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Thread: Trade Targets and Trade Rumors

  1. #16
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    If Arizone would be Hamilton straight up for Upton, I'd drive Slidin' Billy there myself.

    Of course, he's so fast, he'd beat me there running.
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
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  3. #17
    Member cumberlandreds's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan View Post
    Carlos Quentin's slash line since June 8:

    .200/.364/.306/.670

    He came off the DL and was scorching hot, then he slumped. He's still in that funk.
    After watching Quentin for four games over the weekend I don't think he would be much of an upgrade to what the Reds have now. He's certainly not worth any major prospects.
    Reds Fan Since 1971

  4. #18
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    I'd be absolutely amazed if Hamilton were traded. He is going to be an exciting ballplayer and potentially a huge attraction. I don't think he is going any place except Pensacola, Louisville, and then Cincinnati.

    And even if the Reds would consider such a trade, they aren't trading Hamilton for a Carlos Quentin or even a Justin Upton, who the DBacks are suddenly so willing to trade off. Billy is a unique type player and the Reds would demand a king's ransom for him now, which, of course they won't get.

    And consider that Hamilton, with his exciting play and incredible baserunning ability, would be cheap and under the Reds' control for years. He is very, very valuable. No way the Reds trade him now for Upton and his big long-term contract.

    If Hamilton continues to progress, he will bring the Reds a very good player and lots of exposure, fans in the seats, national TV, and the like. If the Reds have any sense of marketing their product and economics, which I believe they do, Billy is going nowhere except up the Reds' chain.
    This was my point. I wasn't necessarily advocating trading him, but if the Reds decide to get into any bidding, they have a very valuable chip.

    Upton is intriguing, but I wonder why Arizona wants to get rid of a 24-year-old with a world of talent when they are just 4 games out of first.
    "I am your child from the future. I'm sorry I didn't tell you this earlier." - Dylan Easton

  5. #19
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Spitball View Post
    This was my point. I wasn't necessarily advocating trading him, but if the Reds decide to get into any bidding, they have a very valuable chip.

    Upton is intriguing, but I wonder why Arizona wants to get rid of a 24-year-old with a world of talent when they are just 4 games out of first.
    Sure, I agree.

    The more I think about it, the more I think the Reds will just add a lefty bat with a good OBP rather than a cleanup guy before the trade deadline.

    The most direct problem right now is getting on base against RHP. I think obtaining a Denard Span or a David DeJesus or even a Seth Smith would cost a lot less in prospects and salary than a Justin Upton.

    I could see an Upton type move in the off-season as the Reds' big upgrade for 2013. Now, in-season, I think a lesser move directly attacking the most obvious problem is more likely.

  6. #20
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    I would love to see us go forward with an OF of Upton, Hamilton and Bruce. That could be epic.

    For me, two things when it comes to Hamilton...
    1. The SB are the sizzle, the steak is that .400+ OBP. The thing that gets me all excited is the idea of him being a .380+ OBP to put at top of our order, even if he steals 15 bases rather than 150 bases.
    2. We talk about moving Hamilton to CF. I think that is a decent option. But I don't think it is the only option. If Hamilton cleans up the defense, I think you could also keep him at SS, then move Cozart to 2B and Phillips to 3B or Cozart to 3B. Phillips is going to be getting up there in years soon and likely is going to start seeing a downgrade in his GG 2B defense. What if Phillips was planned to be Rolen's replacement with Hamilton or Cozart taking his place? Of course, if Frazier keeps up the .900+ OPS, he can have 3B and we'll work around him.

  7. #21
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Sure, I agree.

    The more I think about it, the more I think the Reds will just add a lefty bat with a good OBP rather than a cleanup guy before the trade deadline.

    The most direct problem right now is getting on base against RHP. I think obtaining a Denard Span or a David DeJesus or even a Seth Smith would cost a lot less in prospects and salary than a Justin Upton.

    I could see an Upton type move in the off-season as the Reds' big upgrade for 2013. Now, in-season, I think a lesser move directly attacking the most obvious problem is more likely.
    There is no reason we shouldn't be able to pick up a guy like DeJesus at the deadline at a minimum. He is a perfect fit for this team and should not cost much at all.

  8. #22
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by buckeyenut View Post
    There is no reason we shouldn't be able to pick up a guy like DeJesus at the deadline at a minimum. He is a perfect fit for this team and should not cost much at all.
    Exactly. There's also no reason to wait for the deadline.
    "I prefer books and movies where the conflict isn't of the extreme cannibal apocalypse variety I guess." Redsfaithful

  9. #23
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Sure, I agree.

    The more I think about it, the more I think the Reds will just add a lefty bat with a good OBP rather than a cleanup guy before the trade deadline.

    The most direct problem right now is getting on base against RHP. I think obtaining a Denard Span or a David DeJesus or even a Seth Smith would cost a lot less in prospects and salary than a Justin Upton.

