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Thread: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

  1. #91
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    If he wasn't a HOF player last June and only OPSd. 750 last year and didn't win the GG and is OPSing. 794 this year what criteria is being used to vote him in in May a year later?


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  3. #92
    Danger is my business! oneupper's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    Bobby Grich should have made it. Lou Whitaker also.
    Brandon will have to one of those fine wine guys (better with age) to have a shot.
    At least he'll get "leadership brownie points" when his name comes up, due to his demeanor.
    It seems like it's been tough for second basemen to get in.
    Cano looks like a lock, though, if he can keep going 4-5 more years.
    "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it."

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    Always Red (05-23-2013)

  5. #93
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    If he wasn't a HOF player last June and only OPSd. 750 last year and didn't win the GG and is OPSing. 794 this year what criteria is being used to vote him in in May a year later?
    Brandon is currently leading the NL in RBI with 40. Don't you know that RBI is the most important stat?
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."

  6. #94
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsBaron View Post
    Brandon is currently leading the NL in RBI with 40. Don't you know that RBI is the most important stat?
    Sure its important!!! The reality is counting stats do matter when a player is done and you are comparing his career. Lets say Brandon Phillips drives in an average of 120 runs over the next 4 years, that would be pretty impressive wouldn't it?

    I don't think Brandon is a HOF nor do I think he will achieve that status. I think he has solidified himself as the best defensive 2b in the game right now. I also think with him in the middle of the order, especially this season, he has the potential to be in the MVP conversation. If he has a run of 4 big years with a MVP what would that do to his HOF status?

  7. #95
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    Sure its important!!! The reality is counting stats do matter when a player is done and you are comparing his career. Lets say Brandon Phillips drives in an average of 120 runs over the next 4 years, that would be pretty impressive wouldn't it?

    I don't think Brandon is a HOF nor do I think he will achieve that status. I think he has solidified himself as the best defensive 2b in the game right now. I also think with him in the middle of the order, especially this season, he has the potential to be in the MVP conversation. If he has a run of 4 big years with a MVP what would that do to his HOF status?
    Career RBI is determined by three things

    1. Great players
    2. Longevity
    3. High scoring environments

    Of the top ten guys all but Eddie Murray played a portion (if not all) in a high scoring environment and 1/2 of them have over 10000 ab's.

    Code:
    CAREER
    AT BATS displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    
    RBI                             RBI      AB     
    1    Hank Aaron                 2297    12364   
    2    Babe Ruth                  2210     8399   
    3    Barry Bonds                1996     9847   
    4    Lou Gehrig                 1995     8001   
    5    Stan Musial                1951    10972   
    6    Alex Rodriguez             1950     9662   
    7    Ty Cobb                    1933    11434   
    8    Jimmie Foxx                1921     8134   
    9    Eddie Murray               1917    11336   
    10   Willie Mays                1903    10881
    So let's look at Brandon's compared to active players at the end of last year.

