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Thread: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

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    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    http://www.baseballamerica.com/today...2/2613347.html

    Why He's Here: 1-0, 0.00, 1 GS, 5 IP, 3 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 9 SO
    The Scoop: This shouldn't be possible. We're more than a month into the season and the pitcher who leads the minors in ERA is a pitcher from the California League. You know the California League? It's the one where one bad outing can make an ERA look like the moniker for Boeing's latest jet. Not only has the former Rice lefthander avoided a bad outing, he's yet to have a bad inning. Cingrani did allow a pair of runs, one of which was earned, in his second start of the season. Since then he's thrown 18 scoreless innings, allowing eight hits and three walks while striking out 26. Cingrani had an 8.59 ERA when Rice tried starting him in college, but his 0.32 ERA this year makes it clear that starting now suits him.

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    http://www.baseballamerica.com/today...2/2613347.html

    Why He's Here: 1-0, 0.00, 1 GS, 5 IP, 3 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 9 SO
    The Scoop: This shouldn't be possible. We're more than a month into the season and the pitcher who leads the minors in ERA is a pitcher from the California League. You know the California League? It's the one where one bad outing can make an ERA look like the moniker for Boeing's latest jet. Not only has the former Rice lefthander avoided a bad outing, he's yet to have a bad inning. Cingrani did allow a pair of runs, one of which was earned, in his second start of the season. Since then he's thrown 18 scoreless innings, allowing eight hits and three walks while striking out 26. Cingrani had an 8.59 ERA when Rice tried starting him in college, but his 0.32 ERA this year makes it clear that starting now suits him.
    A few simple questions.

    How good a prospect is Cingrani? Early success or the real article.

    Is Cingrani as good a prospect as Corcino?

    Will Cingrani get promoted to AA mid-season?

    Is Cingrani a likely starting pitcher at higher levels?

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    A few simple questions.

    How good a prospect is Cingrani? Early success or the real article.

    Is Cingrani as good a prospect as Corcino?

    Will Cingrani get promoted to AA mid-season?

    Is Cingrani a likely starting pitcher at higher levels?
    Those are the questions everyone has at this point with him...
    "When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail"

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    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    A few simple questions.

    How good a prospect is Cingrani? Early success or the real article.

    Is Cingrani as good a prospect as Corcino?

    Will Cingrani get promoted to AA mid-season?

    Is Cingrani a likely starting pitcher at higher levels?
    1. He is a good, but not great prospect. Has some things he needs to work on, but you wouldn't know if by the numbers.

    2. No, he isn't. His secondary stuff simply isn't on par with Corcino right now. He also doesn't use his secondary stuff too much at this point either. He will mix in a slider from time to time, but he doesn't seem to trust his change up much. It wouldn't surprise me if he were out there throwing 75% fastballs and 20% sliders. I have not seen him pitch this year though aside from the spring showcase. Plenty of scouts still think his future is in the bullpen, though some think he can stay as a starter.

    3. Very likely.

    4. I imagine he will be. Now, whether he stays a starter when he gets to the Majors, I can't say. But I doubt the Reds take him out of the starting role anytime soon given what he has done and what he could do if he can refine his secondary offerings and show some trust in them.

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    A few simple questions.

    How good a prospect is Cingrani? Early success or the real article.

    Is Cingrani as good a prospect as Corcino?

    Will Cingrani get promoted to AA mid-season?

    Is Cingrani a likely starting pitcher at higher levels?
    1. At this point, too early to tell. But he's been out of this world so far (18 starts).

    2. Maybe. His fastball is better. His secondary stuff is not. I'm a big believer in a fastball with life carrying most pitchers most of the way. He doesn't need a great off-speed pitch-- only a decent one.

    3. Likely, especially if he continues to pitch well.

    4. Maybe. At this point, he's looking like a MOR starter (or better) or perhaps a closer/ late inning relief guy. Lots of value in either of those.
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Thanks to both of you for your responses.

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    I am at a loss why an organization would be unable to develop secondary pitchers for a live arm and good pitcher yet it does happen all the time. With who know how many scouts, vets, pitching coaches, catching coaches, roving coaches, and enough money involved that a decent prospect can focus all his time on professional improvement I am stunned at the lack of development at times. Just a venting. Hopefully they can improve Cingrani's repatoire.


