Turn Off Ads?
Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst 1234
Results 46 to 60 of 60

Thread: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

  1. #46
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    976

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Sulbaran will be interesting to watch this year too. Classic example of a guy who started too high up the chain (they will not make the same mistake with Stephenson). With J.C., not so much a matter of not being ready physically, but not being ready in terms of maturity. Good kid, but came in with this island mentality in a grind-it-out game. Did not understand the importance of working in the bullpen between starts, doing your running, etc. (and he admits it now). He thought it was going to come too easy, and he really struggled with adversity in game situations and when you needed that competitive fire to come out to get out of a jam, it wasn't there.

    He never pitched an inning of short-season ball. When he got to Dayton, he had already pitched on ESPN in the WBC, and he was loosy-goosy by nature anyway. He had two games in '09 when he couldn't get out of the first inning and just basically quit. But as hard as it was to watch, he needed that failure, I think. Good kid, came from a great family, just did not have any idea what he was getting into in terms of being a professional rather than pitching in tournaments.

    Hopefully he can build on what he did in 2011.

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #47
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    962

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    I've gotta say Sean Buckley impresses me the most. He's got power, a reasonable amount of speed, a nice arm, and dominated Billings in a larger sample size than you might think. He and Vidal are going to look like serious prospects at 3B before the year is out.

  4. #48
    Two-Time Batting Champ Edd Roush's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Loveland, OH
    Posts
    3,045

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Quote Originally Posted by redsof72 View Post
    Sulbaran will be interesting to watch this year too. Classic example of a guy who started too high up the chain (they will not make the same mistake with Stephenson). With J.C., not so much a matter of not being ready physically, but not being ready in terms of maturity. Good kid, but came in with this island mentality in a grind-it-out game. Did not understand the importance of working in the bullpen between starts, doing your running, etc. (and he admits it now). He thought it was going to come too easy, and he really struggled with adversity in game situations and when you needed that competitive fire to come out to get out of a jam, it wasn't there.

    He never pitched an inning of short-season ball. When he got to Dayton, he had already pitched on ESPN in the WBC, and he was loosy-goosy by nature anyway. He had two games in '09 when he couldn't get out of the first inning and just basically quit. But as hard as it was to watch, he needed that failure, I think. Good kid, came from a great family, just did not have any idea what he was getting into in terms of being a professional rather than pitching in tournaments.

    Hopefully he can build on what he did in 2011.
    Thanks for all of the insight, redsof72. What do you think of Crabbe's ability to add a third pitch?

  5. #49
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    976

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    It is not easy for guys to add pitches at this point of their careers but once in a while you hear a story of Logan Ondrusek being taught a cutter by Tom Brown and he just takes off. I think Crabbe's key is getting better command of his fastball. He is a 92-95 guy with good movement. They like Crabbe a lot. He is getting to the levels of the minors where command really starts to become more important than ever, but Crabbe has a good arm. Lets see how this season goes but he is a candidate for a breakout season.

    My list of some of the biggest and unexpected breakout years over the last few seasons: Ondrusek in 2009; Enerio Del Rosario in 2009; Matt Klinker in 2009; Devin Mesoraco in 2010 (biggest of all); Dave Sappelt in 2010; Jordan Hotchkiss in 2010 (unfortunately he got hurt in 2011); Denis Phipps in 2011; Donald Lutz in 2011; David Vidal in 2011; Josh Smith in 2011 (though he had limited innings previously--still, Reds Minor League Pitcher/Year for a 21st round pick the previous summer).

    Edit: To clarify that last paragraph, I am not suggesting that those were players that I predicted for breakout years, just guys that took huge steps from the previous year.
    Last edited by redsof72; 01-05-2012 at 04:28 PM.

  6. #50
    Two-Time Batting Champ Edd Roush's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Loveland, OH
    Posts
    3,045

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Quote Originally Posted by redsof72 View Post
    It is not easy for guys to add pitches at this point of their careers but once in a while you hear a story of Logan Ondrusek being taught a cutter by Tom Brown and he just takes off. I think Crabbe's key is getting better command of his fastball. He is a 92-95 guy with good movement. They like Crabbe a lot. He is getting to the levels of the minors where command really starts to become more important than ever, but Crabbe has a good arm. Lets see how this season goes but he is a candidate for a breakout season.
    Do you think Crabbe can be an effective starter with only two pitches? I have a hard time seeing him as a future TOR arm if he only throws two pitches.

  7. #51
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    976

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Buckley...I have not seen him but there is talk of a move to the outfield and a need for improved defense.

    When you hear that a low-minors player has defensive shortcomings, it is usually another way of saying he can't catch anything. Many low-minors players struggle defensively so when I hear someone single a guy out and say he is a weak player in the field, you figure it must be ugly.

    Next, you look at the player's work ethic and his desire (or lack of desire) to improve his defense. The Reds released an outfielder in 2010 that was highly-touted by some on these boards because he simply would not work on his defense (along with some attitude issues).

