Turn Off Ads?

View Poll Results: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

Voters
53. You may not vote on this poll
  • RHP Andrew Brackman

    1 1.89%
  • 1B/3B Sean Buckley

    2 3.77%
  • RHP Tim Crabbe

    2 3.77%
  • LHP Amir Garrett

    2 3.77%
  • UT Brodie Greene

    0 0%
  • LHP Donnie Joseph

    0 0%
  • OF Ryan LaMarre

    3 5.66%
  • 1B Donald Lutz

    6 11.32%
  • OF Denis Phipps

    4 7.55%
  • RHP Dan Renken

    0 0%
  • RHP J.C. Sulbaran

    16 30.19%
  • RHP Josh Smith

    0 0%
  • 3B David Vidal

    17 32.08%
  • RHP Pedro Villarreal

    0 0%
  • 2B Ryan Wright

    0 0%
  • other (please list below)

    0 0%
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 38

Thread: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

  1. #1
    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    11,590

    Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    #1 C Devin Mesoraco
    #2 SS Billy Hamilton
    #3 SS Zack Cozart
    #4 RHP Dan Corcino
    #5 RHP Robert Stephenson
    #6 1B Neftali Soto
    #7 OF Yorman Rodriguez
    #8 2B Ron Torreyes
    #9 OF Dave Sappelt
    #10 UT Todd Frazier
    #11 SS Didi Gregorius
    #12 2B Henry Rodriguez
    #13 LHP Tony Cingrani
    #14 OF Juan Duran
    #15 RHP Kyle Lotzkar
    #16 3B Gabriel Rosa
    #17 C Tucker Barnhart

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Posts
    15,511

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    With the rumored trade to the Cubs for Marshall, supposedly involving Reds prospects, let's hope this list of top guys doesn't thin out even more in the next couple of days. My guess is that it will thin out.

  4. #3
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Winton Place
    Posts
    11,567

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    With the rumored trade to the Cubs for Marshall, supposedly involving Reds prospects, let's hope this list of top guys doesn't thin out even more in the next couple of days. My guess is that it will thin out.
    I saw speculation pop up in the Marshall thread, but I didn't see the word "prospect" used, rather "minor leaguers." Those are different animals in my book.

    As an aside, I'm disappointed that Mace's suggestion adding a note to the bottom mentioning the spots that Alonso, Grandal & Boxberger held in this year's vote at the time of the trade. Someone asked why would we list Padres prospects, but I agreed with Mace on this. It gives historical reference to the actual votes this year's list, IMO.
    “In the same way that a baseball season never really begins, it never really ends either.” - Lonnie Wheeler, "Bleachers, A Summer in Wrigley Field"

    The Baseball Emporium - Books & Things, that's Rallyonion.com

    The Baseball Bookstore

    http://tsc-sales.com/
    http://tscsales.blogspot.com/
    http://silverscreenbooks.com/

  5. #4
    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    11,590

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Quote Originally Posted by redsmetz View Post
    As an aside, I'm disappointed that Mace's suggestion adding a note to the bottom mentioning the spots that Alonso, Grandal & Boxberger held in this year's vote at the time of the trade. Someone asked why would we list Padres prospects, but I agreed with Mace on this. It gives historical reference to the actual votes this year's list, IMO.
    It was just to spite you.

  6. #5
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Winton Place
    Posts
    11,567

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Quote Originally Posted by camisadelgolf View Post
    It was just to spite you.
    Well, bah humbug!
    “In the same way that a baseball season never really begins, it never really ends either.” - Lonnie Wheeler, "Bleachers, A Summer in Wrigley Field"

    The Baseball Emporium - Books & Things, that's Rallyonion.com

    The Baseball Bookstore

    http://tsc-sales.com/
    http://tscsales.blogspot.com/
    http://silverscreenbooks.com/

  7. #6
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    37,806

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Going with David Vidal again. He has some pop. He has very good defense. He has a good hit tool. Needs to work on some plate discipline.

  8. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    4,955

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Donald Lutz. He came on strong last year. redsof72 noted that he was the guy in the Dayton lineup whom other teams pitched around. Seems like he also has a significant upside, considering that he played a limited amount of baseball growing up in Germany. The reports on him involve tremendous power and impressive athleticism for a 235-pounder. The .301 BA and .358 OBP last year might be the pieces that complete the puzzle.

  9. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    969

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Went with Garrett for his bonus, projectability, and athleticism. I need to see some results for Sulbaran beyond peripherals before i put him this high.

  10. #9
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    37,806

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Quote Originally Posted by The DARK View Post
    Went with Garrett for his bonus, projectability, and athleticism. I need to see some results for Sulbaran beyond peripherals before i put him this high.
    But you don't need to see ANYTHING from Garrett?

  11. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    969

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    But you don't need to see ANYTHING from Garrett?
    He got a $1 million signing bonus, while Rosa got half of that despite being picked in the 2nd round. Could have been a supplemental if not for his high demands. Big, athletic lefties with a plus mid-90's fastball are hard to come by, and the projection for much more is there. Sometimes no stats are better than consistently underachieving stats, especially ones that took a dip towards the end of the year.

