitch has a remote chance of being a strike. Not sure he's worth a haul of prospects, honestly, but his high K numbers and really pretty breaking stuff makes him an upgrade and a sure #2 on the Reds. A really enjoyable #3 if Leake or Bailey can command their talents.
    That commercial is awesome! Imagine Johnny Gomes trying to hit that.


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