Turn Off Ads?
Page 42 of 68 FirstFirst ... 3238394041424344454652 ... LastLast
Results 616 to 630 of 1007

Thread: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

  1. #616
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta, aka, the most prosperous city in the world.
    Posts
    10,528

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    If the team asked him to do something and he said no, I worked hard to get where I am at this position, what would you call that if not selfish or me first? The team, if they asked him to move to left field, clearly thought that was the best thing for the team (otherwise they wouldn't have asked).

    Doesn't matter really. Not worth getting into a big debate about it. Votto is at first for the Reds for a very long time. Alonso is with another team. We have Mat Latos. I don't think anyone is bothered at all by a single one of those things.
    I think many are bothered by you labeling Votto "selfish".

    If your employer wanted to to move to Bugtussel "for the good of the company" and you refused, are you "selfish"? If they wanted you to to manange a different group of people (a group you dispised) "for the good of the company" are you being selfish?

    Just because a player/employee doesn't do exactly what may be in the best interests of their organization doesn't mean they deserve a label of "selfish". You are entitled to weigh the interest of your organization with your own personal interests.

    And I don't recall that it's settled in stone that Votto was actually and formally asked to move to LF, it was just speculated that he might have been.

  2. Likes:

    Boss-Hog (04-25-2013), Hoosier Red (04-25-2013), traderumor (04-25-2013)

  3. Turn Off Ads?
  4. #617
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    7,805

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Some guys earn that right.... and that is why the Yankees defense sucks and has for years at shortstop. It is why the Reds defense was so terrible for years with Griffey in center when it was clear that he had no range at all anymore. There is a fine line between ego and what is best for the team, and teams often go with the ego of a star player. I get that. But let's not pretend that it is always the best option for the team either. Sometimes it works out. Sometimes it doesn't.
    That seems reasonable. However I don't think any of us out here in the peanut gallery have the right to assertively say he is/was selfish.

  5. Likes:

    traderumor (04-25-2013)

  6. #618
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    297

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    doug..sometimes you post the dumbest things on here..and then continue to try and back it up with what you would like to think are good points..but i guess its good entertainment

  7. #619
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    34,860

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by coachpipe View Post
    doug..sometimes you post the dumbest things on here..and then continue to try and back it up with what you would like to think are good points..but i guess its good entertainment
    Yet I know when to capitalize letters while typing and you can't seem to figure it out while calling someone else dumb.

  8. Likes:

    *BaseClogger* (04-25-2013)

  9. #620
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    7,132

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    I think many are bothered by you labeling Votto "selfish".

    If your employer wanted to to move to Bugtussel "for the good of the company" and you refused, are you "selfish"? If they wanted you to to manange a different group of people (a group you dispised) "for the good of the company" are you being selfish?

    Just because a player/employee doesn't do exactly what may be in the best interests of their organization doesn't mean they deserve a label of "selfish". You are entitled to weigh the interest of your organization with your own personal interests.

    And I don't recall that it's settled in stone that Votto was actually and formally asked to move to LF, it was just speculated that he might have been.

    I think this point is spot on. If he was in fact asked, but said, "No" then he is in fact thinking of himself first.

    But considering one's self interests does not make one "selfish." It doesn't even make the decision inherently "selfish" as there's a lot more give and take that we're not at all privy too. As in, there's a difference between, saying, "Absolutely refuse to go," and "I don't think I'd be comfortable with that move,"

    And even if we decide that particular decision was selfish(for the record, I wouldn't), it doesn't mean he should be labeled selfish as one selfish decision should not outweigh a number of unselfish decisions he could have made.
    When people say that I donít know what Iím talking about when it comes to sports or writing, I think: Man, you should see me in the rest of my life.
    ---Joe Posnanski

  10. #621
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    34,860

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    I think many are bothered by you labeling Votto "selfish".

    If your employer wanted to to move to Bugtussel "for the good of the company" and you refused, are you "selfish"? If they wanted you to to manange a different group of people (a group you dispised) "for the good of the company" are you being selfish?

    Just because a player/employee doesn't do exactly what may be in the best interests of their organization doesn't mean they deserve a label of "selfish". You are entitled to weigh the interest of your organization with your own personal interests.

    And I don't recall that it's settled in stone that Votto was actually and formally asked to move to LF, it was just speculated that he might have been.
    Apples and Oranges. Joey Votto wasn't moving to a different place. They weren't asking him to oversee different people.