  12. #11
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    37,806

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Quote Originally Posted by The DARK View Post
    He got a $1 million signing bonus, while Rosa got half of that despite being picked in the 2nd round. Could have been a supplemental if not for his high demands. Big, athletic lefties with a plus mid-90's fastball are hard to come by, and the projection for much more is there. Sometimes no stats are better than consistently underachieving stats, especially ones that took a dip towards the end of the year.
    I have no issue with the projectability part, just that you wanted to see more from Sulbaran and picked a guy who has shown nothing. Sulbaran has shown two above-average pitches and stretches where he can dominate. It also isn't much of a concern as to whether he is a starter. I have both guys ranked closely, so I get where you are coming from. Just the thought process was a bit confusing.

  13. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    969

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    I have no issue with the projectability part, just that you wanted to see more from Sulbaran and picked a guy who has shown nothing. Sulbaran has shown two above-average pitches and stretches where he can dominate. It also isn't much of a concern as to whether he is a starter. I have both guys ranked closely, so I get where you are coming from. Just the thought process was a bit confusing.
    I'm basing my thought process more off of the fact that Sulbaran was in the mid-40's on the prospect list last year. A season of 4.60 ERA isn't enough to turn him from that into a significantly better prospect for me, especially in a year when so many other guys took a step forward. I don't doubt his potential and good arsenal, but he's had three seasons to turn that into some sort of success, and he hasn't. He's too streaky to look very imposing as a reliever either, so I've got him in the 30-35 range.
    Last edited by The DARK; 12-22-2011 at 02:02 AM.

  14. #13
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    37,806

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Quote Originally Posted by The DARK View Post
    I'm basing my thought process more off of the fact that Sulbaran was in the mid-40's on the prospect list last year. A season of 4.60 ERA isn't enough to turn him from that into a significantly better prospect for me, especially in a year when so many other guys took a step forward. I don't doubt his potential and good arsenal, but he's had three seasons to turn that into some sort of success, and he hasn't. He's too streaky to look very imposing as a reliever either, so I've got him in the 30-35 range.
    A 4.60 ERA in the California League.... That ranked 13th among qualified starters in the league. Now, not all pitchers stayed in the league long enough to qualify, so there is that at play too. But, the league's ERA was 4.89. So he was better than average while being young for the league.

    As for where he was on this list last year.... That doesn't do much good this year. His stuff took a step forward. His control took a step forward. Those two combined took his game a big step forward. I think you are drastically underrating him if you have him in the 30-35 range.

  15. #14
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    969

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    A 4.60 ERA in the California League.... That ranked 13th among qualified starters in the league. Now, not all pitchers stayed in the league long enough to qualify, so there is that at play too. But, the league's ERA was 4.89. So he was better than average while being young for the league.

    As for where he was on this list last year.... That doesn't do much good this year. His stuff took a step forward. His control took a step forward. Those two combined took his game a big step forward. I think you are drastically underrating him if you have him in the 30-35 range.
    The 30-35 was before the trade, so he's moved up since then, into the high 20s. I respect the difficulty of the level, but there are just so many guys in the system competing with him right now, like Vidal, Lutz, Wright, Buckley, LaMarre, Crabbe, Waldrop and Phipps, all of whom I have above Sulbaran.

    I compare Sulbaran to Crabbe; plus fastball and a plus secondary pitch, with a third as a work in progress. Both have great peripherals and K/BB rates, and struggle with inconsistency. The difference is that Crabbe put up better numbers than Sulbaran at the same level and the year before, and supposedly has better intangibles (though is a year or two older).
    Last edited by The DARK; 12-22-2011 at 02:57 AM.

  16. #15
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    15,627

    Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?

    Quote Originally Posted by The DARK View Post
    The 30-35 was before the trade, so he's moved up since then, into the high 20s. I respect the difficulty of the level, but there are just so many guys in the system competing with him right now, like Vidal, Lutz, Wright, Buckley, LaMarre, Crabbe, Waldrop and Phipps, all of whom I have above Sulbaran.

    I compare Sulbaran to Crabbe; plus fastball and a plus secondary pitch, with a third as a work in progress. Both have great peripherals and K/BB rates, and struggle with inconsistency. The difference is that Crabbe put up better numbers than Sulbaran at the same level and the year before, and supposedly has better intangibles (though is a year or two older).
    I'm on a similar page with Sulbaran vs. Crabbe. I think the two are very close and I have them as my two highest rated guys left. I have Crabbe a shade higher for the reasons you mentioned, but really wouldn't quibble with either one over the other. Given the now thin state of the Reds starting pitching depth, I hope both of these guys find that third pitch, get off to a fast start at AA and get themselves promoted to AAA and in line for a look if need be in the second half of 2012. That's probably a pipedream and 2014 might be more realistic (or they end up in the pen if that 3rd pitch never develops).
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | cumberlandreds | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | RedsfaninMT | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25