    Donald Lutz worked and worked and worked last year and in one season, went from horrendous at first base to fairly decent and getting better. Juan Duran is a guy that needs to develop a desire to improve his defense. He has the desire to improve as a hitter, but he wants to DH and that is not a good thing in a National League organization. A phrase that you hear from time to time that is surprising but can be true: "(Player x) loses interest in the game when he steps out of the batter's box."

    Knowing nothing about Buckley other than the fact that his father is a scout, I would guess that he understands the importance of working on and improving his defense.

  8. #52
    Vavasor TRF's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    Amarillo, TX
    Posts
    13,380

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    I picked Soto at the beginning of last year. I feel quite smug about that.

    I've been starting the Breakout and sleeper threads on here for a long time. I was just looking back over them.

    I wish Tyler Pelland had stayed healthy.

    I was on the Soto bandwagon as far back as 2008

    I feel just as strongly about JC Sulbaran as I did Soto. He's going to be drawing a LOT of eyes after 2012. Could end up being the best pick of that 2008 draft.
    Suck it up cupcake.

  9. #53
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    976

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Quote Originally Posted by Edd Roush View Post
    Do you think Crabbe can be an effective starter with only two pitches? I have a hard time seeing him as a future TOR arm if he only throws two pitches.
    Not sure where they are on that. I agree with your point, though TOR starter may be a bit much under any circumstances. This is a guy who had a losing record at Westmont College. But they do like him and like his potential.

  10. #54
    Two-Time Batting Champ Edd Roush's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Loveland, OH
    Posts
    3,045

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Quote Originally Posted by redsof72 View Post
    Not sure where they are on that. I agree with your point, though TOR starter may be a bit much under any circumstances. This is a guy who had a losing record at Westmont College. But they do like him and like his potential.
    Where do you place his ceiling? Middle of the rotation starter or high leverage arm out of the 'pen?

  11. #55
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    976

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Not sure. I am not one of the guys who is big on talking a lot about ceilings, especially for a pitcher, because who is to say when he is going to stop getting better? Mike Leake certainly does not possess the stuff to be a prototypical # 1 starter, but he might end up being one anyway. Crabbe is a power pitcher who can get his fastball into the 94-95 range. He has the arm to pitch in the big leagues and pitch well there if he dramatically improves his command. He might top out in Double-A but the Reds hope he can help them in Cincinnati some day.

  12. #56
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    35,260

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Quote Originally Posted by redsof72 View Post
    Buckley...I have not seen him but there is talk of a move to the outfield and a need for improved defense.
    He had a sub .900 Fielding % in college and in Billings. The hot corner isn't for everyone. I haven't seen him play other than 2 games online that were pretty poor quality, but he has certainly struggled with errors over the past few seasons.

  13. #57
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    1,166

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    72,
    What are your views on a couple of LHP's, Blaine Howell and Mitch Clarke? Howell had excellent stats and was second in saves. IIRC, Howell missed a year doing a mission and so was a little old for the league.

    It looked as if the Reds see Clarke as a potential starter.

  14. #58
    Two-Time Batting Champ Edd Roush's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Loveland, OH
    Posts
    3,045

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Quote Originally Posted by redsof72 View Post
    Not sure. I am not one of the guys who is big on talking a lot about ceilings, especially for a pitcher, because who is to say when he is going to stop getting better? Mike Leake certainly does not possess the stuff to be a prototypical # 1 starter, but he might end up being one anyway. Crabbe is a power pitcher who can get his fastball into the 94-95 range. He has the arm to pitch in the big leagues and pitch well there if he dramatically improves his command. He might top out in Double-A but the Reds hope he can help them in Cincinnati some day.
    I see your point about ceilings. I, too, hope he can improve his command. He showed major improvement from a 6.0 BB/9 to 3.5 BB/9 last year. If he can get below 3, I think he will have great success next year.

    That being said, I wouldn't mind him not focusing 100% on control if it meant he could pick up another pitch. I don't think you necessarily have to be more "wild" when you pick up a new pitch, but I think he is going to need a third pitch to pitch in the Cincinnati rotation, so I hope the Reds do their best to teach him a third pitch so he can be a legit starting pitcher prospect.

  15. #59
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    962

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    He had a sub .900 Fielding % in college and in Billings. The hot corner isn't for everyone. I haven't seen him play other than 2 games online that were pretty poor quality, but he has certainly struggled with errors over the past few seasons.
    Any other report on his defense? Rookie and A-Ball infielders seem to show inflated error statistics (unless our guys are exceptionally bad), and the arm seems solid enough. I'd like to think he can stick it out at third base and learn to field capably, as he's still got a long way to go in the minors and seems to have the tools and coaching available to succeed.

  16. #60
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    35,260

    Re: 2012 Breakout minor leaguer

    Quote Originally Posted by The DARK View Post
    Any other report on his defense? Rookie and A-Ball infielders seem to show inflated error statistics (unless our guys are exceptionally bad), and the arm seems solid enough. I'd like to think he can stick it out at third base and learn to field capably, as he's still got a long way to go in the minors and seems to have the tools and coaching available to succeed.
    Not really, but sub .900 fielding percentage, at any level, shows there is a large need for improvement. That isn't to say that he can't make it, but he has a long way to go.


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25