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Thread: 2012 MLB Draft order

  1. #151
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    You've got posters all over this thread talking about drafting corner infielders and outfielders because of a perceived hole at the major league level. Always the back and forth between BPA and need....

    I consider this to be a pretty important draft class for the Reds. The system looks to be sagging a little to me. The couple supplemental picks gives them an opportunity to get a little extra boost, though it's unfortunate that the talent in this crop isn't considered to be all that great.
    Actually, I'm talking about drafting corner bats (especially corner OFs) because of an obvious gaping hole throughout the entire system. There is no one in the minors to step up now and (with the possible exception of Lutz and Waldrop), there is not going to be anyone to step up two or three years from now if they don't start investing some premium picks on decent OF bats with power potential.

    I'm not under the delusion that drafting one bat now is going to insure a major league OF three years from now - there is a high failure rate. Which is why it mystifies me how this organization could go so many drafts without really addressing such a crucial area. Utility infielders have their place, but there isn't any excuse for not using at least one top 10 draft pick every season on a high-ceiling OF bat. Do that five years in a row and your chances of landing someone that sticks. What's the downside? You end up with one power-hitting OF and four strong trading chips?

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  3. #152
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    There is no one in the minors to step up now and (with the possible exception of Lutz and Waldrop), there is not going to be anyone to step up two or three years from now if they don't start investing some premium picks on decent OF bats with power potential.
    Do Yorman (for whom they spent 2.5 million) and Duran (2 million) count as high ceiling corner OF bats?

    Good players at other positions can more often than not move to LF. A LF does not have to be a slugger these days.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  4. #153
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    delete -- double posts
    Last edited by lollipopcurve; 05-25-2012 at 04:46 PM.
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  5. #154
    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Do Yorman (for whom they spent 2.5 million) and Duran (2 million) count as high ceiling corner OF bats?

    Good players at other positions can more often than not move to LF. A LF does not have to be a slugger these days.

  6. #155
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    Do Yorman (for whom they spent 2.5 million) and Duran (2 million) count as high ceiling corner OF bats?

    Good players at other positions can more often than not move to LF. A LF does not have to be a slugger these days.
    Yorman and especially Duran are not top ten prospects in this organization at this point. So no, I wouldn't count on them to help the Reds anytime in the next few years, if ever.
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  7. #156
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Yorman and especially Duran are not top ten prospects in this organization at this point. So no, I wouldn't count on them to help the Reds anytime in the next few years, if ever.
    I would agree with that. Poster's assumption was that if the high-ceiling corner OF bat drafted in the top 10 rounds doesn't end up helping the major league club, he can at least be a valuable trading chip. Cases of Yorman and Duran seem to indicate that even the valuable trading chip status can disappear quickly.

    In general, this scouting dept. goes by the axiom that guys who play in the middle of the diamond are the most desirable at the top of the draft. I think it's a sound philosophy.
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  8. #157
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    I'm not up on the potential draftees, but my opinion is BPA all the time. The Reds need high end players that can be dealt for what is needed. Way more likely to fill needs by hoarding talent and then utilizing it to fill specific needs via trade than by reaching in the draft for specific positions.

    High end SS prospects are almost as valuable as pitchers when it comes to trade value
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  9. #158
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    High end SS prospects are almost as valuable as pitchers when it comes to trade value
    Except when they can't hit, which many seem to think that Marrero can't.
    Go BLUE!!!

  10. #159
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    To be clear, my strategy for the early rounds of this draft is quite simple: BBA or BPiA

    Best Bat Available or Best Pitcher Available.

    I'm not into drafting defensive whizzes with limited offensive upside- at least not in the first couple rounds. We already have DiDi Gregorius, Miguel Rojas, Humberto Valor, Felix Perez, Ryan LaMarre, Tucker Barnhart, and guys like that in the system. Before that we had Gookie Dawkins, Rey Olmedo, and many, many more. I want to see bats with huge upside- it matters a lot less to me what position they play (so long as they have the flexibility to play somewhere other than exclusively 1B). It just so happens that a lot of those bats are corner infielders or corner outfielders.

    Best pitcher available is pretty self-explanatory, although perhaps I should add that I'd like to see upside better than a #4 starter- at least in the first two rounds.
    This +1.
    The Sox traded Bullfrog the only player they've got for Shottenhoffen. Four-eyes Shottenhoffen a utility infielder. They've got a whole team of utility infielders.

  11. #160
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Except when they can't hit, which many seem to think that Marrero can't.
    You may be right. I don't think Didi would fetch much. I'm assuming a top 15 pick would be more highly valued since I don't know much about these guys.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  12. #161
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I'm not up on the potential draftees, but my opinion is BPA all the time. The Reds need high end players that can be dealt for what is needed. Way more likely to fill needs by hoarding talent and then utilizing it to fill specific needs via trade than by reaching in the draft for specific positions.

