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Thread: Ryan Braun fails drug test

  1. #91
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus the Pimp View Post
    We already know the facts. His sample showed elevated testosterone levels and then was further tested and proven to be synthetic testosterone and on the banned substance list.

    That's a fact that neither side disputes. There's nothing left to know... a banned substance was shown to be in his system. As far as MLB is concerned, it's going to be game, set... match.
    Actually those very assertions seem to be in dispute according to mlb.com's story...

    According to sources cited in the ESPN.com report, Braun submitted a urine test during the playoffs in October that showed a level of testosterone high enough to trigger a positive test. A second test on the sample revealed that the testosterone was exogenous, or from outside Braun's body, meaning it was generated by a synthetic substance.

    FOX's Ken Rosenthal also offered a different account via Twitter on Sunday.

    "What he did triggered violation of #MLB steroid-testing policy," Rosenthal wrote. "Source says substance was prohibited, but not PED."
    We actually know very little about the details at this moment. Game, set, and match? Right now the first set isn't even over.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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  3. #92
    Pre-tty, pre-tty good!! MWM's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    I don't know if there's anything to his explanation (once we know what that is), but it's going to be difficult to get MLB to change their decision primarily because it would provide future positive testers a template for getting off the hook. That sucks for Braun if his gripe is legitimate, but I don't see MLB giving in unless it's something very clearly verifiable that is incredibly unique that wouldn't allow it to set a precedent that could jeopardize everything they've attempted to do to get rid of steroid use amongst the players.
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  4. #93
    The rest is drama. marcshoe's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    How many failed steroid tests have turned out to be false positives? I can't recall any, although it seems to be an extremely common claim.

    I'm a Braun fan, have been since I saw him play in single-A (alongside another favorite named Angel Salome who ended up serving a 50-game suspension in AA, fwiw). I'd like to think he's innocent, but the odds against that are pretty overwhelming.

  5. #94
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Braun is actually contesting the second part. He claims that the second test only showed the presence of a banned substance, not synthetic testosterone, or any other PED. He claims the ESPN story is incorrect.

    So until we get an official report from MLB, all we know for sure is that Braun failed a test. The details are still murky.

    So, if the second test "only the presence of a banned substance", how does that help his case? He was taking a banned substance, just not testosterone? What else is banned, masking agents?

  6. #95
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    So let's say the first test conclusively shows a banned synthetic substance. Braun continues to plead innocent. All further tests come up negative.

    To the "let's wait and see" crowd, what then?
    I could be wrong, but I believe that the testing community doesn't put any weight on tests that individuals request.

    A main reason why the testing works, is that it is random, and the chosen player must provide a sample that day.

    There are so many effective masking agents that a player can take ahead of time if they have any advanced notice, you need that randomness and immediacy. If a player requests a test, he would have enough time to use any of these masking agents to skew the results.

    Like I said, I could be wrong, but that is how I understand how testing works.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

  7. #96
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    I'm going to wait until we know the facts.
    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    I could be wrong, but I believe that the testing community doesn't put any weight on tests that individuals request.

    A main reason why the testing works, is that it is random, and the chosen player must provide a sample that day.

    There are so many effective masking agents that a player can take ahead of time if they have any advanced notice, you need that randomness and immediacy. If a player requests a test, he would have enough time to use any of these masking agents to skew the results.

    Like I said, I could be wrong, but that is how I understand how testing works.
    And I agree. And I also am willing to wait for all the facts to roll in. But I am assuming that a urine sample of Brauns tested positive. How can he overcome that?

  8. #97
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Braun is actually contesting the second part. He claims that the second test only showed the presence of a banned substance, not synthetic testosterone, or any other PED. He claims the ESPN story is incorrect.

    So until we get an official report from MLB, all we know for sure is that Braun failed a test. The details are still murky.
    A banned substance is a banned substance. There's really no gray area in that with the Major League Baseball drug policy. Maybe it means he wasn't trying to get a competitive advantage... we'll see about that... but either way, there are substances that you're not supposed to use and he used one. There's no wiggle room there.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  9. #98
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    Actually those very assertions seem to be in dispute according to mlb.com's story...



    We actually know very little about the details at this moment. Game, set, and match? Right now the first set isn't even over.
    What part of banned substance is unclear to you?
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  10. #99
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    The funny thing about this is that the Braun camp has already had two different accounts to this:

    Last night, the defense was 'we believe the first test was invalid. We had our own test come up negative. We're confident he'll be exonerated'

    Today, the story his shifted to 'it was a positive result, but it was not a performance enhancing drug.'

    It already is feeling like they can't keep their story straight. If it was a positive result for a banned substance, it doesn't matter. Banned substance is a banned substance.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  11. #100
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus the Pimp View Post
    What part of banned substance is unclear to you?
    I'll wait for the whole story before passing judgement. Ignore function.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  12. #101
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    And I agree. And I also am willing to wait for all the facts to roll in. But I am assuming that a urine sample of Brauns tested positive. How can he overcome that?
    The what, how and why can be important mitigating factors. Probably not but Braun seems willing to fight the good fight, so i'll wait until mlb makes an official statement.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  13. #102
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Just reading an article on mlb.com, I see word mincing: he claims to have not "knowingly" taken a banned substance. I find it hard to give someone the benefit of the doubt who is choosing to use hair-splitting semantic techniques to deflect guilt and gain sympathy. He can't say anything, but yet he is saying things like "B.S." to USA Today and his rep. is running around shooting off his mouth. "I can't say anything, but wait 'til you hear our side of the story." Which we likely never will. I'm still waiting to hear someone's side of the story. They all say that after a bust, then they serve their suspension and it quietly fades off into the sunset.

    All PR damage control attempts is what I am smelling in the air. Sort of smells like skunk.
    Can't win with 'em

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  14. #103
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    The what, how and why can be important mitigating factors. Probably not but Braun seems willing to fight the good fight, so i'll wait until mlb makes an official statement.
    Like fertility drugs he got from Volquez? Not sure those important mitigating factors will make a bit of difference in the end.
    I have a love-hate relationship with Albert Pujols. Mostly hate.

  15. #104
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    Just reading an article on mlb.com, I see word mincing: he claims to have not "knowingly" taken a banned substance. I find it hard to give someone the benefit of the doubt who is choosing to use hair-splitting semantic techniques to deflect guilt and gain sympathy. He can't say anything, but yet he is saying things like "B.S." to USA Today and his rep. is running around shooting off his mouth. "I can't say anything, but wait 'til you hear our side of the story." Which we likely never will. I'm still waiting to hear someone's side of the story. They all say that after a bust, then they serve their suspension and it quietly fades off into the sunset.

    All PR damage control attempts is what I am smelling in the air. Sort of smells like skunk.
    Yep, he's known about the result for 6 weeks, and "bs" is all he's got as his initial rebuttal?

  16. #105
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Ryan Braun fails drug test

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    Yep, he's known about the result for 6 weeks, and "bs" is all he's got as his initial rebuttal?
    Presumably he wasn't expecting to have to comment upon a confidential process.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner


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