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Thread: Indiana Basketball

  1. #961
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by SunDeck View Post
    From interviews, I gather he always aimed to lock up any kid in the region who could fit into the program, not ignoring the national scene, but recognizing that he needed kids who would totally buy into his philosophy.
    I think, for a while, he only recruited kids from Illinois, Indiana and Ohio.
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  3. #962
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    I think, for a while, he only recruited kids from Illinois, Indiana and Ohio.
    I don't know if that is all he recruited, but that is all he got. Jimmy Thomas('81 Championship Team) was the first under Knight's regime to come from outside that three state area. But if I remember right, his parents had ties to IU in some fashion. After that he took kids in from all over, including International ones.
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  4. #963
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    I don't know if that is all he recruited, but that is all he got. Jimmy Thomas('81 Championship Team) was the first under Knight's regime to come from outside that three state area. But if I remember right, his parents had ties to IU in some fashion. After that he took kids in from all over, including International ones.
    Yes, who could forget Uwe Blab!
    I am guessing there was a strong and loyal network of coaches trying to teach kids to play his offense in Indiana high schools, hoping to connect with Knight by sending him quality recruits. Can you imagine what it would have done for a coach's credibility to have St. Bobby showing up at his gym on some Friday night?
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    Hoosier Red (02-23-2014)

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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    lots of good regional players close already, the program could stay ranked even without national recruiting, but wheres the fun in that? Waste some money, go take a vacation to austrailia and bring back some playas.

    Anybody watch the New Mexico game last night? They got two wins over top 10 teams. Just sayin

  7. #965
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by SunDeck View Post
    Yes, who could forget Uwe Blab!
    I am guessing there was a strong and loyal network of coaches trying to teach kids to play his offense in Indiana high schools, hoping to connect with Knight by sending him quality recruits. Can you imagine what it would have done for a coach's credibility to have St. Bobby showing up at his gym on some Friday night?
    Good ole Uwe!

    One thing people forget about concerning the 70's and into the 80's is that Purdue was pretty dang good as well. It aint like RMK had this state to himself.
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

  8. #966
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    I apologize fellas. I hate to sound so negative. But I am fed up. I gave CTC a pass these last couple of years...I am done doing that. He as used up all my "gimme's". Did Bob Knight ever rebuild after a successful season? Hell no, he re-loaded.
    Not a Crean supporter at all and wouldn't be upset if he moves on in a couple years, but I'm not sure this is fair. Why do you give Crean a pass for the last couple years? His last two seasons were impressive. IU overachieved under Crean two years ago, and last year they just peaked too early. But they went into the tournament as a top 3 team. That is commendable. Yes the Sweet 16 loss was disappointing, but Syracuse was a good team too. Yes the #1 seed is expected to win a Sweet 16 game, but not a horrible loss.

    This year has been extremely disappointing, but that does happen sometimes. UK last year is a great example, but nobody was looking to get rid of Coach Cal last year (I understand that Crean is not quite on Cal's level). IU this year is actually pretty comparable to UK's team last year. They lost a lot of guys from the previous year, and then most of the new guys didn't play as expected. For this team, Yogi is the only consistent offensive player. Vonleh is great on the boards, but he's inconsistent on offense. Sheehey, Hollowell, and Parea were all expected to make big improvements this year, and they have not done that. It actually looks like they've regressed. And Gordon, who was expected to be a solid contributor, has basically been an offensive zero.

    I don't think it's fair to judge Crean based on this year. But we'll see what happens in the next couple years. If he can somehow get Vonleh to stay, they will be very good next year. If not, it could be pretty rough. If he has two straight sub-par years, he should be facing significant pressure.

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    Hoosier Red (02-23-2014), Revering4Blue (02-24-2014)

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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    I think, for a while, he only recruited kids from Illinois, Indiana and Ohio.
    The program started to go down once RMK started going out of state to recruit, Mike D pretty much refused to recruit Indiana and that was one of his downfalls. If IU and Purdue closed the state borders for recruiting they would contend for Conference titles nearly every yea
    I was in the ORG once, best 6 months of my life.

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    Hoosier Red (02-23-2014)

  12. #968
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Hillsdale87 View Post
    Not a Crean supporter at all and wouldn't be upset if he moves on in a couple years, but I'm not sure this is fair. Why do you give Crean a pass for the last couple years? His last two seasons were impressive. IU overachieved under Crean two years ago, and last year they just peaked too early. But they went into the tournament as a top 3 team. That is commendable. Yes the Sweet 16 loss was disappointing, but Syracuse was a good team too. Yes the #1 seed is expected to win a Sweet 16 game, but not a horrible loss.

    This year has been extremely disappointing, but that does happen sometimes. UK last year is a great example, but nobody was looking to get rid of Coach Cal last year (I understand that Crean is not quite on Cal's level). IU this year is actually pretty comparable to UK's team last year. They lost a lot of guys from the previous year, and then most of the new guys didn't play as expected. For this team, Yogi is the only consistent offensive player. Vonleh is great on the boards, but he's inconsistent on offense. Sheehey, Hollowell, and Parea were all expected to make big improvements this year, and they have not done that. It actually looks like they've regressed. And Gordon, who was expected to be a solid contributor, has basically been an offensive zero.