    High end SS prospects are almost as valuable as pitchers when it comes to trade value
    I totally agree with the first part. I think the Reds system has plenty of decent prospects, what seems to be lacking are the high ceiling prospects that have the potential to develop into impact players on the ML level or highly coveted trade chips. I'd like to see the Reds be aggressive and target some high ceiling talent, rather than looking to target high floor players who figure to be average.

    From looking over all of the top prospect lists going into the season, the one thing that struck me is the abundance of pitching prospects and the dearth of high-ceiling bats. There just aren't a ton of elite bats in the minors and all things considered I'd like to see the Reds add more high ceiling hitters, even if it means drafting corner OFs and corner IFs. If the Reds have the opportunity to draft a Troy Tulowitzki or Manny Machado, that's one thing but I wouldn't draft a slick fielding, average hitting SS over a corner OF / IF that can mash.

  13. #162
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Quote Originally Posted by nmculbreth View Post
    I totally agree with the first part. I think the Reds system has plenty of decent prospects, what seems to be lacking are the high ceiling prospects that have the potential to develop into impact players on the ML level or highly coveted trade chips. I'd like to see the Reds be aggressive and target some high ceiling talent, rather than looking to target high floor players who figure to be average.

    From looking over all of the top prospect lists going into the season, the one thing that struck me is the abundance of pitching prospects and the dearth of high-ceiling bats. There just aren't a ton of elite bats in the minors and all things considered I'd like to see the Reds add more high ceiling hitters, even if it means drafting corner OFs and corner IFs. If the Reds have the opportunity to draft a Troy Tulowitzki or Manny Machado, that's one thing but I wouldn't draft a slick fielding, average hitting SS over a corner OF / IF that can mash.
    I get the logic, but if there are 3 or 4 SS who all project to be in the 10 to 20 range, I wouldn't pass them to take a Corner Bat who projects to the 30 to 40 range. If these are all fairly equal as prospect rankings go, well then big bats are pretty valuable too.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  14. #163
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Jim Callis Mock Draft 2.0

    This time it's subscriber-only so I left out the commentary:

    1. ASTROS. Projected Pick: MARK APPEL.

    2. TWINS. Projected Pick: BYRON BUXTON.

    3. MARINERS. Projected Pick: MIKE ZUNINO.

    4. ORIOLES. Projected Pick: KEVIN GAUSMAN.

    5. ROYALS. Projected Pick: KYLE ZIMMER.

    6. CUBS. Projected Pick: CARLOS CORREA.

    7. PADRES. Projected Pick: MAX FRIED.

    8. PIRATES. Projected Pick: DEVEN MARRERO.

    9. MARLINS. Projected Pick: ALBERT ALMORA.

    10. ROCKIES. Projected Pick: COURTNEY HAWKINS.

    11. ATHLETICS. Projected Pick: LANCE McCULLERS JR.

    12. METS. Projected Pick: GAVIN CECCHINI.

    13. WHITE SOX. Projected Pick: MICHAEL WACHA.

    14. REDS. Projected Pick: CHRIS STRATTON.

    15. INDIANS. Projected Pick: ANDREW HEANEY.

    16. NATIONALS. Projected Pick: MARCUS STROMAN.

    17. BLUE JAYS. Projected Pick: DAVID DAHL.

    18. DODGERS. Projected Pick: TY HENSLEY.

    19. CARDINALS Projected Pick: RICHIE SHAFFER.

    20. GIANTS. Projected Pick: NICK TRAVIESO.

    21. BRAVES. Projected Pick: TYLER NAQUIN.

    22. BLUE JAYS (for failure to sign 2011 first-round Tyler Beede). Projected Pick: JOEY GALLO.

    23. CARDINALS. Projected Pick: LUCAS SIMS.

    24. RED SOX. Projected Pick: TANNER RAHIER.

    25. RAYS. Projected Pick: D.J. DAVIS.

    26. DIAMONDBACKS. Projected Pick: STRYKER TRAHAN.

    27. BREWERS Projected Pick: STEPHEN PISCOTTY.

    28. BREWERS. Projected Pick: SHANE WATSON.

    29. RANGERS. Projected Pick: MATT SMORAL.

    30. YANKEES. Projected Pick: ADDISON RUSSELL.

    31. RED SOX (from Phillies for Jonathan Papelbon). Projected Pick: ZACH EFLIN

    I am very sure Dahl goes to the Braves if he is still around.... They will not make the Ellsbury mistake again.
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  15. #164
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    The Reds need high end players that can be dealt for what is needed. Way more likely to fill needs by hoarding talent and then utilizing it to fill specific needs via trade than by reaching in the draft for specific positions.
    Agree. This is why drafting Marrero would be fine with me.


    I'd like to see upside better than a #4 starter- at least in the first two rounds.
    So, Matt Smoral over Michael Wacha?
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  16. #165
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 MLB Draft order

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Except when they can't hit, which many seem to think that Marrero can't.
    I think you are confusing "can't hit" with "couldn't hit enough to play another position". There is a big difference between can't hit, like say Miguel Rojas, and can't hit enough to play another position, like say Zack Cozart.


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