    I could see an Upton type move in the off-season as the Reds' big upgrade for 2013. Now, in-season, I think a lesser move directly attacking the most obvious problem is more likely.
    The problem with this is how often are players of Upton's caliber available in the offseason? How often do 24 year old MVP candidates get traded at all? Especially with three more years of cost certainty.

    The Reds have to be opportunistic when opportunities present themselves. Players like Justin Upton don't go on the market every year. The Reds have enough anchors at the big league level that they could afford to trade some prospects to fill a huge need. This could be like the Latos trade of hitters.

    As far as guys who get on base, Upton has posted an OBP above .350 every year for the last five years. And he's 24 years old. He also steals 20 bases per year, so Dusty could justify batting him 2nd if he needed to.
    Last edited by Benihana; 07-10-2012 at 10:48 AM.
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  10. #24
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Footstool View Post
    Exactly. There's also no reason to wait for the deadline.
    This x20. There are games prior to July 31 that DeJesus or any other potential trade candidate could help the Reds win. If you're going to do it, do it.

  11. #25
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    It takes two to tango. If the Reds are willing to deal "X" for DeJesus, why wouldn't the Cubs wait a few more weeks to see if they can't get someone to trade "X+Y" for DeJesus, perhaps forcing the reds to deal "X+Y+Z" at the end of the day. There is no motivation for the Cubs to deal him for the best deal today when they might be able to work out a better deal next week.

  12. #26
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    The problem with this is how often are players of Upton's caliber available in the offseason? How often do 24 year old MVP candidates get traded at all? Especially with three more years of cost certainty.

    The Reds have to be opportunistic when opportunities present themselves. Players like Justin Upton don't go on the market every year. The Reds have enough anchors at the big league level that they could afford to trade some prospects to fill a huge need. This could be like the Latos trade of hitters.

    As far as guys who get on base, Upton has posted an OBP above .350 every year for the last five years. And he's 24 years old. He also steals 20 bases per year, so Dusty could justify batting him 2nd if he needed to.
    The DBacks have no compelling need to trade Upton now that I know of. I don't think the Reds will dismantle their team or their farm system mid-season to get him. And that's probably what it would take.

    If he is still on the market in the off-season, when the team is formulating itself for 2013, I think there's a better chance.

    The only caveat is that IF Upton has some unknown major problem in Arizona that provides the DBacks with a strong incentive to sell him immediately, then I could see the Reds in the mix for a reasonable deal.

    As I said before, the more likely scenario is a lesser deal now, for a lead off type, lefty OBP guy who is a lot cheaper in dollars and prospects than Upton. Someone who can be obtained without a major upheaval.
    Last edited by Kc61; 07-10-2012 at 11:55 AM.

  13. #27
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Reds/Flyers Fan View Post
    This x20. There are games prior to July 31 that DeJesus or any other potential trade candidate could help the Reds win. If you're going to do it, do it.
    Even if you project the cost for them to decrease heading up to the deadline? Sure you make an offer now, but I imagine the other GM would try to leverage more prospects out of the Reds for an early deal. Every deal is unique, no doubt .

  14. #28
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by buckeyenut View Post
    I would love to see us go forward with an OF of Upton, Hamilton and Bruce. That could be epic.

    For me, two things when it comes to Hamilton...
    1. The SB are the sizzle, the steak is that .400+ OBP. The thing that gets me all excited is the idea of him being a .380+ OBP to put at top of our order, even if he steals 15 bases rather than 150 bases.
    2. We talk about moving Hamilton to CF. I think that is a decent option. But I don't think it is the only option. If Hamilton cleans up the defense, I think you could also keep him at SS, then move Cozart to 2B and Phillips to 3B or Cozart to 3B. Phillips is going to be getting up there in years soon and likely is going to start seeing a downgrade in his GG 2B defense. What if Phillips was planned to be Rolen's replacement with Hamilton or Cozart taking his place? Of course, if Frazier keeps up the .900+ OPS, he can have 3B and we'll work around him.
    I love Cozart, but not so much if you move him off SS. I'd rather have Henry Rodriguez at 2B and Frazier or HRod at 3B. Zach doesn't have the stick to play 3B on anything approaching a regular basis. In my book, if Cozart isn't your starting SS, he's a utility guy.

  15. #29
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    The DBacks have no compelling need to trade Upton now that I know of. I don't think the Reds will dismantle their team or their farm system mid-season to get him. And that's probably what it would take.
    .
    It just seems that Upton is "on the market" every year. I really don't think the Dbacks are serious about trading him. Probably just annually fishing for an overpay.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

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  16. #30
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    Re: Reds Trade Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by corkedbat View Post
    In my book, if Cozart isn't your starting SS, he's a utility guy.
    Actually, I think Cozart is trade bait if Hamilton sticks at SS.
    There's guys much worse than Cozart that had long careers as starting shortstops.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!


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