    I don't think it's fair to judge Crean based on this year. But we'll see what happens in the next couple years. If he can somehow get Vonleh to stay, they will be very good next year. If not, it could be pretty rough. If he has two straight sub-par years, he should be facing significant pressure.
    The pass on my end was due to my admiration of what CTC came into and how he handled it.
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

  13. #969
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfanmia View Post
    The program started to go down once RMK started going out of state to recruit, Mike D pretty much refused to recruit Indiana and that was one of his downfalls. If IU and Purdue closed the state borders for recruiting they would contend for Conference titles nearly every yea
    I disagree. Let me see.............Quinn Buckner, Scott May, Butch Carter, Isiah Thomas, Jim Thomas, Tony Brown, Dean Garrett, Keith Smart?????????

    RMK's downfall was when guys from out of state weren't as good as the hype.....Andrae Patterson, Charlie Miller, Richard Mandeville, Jason Collier...etc.

    But I will agree that IU doesn't need to go outside the state to find competitive talent.
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

  14. #970
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    Good ole Uwe!

    One thing people forget about concerning the 70's and into the 80's is that Purdue was pretty dang good as well. It aint like RMK had this state to himself.
    This is so true. Notre Dame was also a top-flight program back then and even though very few ND players played high school ball in Indiana, a great deal of them played high school ball in Knight's prime recruiting area of Illinois and Ohio. John Paxson, for example, was from Dayton, IIRC.
    "I have just been more than a little suspect of all the trades since the Willy (Scott Williamson) cash grab. That one left such a bad taste in my mouth that even a 1985 Dom Pérignon couldn't cleanse it." -- Creek14

  15. #971
    All Fired Up Revering4Blue's Avatar
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfanmia View Post
    The program started to go down once RMK started going out of state to recruit, Mike D pretty much refused to recruit Indiana and that was one of his downfalls. If IU and Purdue closed the state borders for recruiting they would contend for Conference titles nearly every yea
    For the most part, this post is spot-on, IMO. The bolded point is where I slightly disagree. IMO, it wasn't so much RMK going out of state that started the downfall; it was also RMK spending too much time and energy outside of the areas that Chip mentioned: Illinois and Ohio and later on he basically spent very little time and energy recruiting altogether -- Jared Jeffries, who was right in his own backyard, a notable exception.

    And to piggyback on Assembly Hall's spot-on post about both successful and underachieving recruits from outside of the state of Indiana -- some of whom were from well outside of the Tri - State (Indiana, Illinois and Ohio) -- it also didn't help that some prized recruits from within the state of Indiana either transferred for whatever reason (Luke Recker) or proved to be complete knuckleheads (Sherron Wilkerson), which resulted in attempting to fill the transfer void with JUCOs that never really panned out.

    While one can argue, as I do, that at least on paper, Knight's final teams following the '94 Sweet 16 entry should have better than they were. Why they were not is anyone's guess.

    Either, as AH pointed out -- and also redsfanmia in a previous post some time ago -- highly -touted recruits as they were, they simply were not that talented. It is also painfully obvious now that some who arrived after the '94 Sweet 16 team were not at all receptive to Knight's style of coaching. Lastly, team chemistry: As we all know, College or Pro, no matter how good you look on paper, instead of blending well into a cohesive unit, teams sometimes mix together like Whiskey and Ovaltine. Thems the breaks.
    "I have just been more than a little suspect of all the trades since the Willy (Scott Williamson) cash grab. That one left such a bad taste in my mouth that even a 1985 Dom Pérignon couldn't cleanse it." -- Creek14

  16. #972
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Revering4Blue View Post
    This is so true. Notre Dame was also a top-flight program back then and even though very few ND players played high school ball in Indiana, a great deal of them played high school ball in Knight's prime recruiting area of Illinois and Ohio. John Paxson, for example, was from Dayton, IIRC.
    It is kind of ironic that quite a few of the Notre Dame buddies I have say that Notre Dame went in the tank when they started recruiting Indiana kids!
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

  17. #973
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Revering4Blue View Post
    And to piggyback on Assembly Hall's spot-on post about both successful and underachieving recruits from outside of the state of Indiana -- some of whom were from well outside of the Tri - State (Indiana, Illinois and Ohio) -- it also didn't help that some prized recruits from within the state of Indiana either transferred for whatever reason (Luke Recker) or proved to be complete knuckleheads (Sherron Wilkerson), which resulted in attempting to fill the transfer void with JUCOs that never really panned out.

    While one can argue, as I do, that at least on paper, Knight's final teams following the '94 Sweet 16 entry should have better than they were. Why they were not is anyone's guess.
    Those years after the '94 season were something else. I'd get my hopes up and the season would end miserably. One guy I always scratched my head about was Michael Lewis.
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

  18. #974
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    Those years after the '94 season were something else. I'd get my hopes up and the season would end miserably. One guy I always scratched my head about was Michael Lewis.
    My freshman year at IU was '96-'97. It's funny because I honestly remember that class to be a disappointment, but Lewis finished as the all time assist leader at IU and Guyton was an All-American.
    When people say that I don’t know what I’m talking about when it comes to sports or writing, I think: Man, you should see me in the rest of my life.
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  19. #975
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    Re: Indiana Basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoosier Red View Post
    My freshman year at IU was '96-'97. It's funny because I honestly remember that class to be a disappointment, but Lewis finished as the all time assist leader at IU and Guyton was an All-American.
    Michael Lewis was a scorer in high school. I do believe he led the state his senior year at over 30 ppg. He gets to IU and he forgets to shoot? Guyton was something else, he was a player.
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.


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