    Tied with Jeff Francoeur

    Code:
    RBI                             RBI      AB     
    1    Alex Rodriguez             1950     9662   
    2    Jim Thome                  1699     8422   
    3    Chipper Jones              1623     8984   
    4    Albert Pujols              1434     6919   
    5    Jason Giambi               1405     7021   
    6    Carlos Lee                 1363     7983   
    7    Bobby Abreu                1349     8347   
    8    Todd Helton                1346     7565   
    9    Paul Konerko               1336     7718   
    10   David Ortiz                1326     6539   
    11   Andruw Jones               1289     7599   
    12   Scott Rolen                1287     7398   
    13   Derek Jeter                1254    10551   
    14   Carlos Beltran             1243     7314   
    15   Aramis Ramirez             1227     6863   
    16   Adrian Beltre              1215     7965   
    17   Lance Berkman              1200     6235   
    18   Torii Hunter               1143     7181   
    19   Johnny Damon               1139     9736   
    20   Miguel Cabrera             1123     5663   
    21   Raul Ibanez                1116     6771   
    22   Mark Teixeira              1101     5664   
    23   Alfonso Soriano            1035     6943   
    24   Adam Dunn                  1018     5929   
    25   Michael Young               984     7399   
    26   Omar Vizquel                951    10586   
    27   Ryan Howard                 920     4054   
    28   Vernon Wells                908     6218   
    29   Aubrey Huff                 904     6104   
    30   Matt Holliday               872     4878   
    31   Eric Chavez                 850     5221   
    32   David Wright                818     4742   
    33   Jimmy Rollins               793     7490   
    34   Carlos Pena                 791     4610   
    35   Justin Morneau              786     4254   
    36   Prince Fielder              764     4108   
    37   Hideki Matsui               760     4442   
    38   Ramon Hernandez             751     5057   
    39   Adrian Gonzalez             750     4426   
    40   Chase Utley                 739     4434   
    41   Jason Bay                   734     4299   
    42   A.J. Pierzynski             730     5795   
    43   Robinson Cano               715     4731   
    44   Mark Kotsay                 708     6309   
    45   Placido Polanco             700     6837   
    46   Travis Hafner               694     3796   
    47   Adam LaRoche                684     4159   
    48   Alex Gonzalez               680     5633   
    49   Nick Swisher                673     4241   
    50   Carl Crawford               667     5615   
    51   Ichiro Suzuki               660     8085   
    52   Juan Uribe                  644     4789   
    T53  Jhonny Peralta              643     4708   
    T53  Ryan Braun                  643     3477   
    55   Brandon Inge                641     4909   
    56   Michael Cuddyer             639     4430   
    57   Alex Rios                   627     4926   
    58   Dan Uggla                   625     4050   
    59   Kevin Youkilis              610     3644   
    60   Brian McCann                604     3507   
    T61  Brandon Phillips            601     4577   
    T61  Jeff Francoeur              601     4358   
    63   Ryan Zimmerman              593     3861   
    T64  Curtis Granderson           591     4224   
    T64  Ty Wigginton                591     4422   
    66   Joe Mauer                   587     3933   
    67   Rafael Furcal               585     6441   
    68   Lyle Overbay                581     4399   
    69   Adam Kennedy                571     5473   
    70   Josh Hamilton               553     2825   
    71   Nick Markakis               549     4055   
    72   Josh Willingham             544     3226   
    73   Orlando Hudson              542     4825   
    74   Juan Rivera                 539     3471   
    75   Andre Ethier                535     3524   
    76   Ryan Ludwick                530     3063   
    T77  Hanley Ramirez              526     3924   
    T77  Matt Kemp                   526     3265   
    79   Jason Kubel                 519     3065   
    T80  Eric Hinske                 516     3745   
    T80  Hunter Pence                516     3473   
    82   Aaron Hill                  510     4059   
    83   Juan Pierre                 509     7217   
    84   Corey Hart                  508     3443   
    85   Jose Bautista               503     3168   
    86   Edwin Encarnacion           502     3273   
    87   Mark Reynolds               501     2973   
    88   Jayson Werth                495     3380   
    89   Austin Kearns               494     3579   
    90   Mark Ellis                  490     4506   
    91   David DeJesus               486     4303   
    T92  Brian Roberts               482     4949   
    T92  Delmon Young                482     3358   
    T94  Jose Lopez                  480     3841   
    T94  Rod Barajas                 480     3460   
    T94  Billy Butler                480     3186   
    T94  Geoff Blum                  480     3966   
    T94  Jose Reyes                  480     5095   
    99   Miguel Olivo                479     3668   
    100  Marco Scutaro               478     4388

  8. #96
    Danger is my business! oneupper's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    If you want to see how things could go wrong, check Orlando Hudson's numbers through age 31. Pretty much like Brandon's (or better).
    Three years later, he's out of baseball.
    "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it."

    http://dalmady.blogspot.com

  9. #97
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    Quote Originally Posted by oneupper View Post
    If you want to see how things could go wrong, check Orlando Hudson's numbers through age 31. Pretty much like Brandon's (or better).
    Three years later, he's out of baseball.
    The O-Dog came to mind for me too.
    “I don’t care,” Votto said of passing his friend and former teammate. “He’s in the past. Bye-bye, Jay.”