    And as I said, we can't be certain that Votto was asked, but can we be intellectually honest and think that the Reds never approached Votto to ask him to move before they even began thinking about playing an unathletic and slow player like Alonso to left given that the Reds had already had Votto playing left field in recent years? We may not know for sure, but I think anyone looking at the situation can probably agree that the odds were very good that the Reds at least asked him about the situation.

  11. #622
    Member mattfeet's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    1,745

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by coachpipe View Post
    doug..sometimes you post the dumbest things on here..and then continue to try and back it up with what you would like to think are good points..but i guess its good entertainment
    Let's keep it civil in here, folks. You too, Doug.

  12. #623
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    28,136

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Moving a GG 1B to LF would have been insanity. Messing with Joey Votto to accommodate Yonder Alonso also would have been insanity. Whoever was against it, whoever stopped it from happening, I'm thankful.

    Trading Yonder Alonso in a package for a stud pitcher? I don't have enough thumbs to put up to signal my approval of that.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

  13. Likes:

    alwaysawarrior (04-25-2013), Boss-Hog (04-25-2013), Caveat Emperor (04-25-2013), jimbo (04-25-2013), Number_Fourteen (04-25-2013), OnBaseMachine (04-25-2013), WildcatFan (04-25-2013), Wonderful Monds (04-25-2013)

  14. #624
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    34,860

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Moving a GG 1B to LF would have been insanity. Messing with Joey Votto to accommodate Yonder Alonso also would have been insanity. Whoever was against it, whoever stopped it from happening, I'm thankful.

    Trading Yonder Alonso in a package for a stud pitcher? I don't have enough thumbs to put up to signal my approval of that.
    Don't confuse the two things. I am beyond thrilled to have traded Alonso and the others for Mat Latos. I would do it a billion times without ever thinking twice about it.

    But, at the time that Votto would have been approached for a move, no one had a clue that Mat Latos was on the table as an option.

  15. #625
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    297

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Yet I know when to capitalize letters while typing and you can't seem to figure it out while calling someone else dumb.
    I forgot that without capital letters the words mean different things

  16. #626
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    28,136

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Don't confuse the two things. I am beyond thrilled to have traded Alonso and the others for Mat Latos. I would do it a billion times without ever thinking twice about it.

    But, at the time that Votto would have been approached for a move, no one had a clue that Mat Latos was on the table as an option.
    Fair point, but I'm still happy Votto wasn't shifted to play Alonso at 1B. Like I said, whoever put the brakes on that idea is a personal hero of mine.

    As an aside, Alonso always was trade bait. It wasn't if so much as when with him. Getting Latos was just fabulous execution of an inevitable transaction.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

  17. #627
    Start the Reactor! *BaseClogger*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Midland, MI
    Posts
    6,410

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Can't it be selfish and a good thing? Yeesh y'all can be uptight sometimes...
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

  18. Likes:

    OGB (04-25-2013), Patrick Bateman (04-25-2013)

  19. #628
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    34,860

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    I think many are bothered by you labeling Votto "selfish".
    They are bothered by it because Votto is "our guy".

  20. #629
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Right Down Broadway
    Posts
    18,574

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Apples and Oranges. Joey Votto wasn't moving to a different place. They weren't asking him to oversee different people.

    And as I said, we can't be certain that Votto was asked, but can we be intellectually honest and think that the Reds never approached Votto to ask him to move before they even began thinking about playing an unathletic and slow player like Alonso to left given that the Reds had already had Votto playing left field in recent years? We may not know for sure, but I think anyone looking at the situation can probably agree that the odds were very good that the Reds at least asked him about the situation.
    I'm not following. You have a stud hitter and gold glove 1st baseman just entering the prime of his career and a guy who doesn't even play a very good 1b in the minors, blocked. So its natural to assume that they ask one of the top players in the game to make a dramatic position change to accomodate a blocked minor leaguer?

    I'd be more of the mind it wasn't even brought up to Votto with the current regime. Now, if we're talking the O'Brien or Bowden years, then maybe, there were a lot of dumb ideas floating around back then. But I'd have to give the current management team more credit for not even asking their stud in the name of "for the good of the team" to move to the outfield.
    Can't win with 'em

    Can't win without 'em

  21. #630
    Burn It Jamz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    413

    Re: Tracking - Alonso, Grandal, Volquez, Boxberger, Sappelt, Wood, Torreyes

    Or maybe Votto was thinking about the team when he offered his opinion? Regardless of what happened the team has the final say. If they wanted him in left he would have played in left. They probably asked him about it, and he probably wasn't fond of the idea 1) because he didn't want to move there and 2) because he has very little to no experience there. I can't call it a completely selfish decision as it likely was the right one not only for Joey but also for the team.
    I see great things in baseball. It's our game.


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25