    Oh former Reds prospect Ron Torreyes made the Not So Hot list, I hope he turns it around.
    • Ronald Torreyes, 2b, Cubs: Torreyes has shown some good things and some bad early in the high Class A Florida State League season. The pint-sized second baseman is hitting just .205/.274/.289 in 23 games, including a 1-for-25 (.040) stretch over the past week. The good news is that Torreyes' terrific hand-eye coordination and bat control have not deserted him. Even this past week, he has not struck out once, and he only has seven strikeouts all season. His early performance has been underwhelming, but as a 19-year-old in the FSL, there's no need to panic here.
    Last edited by klw; 05-04-2012 at 04:53 PM.

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    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    klw, every organization has that problem. If they didn't, a lot of pitchers would be a whole lot better than they are.

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    One of the big things that happened to him was he revamped his delivery prior to the draft his senior year and it really benefited him. Here's an article on his senior year at Rice.

    http://www.foxsportshouston.com/06/0...blockID=531226

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Quote Originally Posted by klw View Post
    I am at a loss why an organization would be unable to develop secondary pitchers for a live arm and good pitcher yet it does happen all the time. With who know how many scouts, vets, pitching coaches, catching coaches, roving coaches, and enough money involved that a decent prospect can focus all his time on professional improvement I am stunned at the lack of development at times. Just a venting. Hopefully they can improve Cingrani's repatoire.


    Oh former Reds prospect Ron Torreyes made the Not So Hot list, I hope he turns it around.
    Not sure where to find minor league BABIP, but Torreyes' has to stink big time.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    Not sure where to find minor league BABIP, but Torreyes' has to stink big time.
    http://statcorner.com/batter.php?id=591720
    This is a decent site. Not sure how current this year's stats are.

    .218 BTW.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    Not sure where to find minor league BABIP, but Torreyes' has to stink big time.
    Are you saying his .364 batting average before this year might not have been sustainable?

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Reminds me of when Cueto and Bailey were in the minors developing. Everyone was talking about Bailey all the time, but I was watching Cueto's development. He stuck in the majors ahead of Bailey.

    It reminds me of the NFL combine where they measure all kinds of things but heart and determination.

    Cingrani may be poised to surprise everyone.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Quote Originally Posted by Vottomatic View Post
    Reminds me of when Cueto and Bailey were in the minors developing. Everyone was talking about Bailey all the time, but I was watching Cueto's development. He stuck in the majors ahead of Bailey.

    It reminds me of the NFL combine where they measure all kinds of things but heart and determination.

    Cingrani may be poised to surprise everyone.
    Cueto and Bailey are two completely different pitchers. Bailey has generally stunk early in the season while he waits for his stamina to build up into the "cannon". Cueto was the better "pitchers" prospect, while Bailey the better thrower sans the 2008 mess. Bailey has plenty of heart and determination considering how much he struggles at times early in the year. Just to nab the production they have gotten from him at this point, is very nice.

    The injury bug really set Bailey back in that regard. Instead of the surge in velocity and arm speed he would get around Memorial Day, it was shoulder problems. Bailey needs to throw well to max his potential at this point. He is making little strides every year becoming a better pitcher, but he still needs to throw better if you want TOR production. We got a little whiff of that his last start, with the last 2 batters, he turned it up to 95-96, they had no chance.

    Health permitting, I wouldn't be surprised if Cueto doesn't fall off in June/July while Bailey turns up the gas.........with Mat Latos. Not a bad deal.

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    Re: Tony Cingrani #12 on the BA Hot Sheet this week

    Baseball Prospect Nation has posted a scouting report on Mr. Cingrani.
    http://baseballprospectnation.com/20...-cingrani-lhp/

    Basis of Report: Industry Contacts
    Summation: Plus FB and plus command provides very good foundation. Never shown feel for SL or CH. Needs some sort of consistent secondary pitch, possibly even a cutter that adds a horizontal element to his arsenal. Lack of secondary pitches makes it difficult to project as a starter long term. Must prove it against Double- and Triple-A hitters. Profiles better as a reliever right now given lack of depth in arsenal. Unforeseen improvement in SL or CH would change profile dramatically. Intriguing player worth watching at upper levels. Potential 7th/8th inning reliever.


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