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Thread: Is Cueto really an ace?

  1. #46
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    K's are the HR's of pitchers... Sexy and overrated...

    Gimme a guy that gets on base and advances runners...

    Gimme a guy that keeps guys off of the bases and goes deep in games.

    Too bad that makes for boring articles for our professional bloggers.
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  3. #47
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by REDblooded View Post
    K's are the HR's of pitchers... Sexy and overrated...

    Gimme a guy that gets on base and advances runners...

    Gimme a guy that keeps guys off of the bases and goes deep in games.

    Too bad that makes for boring articles for our professional bloggers.
    It is generally tougher to keep guys off the bases when you are letting them put it in play.

  4. #48
    SERP deep cover ops WebScorpion's Avatar
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    It is generally tougher to keep guys off the bases when you are letting them put it in play.
    Conversely, it's generally tougher to pitch deep into a game when you are striking out batters rather than getting quick ground outs and popouts.

    "Okay you guys, pair up in threes!" --Yogi Berra

  5. #49
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by WebScorpion View Post
    Conversely, it's generally tougher to pitch deep into a game when you are striking out batters rather than getting quick ground outs and popouts.
    Justin Verlander disagrees with you completely. The key to going deeper into games is avoiding walks, not avoiding strikeouts.

  6. #50
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Always dug Cueto. I don't get the fretting over his K rate. He's far from deficient in that category.

    As others have mentioned, his main need is to boost the IP. The guy has stuff. He's 26. He's already got solid career numbers despite coming up at an extremely young age.

    Is he an ace? It takes multiple awesome years to enter that territory. In the meantime he's a pretty damn good pitcher. Enjoy that, because it's not like the Reds have had a whole lot of those over the years.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

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  7. #51
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Always dug Cueto. I don't get the fretting over his K rate. He's far from deficient in that category.

    As others have mentioned, his main need is to boost the IP. The guy has stuff. He's 26. He's already got solid career numbers despite coming up at an extremely young age.

    Is he an ace? It takes multiple awesome years to enter that territory. In the meantime he's a pretty damn good pitcher. Enjoy that, because it's not like the Reds have had a whole lot of those over the years.
    Having control of his cabeza has always been more of a struggle for Cueto that control of his pitches. I'm thrilled to see him get control of that very critical ingredient for star pitching.
    Baseball is like church. Many attend, few understand

  8. #52
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by WebScorpion View Post
    Conversely, it's generally tougher to pitch deep into a game when you are striking out batters rather than getting quick ground outs and popouts.
    How does one make a hitter hit the ball at someone?

    This must be some incredible skill.

  9. #53
    Lets Go 'Bird' Hunting The Voice of IH's Avatar
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom Heffner View Post
    How does one make a hitter hit the ball at someone?

    This must be some incredible skill.
    Keeping hitters off balance?
    Hey Sparky! Indian Hill English teachers taught me everything I know!

  10. #54
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom Heffner View Post
    How does one make a hitter hit the ball at someone?

    This must be some incredible skill.
    Weakly hit infield grounders typically end up in a glove.
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  11. #55
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by REDblooded View Post
    Weakly hit infield grounders typically end up in a glove.
    Who routinely does that?
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  12. #56
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Let em hit the ball but keep them off balance - the skill isn't in keeping them from hitting it at someone Dom - it's in the simple law of averages. We KNOW that hitters putting the ball in play will only get on at a base rate of 3 times per 10 attempts - if you don't walk many hitters, K a few to help you out of jams, and aren't letting them smash the ball hard and dead center then you should pitch effectively just on averages. Add an outstanding defense to help edge the averages in your favor a tad more and yes - pitching to contact works if you think of it in terms of letting batters hit it in an off balance not quite solidly kind of way. The skill is in keeping big league professional hitters off balance so they aren't smashing it.

  13. #57
    Maple SERP savafan's Avatar
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    I honestly have to wonder if some peoples' obsession with number crunching every stat ruins the enjoyment of the game for them.

    Real time results are what matter, not the potential of sustaining them in the future at this present time. Right now, Cueto is pitching with Ace-like results. Enjoy that!
    My dad got to enjoy 3 Reds World Championships by the time he was my age. So far, I've only gotten to enjoy one. Step it up Redlegs!

  14. #58
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
    I honestly have to wonder if some peoples' obsession with number crunching every stat ruins the enjoyment of the game for them.

    Real time results are what matter, not the potential of sustaining them in the future at this present time. Right now, Cueto is pitching with Ace-like results. Enjoy that!
    I tend to think that those obsessed with real time results actually fail to appreciate a majority of what happens in the game.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  15. #59
    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
    I honestly have to wonder if some peoples' obsession with number crunching every stat ruins the enjoyment of the game for them.

    Real time results are what matter, not the potential of sustaining them in the future at this present time. Right now, Cueto is pitching with Ace-like results. Enjoy that!
    Rest assured sava, everyone on here is enjoying the results. There's no debating that.

    But sustainability is important -- especially when you care about the future of the franchise you love. That is why we're on this board in the first place, after all -- because we care about the present and future of the Reds -- right? And wouldn't you grant that if there's a way to better understand whether or not Cueto is going to continue doing what he's doing, then we should discuss that rather than just writing platitudes about how great he's doing?
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  16. #60
    Maple SERP savafan's Avatar
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    Re: Is Cueto really an ace?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post

    But sustainability is important -- especially when you care about the future of the franchise you love. That is why we're on this board in the first place, after all -- because we care about the present and future of the Reds -- right? And wouldn't you grant that if there's a way to better understand whether or not Cueto is going to continue doing what he's doing, then we should discuss that rather than just writing platitudes about how great he's doing?
    Sure, but I keep seeing the same people say over and over that Cueto can't sustain his success, while he actually has been doing a pretty good job of sustaining it thus far. The same people have tried hammering into my head that Homer Bailey's peripherals show him to be on the verge of high sustainability of considerable major league success, while he's never come close to putting it all together. I just feel that 10, 15, 20 years down the road, if Homer continues to fail and never comes close to what they envision him to be, they still won't believe that he was a bad starting pitcher, while if Cueto somehow manages to rein in a Cy Young or two, they'll just say that he's lucky and truly a middle of the pack starting pitcher.
    My dad got to enjoy 3 Reds World Championships by the time he was my age. So far, I've only gotten to enjoy one. Step it up Redlegs!


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