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Thread: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

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    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    Interesting that I thought of Stubbs yesterday while reading the comments about Matty Alou. So did Paul Daugherty.

    http://news.cincinnati.com/article/2...rom-Matty-Hat-
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    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    Don't think Matty Alou ever had the power potential of Drew Stubbs. Why fit a square peg in a round hole?
    Talent is God Given: be humble.
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    Danger is my business! oneupper's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    I think Stubbs tried choking up in the minors, as reported here in the minors forum.
    Not sure how that worked, but maybe it wasn't that well.
    "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it."

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    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    [WQUOTE=RANDY IN INDY;2499055]Don't think Matty Alou ever had the power potential of Drew Stubbs. Why fit a square peg in a round hole?[/QUOTE]

    I think Daugherty acknowledges that to a degree with mentioning Stubbs has much more talent. He's a player I'd like to see make a jump this season.
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    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    Stubbs doesn't need to change his swing. He needs to change when he swings.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

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    Member 757690's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    Stubbs is a horrible two strike hitter, with virtually no power in those situations. If he choked up when he had two strikes, he probably wouldn't lose any power, but would get on base more.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

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    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Stubbs is a horrible two strike hitter, with virtually no power in those situations. If he choked up when he had two strikes, he probably wouldn't lose any power, but would get on base more.
    Maybe. IMO, his problem is he lets the good ones go by early in the count and puts himself in a position of swinging at the pitchers pitch all too often. Seeing a lot of pitches and going deep in the count is equated as a good thing, but its not when a guy is completely clueless up there. The purpose of going deep into the count is to work the pitcher to make him pitch to you with something you can hit hard somewhere. Stubbs is the exact opposite of this IMO. He lets the fat ones go by early and then has to swing at the less hittable ones late and makes weak contact, Ks or takes ones on the black and gets called out on strikes. Stubbs may see a lot off pitches and even get a decent amount of walks as a result, but what he does is not what plate discipline is all about. He's one of the most clueless hitters I've seen up there. I hope the Reds can find a taker who will pay the Reds something decent for Stubbs' tools and potential, but I see him fading into a part-time role followed by fringe major leaguer status over the next couple years without some major changes to his game. I'd rather the Reds get something with less potential but more certainty and let someody else try to "fix him."
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

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    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    I think Ryan Hanigan should start swinging for the fences. When Jose Bautista did that, he became awesome. I mean, what if he hit 20 HR next year? Well, that's as silly as wishcasting 100 Ks for Stubbs. Drew Stubbs is not physically capable of being a contact hitter, but that doesn't seem to stop people from suggesting he try...

    I'm so tired of people treating the ability to make contact like it's primarily a function of choice. Stubbs does not have good hand-eye coordination. Cutting down his swing won't change that. Or more precisely, to the extent that it would increase his contact rate, it will very possibly do more harm to his power output than good to his batting average. In some situations, should Stubbs shorten up? Sure. Should he continue to work on his ability to lay down a bunt? Without a doubt. Should he fundamentally rework his approach such that he envisions himself a slap-hitter? No.

    I think one of the big reasons STubbs struggled so much last year was confusion over what he should be trying to do. He was clearly beating himself up over the strikeouts which made him tentative. He seemed (curious if this perception is accurate) to swing more early in the count out of fear of getting behind. The lesson of Matty Alou is that player's approach should be tailored to maximize his talent. But just because a guy is fast doesn't mean he's got the talent to be a singles hitter.
    Last edited by RedsManRick; 11-06-2011 at 11:22 AM.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    .377 in 1905 CySeymour's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    I also thing hitters back then used heavier bats then the players of today, which helps eliminate the need to choke up.
    ...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound.

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    Member 757690's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    If you have the eye hand coordination to hit 20+ homers in the majors, you have it to be a decent contact hitter.

    Being a contact hitter is mostly about approach and pitch recognition, both of which can be taught. Although, to be honest, I don't think Stubbs is very teachable.

    Stubbs doesn't have to change his swing, just his approach with two strikes. If he would choke up on the bat, and focus on fouling off tough pitches, he could greatly increase his OBP. But like I said, I'm not sure he's mentally able to do that.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

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    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    If you have the eye hand coordination to hit 20+ homers in the majors, you have it to be a decent contact hitter.

    Being a contact hitter is mostly about approach and pitch recognition, both of which can be taught. Although, to be honest, I don't think Stubbs is very teachable.

    Stubbs doesn't have to change his swing, just his approach with two strikes. If he would choke up on the bat, and focus on fouling off tough pitches, he could greatly increase his OBP. But like I said, I'm not sure he's mentally able to do that.
    I am not of the belief that pitch recognition is all that teachable. If it were, a lot more guys would be better hitters. I also don't think that "fouling off tough pitches" is something that 99.9% of hitters have the bat control to do. If guys could do such a thing, they would also be able to hit line drives when they wanted to. But they can't. The difference between a line drive and a foul ball straight back is about an inch.

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    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    Stubbs doesn't need to change his swing. He needs to change when he swings.
    He just needs to quit missing so much.
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    Doc needs to channel Jim Murray, Red Smith or Leonard Koppett.

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    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Doc needs to channel Jim Murray, Red Smith or Leonard Koppett.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Doc: Stubbs should channel Matty Alou & Harry Walker

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    He just needs to quit missing so much.
    Yeah, but the reason he's missing so much is becaue he takes too many fat ones early and then has to swing at ones that are more difficult to handle with 2 strikes.

    He's got the power to run into a mistake and hit it a long way and he gets walks as a side effect of being afraid to swing the bat, but he is just not a very good hitter.

    If its not too late to get a decent offer, its time to deal him.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS


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