  10. #98
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    Code:
    CAREER
    1993-2012
    2B
    AGE <= 32
    OBA displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    SLG displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    AT BATS displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    
    OPS                             OPS      OBA      SLG      AB     
    1    Chase Utley                .882     .377     .505     4133   
    2    Craig Biggio               .875     .399     .476     3470   
    3    Roberto Alomar             .869     .388     .482     4259   
    4    Jeff Kent                  .859     .353     .506     3587   
    5    Robinson Cano              .854     .351     .503     4731   
    6    Dustin Pedroia             .830     .369     .461     3388   
    7    Jose Vidro                 .828     .365     .463     4088   
    8    Alfonso Soriano            .825     .322     .503     3197   
    9    Chuck Knoblauch            .824     .391     .433     4380   
    10   Dan Uggla                  .813     .343     .469     4050   
    11   Ian Kinsler                .811     .350     .460     3656   
    12   Todd Walker                .798     .352     .447     3826   
    13   Ray Durham                 .788     .354     .434     5360   
    14   Brian Roberts              .784     .360     .424     4447   
    15   Marcus Giles               .782     .353     .429     2934   
    16   Placido Polanco            .781     .356     .425     3667   
    17   Rickie Weeks               .779     .350     .429     3454   
    18   Jose Offerman              .776     .373     .404     2592   
    19   Kelly Johnson              .771     .339     .432     3008   
    20   Orlando Hudson             .770     .346     .424     4167   
    21   Eric Young                 .769     .372     .397     2954   
    22   Carlos Baerga              .764     .328     .436     3105   
    23   Bret Boone                 .762     .323     .439     4405   
    24   Aaron Hill                 .762     .325     .437     3698   
    25   Howie Kendrick             .758     .330     .429     2755   
    26   Brandon Phillips           .755     .322     .433     4577   
    27   Damion Easley              .752     .338     .414     3677   
    28   Ron Belliard               .750     .338     .412     4323   
    29   Fernando Vina              .747     .356     .391     3244   
    30   Joey Cora                  .743     .352     .391     2422   
    31   Mark Ellis                 .740     .333     .407     3175   
    32   Delino DeShields           .736     .352     .384     3690   
    33   Quilvio Veras              .734     .372     .362     2780   
    34   Mike Lansing               .730     .323     .408     3307   
    35   Mickey Morandini           .730     .352     .378     2867

  11. #99
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    I'm kinda surprised that Phillips would be seriously considered a HOFer by some.
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  12. #100
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    I'm kinda surprised that Phillips would be seriously considered a HOFer by some.
    It's almost as bad as those thinking Rolen would be an improvement over Frazier.
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

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    Bumstead (05-23-2013)

  14. #101
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    With a career OPS+ of only 97, the better question may be whether or not Brandon is actually a little overrated. Even without the Cleveland years his OPS+ is 102, just slightly above average.

    I still think he is an excellent player, but not HOF

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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    HOF'er? No. Really good player for the Reds and a fan favorite? Yes.

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    New York Red (05-23-2013)

  17. #103
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    In order for Brandon Phillips to make the HOF he would have to improve so dramatically as a hitter over the next 5 seasons that everyone would assume that he was on PEDs and wouldn't vote for him on that basis.

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    George Anderson (05-23-2013)

  19. #104
    nothing more than a fan Always Red's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bumstead View Post
    HOF'er? No. Really good player for the Reds and a fan favorite? Yes.
    Reds Hall of Fame, yes.

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    R_Webb18 (05-23-2013)

  21. #105
    Will post for food BuckeyeRedleg's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips......future Hall of Famer?

    Quote Originally Posted by George Anderson View Post
    It's almost as bad as those thinking Rolen would be an improvement over Frazier.
    Wow. You feel better now?

    You know, I’m not someone that just started posting on the Redzone in last month, George.

    You want to disagree and think there is no way BP has a chance? Fine, tell me why or just say that you don’t think it’s possible. Take a step back. There really is no place for the insulting jab.

    It seems to me that there’s been a bit much of this kind of thing lately. Ridiculing posts. Ridiculing posters. Sure, there have been some questionable posts and even more questionable threads started on some questionable topics. I would think those would fade away from the front page if they were simply ignored. Of course, it’s not possible to fade away when everyone jumps in to tell the poster how stupid they are and then others jump in to pat those jumpers on the back for putting that “stupid” poster in his/her place. Honestly, what if the poster was a kid? What if it the poster was a casual fan that was just starting to get into the Reds? Does it feel good to chase those away? Does that make you feel superior? As an ump, I would think you’d be the opposite of that pack of wolves (mob) mentality. Not you necessarily, but some on here probably spend half of their posts ridiculing posts in one way or another.

    You know, I found this board to pretty damn boring the past few years with the split. It’s been entertaining to see new “blood” on there and to interact with a larger group of people that were “called up” from the Sundeck. Let’s be honest, we all love the Reds and this is a fun thing, but If this is what this place has become, maybe I’ll find another place to discuss the Reds. Too bad it’s when our boys are playing the best baseball they’ve played in a very long time.

    Go back and read my original post one more time. Did that really warrant the dismissive post? And Sean Casey? Yeah okay.

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    membengal (05-24-2013),redsfandan (05-24-2013)


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