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Thread: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

  1. #271
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Quote Originally Posted by lollipopcurve View Post
    If he threw a curve, it was rarely. Fastball-changeup was all he needed.
    I just did some research on it.

    from his wiki-page
    On occasion, Soto would also throw a slider, which he turned to more in the latter stage of his career. He less frequently threw a curveball.
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  3. #272
    Resident optimist OldRightHander's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    If I remember, Rose pushed Soto to develop a curve because he thought he needed another pitch, and I've often wondered if that didn't lead to some of the elbow trouble he developed.
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  4. #273
    Moderator Gallen5862's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    http://www.baseballamerica.com/today...1/2612639.html

    Starting in 2012, the familiar Type A and Type B free agents, based on the Elias ranking system, will be eliminated. Now the only free agents subject to compensation will be those who are offered contracts equal to the average salary of the 125 highest-paid players in the game as they enter the free-agent process. Players also have to be with a team for an entire season to be subject to compensation, so pending free agents who are traded at midseason will not generate extra picks for the teams that acquire them.

    A team that signs one of those free agents will give up its first-round pick. Unlike before, when the top 15 overall picks were protected, now only the top 10 are protected. In those cases, the team will lose its second-highest selection (not necessarily its second-round pick, as before).

  5. #274
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    That helps answer the questions about what draft compensation starts in 2012 for the 2013 draft.

  6. #275
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    I am a little late to this thread but here are my thoughts.

    Walt played the closer market perfectly. Got one of the best guys out there for below market value. The more teams addressed their 9th inning role the more barganing power the Reds had.

    If you want to contend you better start the season with a plan for the 9th inning. Closer by committee sounds good but rarely is put into use.

    A one year deal for Madsen is a great deal for the Reds. If he is good and the Reds are in contention he helps them. If he is good and the Reds our out of it he has a lot of trade value. If he is bad, well your not betting that he will be bad.

    Having a solid pen allows teams to shorten the game. If Massett regains his 2010 form then the Reds have a very good back end of the bullpen.

    I think I agree with a Cards fan (Mike) in that at the end of the day a closer is paid to end the game with your team on top. They could average giving up a run per game but go 40 for 40 in save opportunities and it would be considered a success. That said I have much more faith in Madson than Cordero.

  7. #276
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Quote Originally Posted by thatcoolguy_22 View Post
    I might have over looked it, but I don't think this has been posted yet. Pretty interesting read about Madson's changeup.

    http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/po...-deadly-weapon

    .
    So with Marshall, Bray and Madson, will a lefty ever get a hit against us in the 8th or 9th?

    Who's getting the righties out?
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  8. #277
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    I am a little late to this thread but here are my thoughts.

    Walt played the closer market perfectly. Got one of the best guys out there for below market value. The more teams addressed their 9th inning role the more barganing power the Reds had.

    If you want to contend you better start the season with a plan for the 9th inning. Closer by committee sounds good but rarely is put into use.

    A one year deal for Madsen is a great deal for the Reds. If he is good and the Reds are in contention he helps them. If he is good and the Reds our out of it he has a lot of trade value. If he is bad, well your not betting that he will be bad.

    Having a solid pen allows teams to shorten the game. If Massett regains his 2010 form then the Reds have a very good back end of the bullpen.

    I think I agree with a Cards fan (Mike) in that at the end of the day a closer is paid to end the game with your team on top. They could average giving up a run per game but go 40 for 40 in save opportunities and it would be considered a success. That said I have much more faith in Madson than Cordero.
    I have to say, I'm still squeemish about Massett carrying a heavy role in the 8th inning. I feel much better about Arredondo and LeCure for some reason.

    Marshall for Chapman
    +
    Madson for Cordero

    is an improvement, but several things need to happen for it to be clear cut.

    1) Madson can't blow more than 5 saves for this to be a material upgrade, unless for some reason his innings in non close situations add a significant value.

    2) Chapman has to pitch well. In any role. Starter or reliever. Having that depth makes the Reds very dangerous.

    3) Marshall needs to outperform Chapman, which is pretty likely. He's more consistent and has better numbers.

    4) the money saved with Madson's contract has to be a success when acquiring a SS backup and LF batter.


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  9. #278
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Quote Originally Posted by Gallen5862 View Post
    http://www.baseballamerica.com/today...1/2612639.html

    Starting in 2012, the familiar Type A and Type B free agents, based on the Elias ranking system, will be eliminated. Now the only free agents subject to compensation will be those who are offered contracts equal to the average salary of the 125 highest-paid players in the game as they enter the free-agent process. Players also have to be with a team for an entire season to be subject to compensation, so pending free agents who are traded at midseason will not generate extra picks for the teams that acquire them.

    A team that signs one of those free agents will give up its first-round pick. Unlike before, when the top 15 overall picks were protected, now only the top 10 are protected. In those cases, the team will lose its second-highest selection (not necessarily its second-round pick, as before).
    So does the team losing the FA get the signing team's first round pick in addition to a sandwich round pick? Or is it just a first round pick?

    Either way this is great news for the Reds. Barring extensions, Madson, Phillips, and possibly Marshall could all potentially qualify and net the Reds anywhere from 3-6 additional picks before the second round begins in the 2013 draft. Let's just hope Bob and Walt have the guts and good sense to make the qualifying offers.

    These additional picks, along with the three first/sandwich picks we have in this year's draft, should go a LONG way in infusing the farm system with talent lost to this offseason's trades and other graduations. Hopefully by 2014 we will regain our status as one of the best farm systems in the game.
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Either way this is great news for the Reds. Barring extensions, Madson, Phillips, and possibly Marshall could all potentially qualify and net the Reds anywhere from 3-6 additional picks before the second round begins in the 2013 draft. Let's just hope Bob and Walt have the guts and good sense to make the qualifying offers.
    I think it's a little too early to say that it's good sense to offer any of Phillips, Masden and Marshall $12M each in 2013.

    BTW, if it takes "guts" you must think there is significant risk to them accepting. Is it "good sense" to accept that much risk?

  11. #280
    Moderator Gallen5862's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Phillips is getting $12M this year so next year would be no increase for the qualifying offer. Madson has an $11M option so would not be much of a increase. Marshall would be worth the offer as well. Even if all three accepted it would still be worth the risk. They would still be valuable trade chips as well.

  12. #281
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Quote Originally Posted by Gallen5862 View Post
    Phillips is getting $12M this year so next year would be no increase for the qualifying offer. Madson has an $11M option so would not be much of a increase. Marshall would be worth the offer as well. Even if all three accepted it would still be worth the risk. They would still be valuable trade chips as well.
    Masdon had no takers at anytihng close to $12M this season. Marshall couldn't have gotten $12M this season.

    No one currently would want to pay Phillips $12M next year. If the Reds did. he'd be signed to an extension already.

    But if what you say is correct, why would it takes "guts" to do it?

  13. #282
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    I think it's a little too early to say that it's good sense to offer any of Phillips, Masden and Marshall $12M each in 2013.

    BTW, if it takes "guts" you must think there is significant risk to them accepting. Is it "good sense" to accept that much risk?
    IMO, it makes no sense at all to offer Marshall 12 million/year in hopes of getting a draft pick.. He will accept in a heartbeat, and that's way overpaying.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

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  14. #283
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    Who's getting the righties out?
    Small sample sizes ahead:

    Nick Masset, in just more than 200 IP, has given up more H/IP, with a K/IP of less than one, and a high BB rate. But he does keep the ball in the ballpark (just 15 HR allowed).

    LeCure has decent numbers in 79.1 IP against RH, with a WHIP just over 1.00, an excellent K:BB ratio (more than 3:1), but not as many Ks as I'd like to see (less than a K an IP).

    Jose Arredondo walks an absolute ton of RH batters, but you might live with that if his other numbers hold out: in 83 1/3 IP, he's gotten 71Ks and given up 77 hits.

    Carlos Fisher's numbers look a lot like Arredondo's, complete with few hits and massive amounts of BBs. But he's also given up six HR in his limited IP.

    Speaking of homers, Logan Ondrusek has given up 11 (!) in only 77 IP versus RH. That's 16% (!) of his total hits given up.
    Last edited by Scrap Irony; 01-12-2012 at 01:28 PM.
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  15. #284
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    So with Marshall, Bray and Madson, will a lefty ever get a hit against us in the 8th or 9th?

    Who's getting the righties out?
    Marshall, Madson and Massett, although isn't Massett also better against lefties historically? I know he was in 2010, last year I just blanked out when he was on the mound, self-induced coma.
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  16. #285
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    Re: Reds Sign Ryan Madson

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    So with Marshall, Bray and Madson, will a lefty ever get a hit against us in the 8th or 9th?

    Who's getting the righties out?
    Marshall and Madson are death on righties.


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