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Thread: Home Grown Team

  1. #1
    Member Captain Hook's Avatar
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    Home Grown Team

    When's the last time the Reds had three guys pitching in their rotation at such a high level that they can take credit for drafting?My guess is never.Joey Votto is one of if the best players in baseball and they've drafted him along with Bruce, Mesoraco and Stubbs.I'm sure there's a few if not a bunch of guys that I'm forgetting that are currently still in the Reds system or that have been traded that are still excelling at baseball on one level or another.The Reds front office and scouts deserve a ton of credit for what's going on this year at GABP!

    I know there's been some turnover through all of this but is there any one person that you guys know of that has been a constant voice during the drafting process in the organization?
    Last edited by Captain Hook; 07-26-2012 at 04:03 PM.

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    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    1967 - Maloney, Queen and Nolan

    On the field

    Lee May
    Rose
    Perez
    Pinson
    Bench (cup of coffee)

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    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    Gullett
    Nolan
    Zachary

    On the field:

    Peter
    JB
    Davey
    Tony
    Ken
    Last edited by George Anderson; 07-26-2012 at 04:07 PM.
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    All Home-Grown Red Team:
    C Ryan Hanigan
    Devin Mesoraco
    Yasmani Grandal
    1b Joey Votto
    Yonder Alonso
    2B Justin "Red" Turner
    SS Zack Cozart
    MI Paul Janish
    3B Todd Frazier
    OF Adam Dunn
    Drew Stubbs
    Jay Bruce
    Chris Denorfia
    Chris Heisey
    SP Johnny Cueto
    Homer Bailey
    Mike Leake
    Dustin Moseley
    Travis Wood
    RP Sam LeCure
    Logan Ondrusek
    Brad Boxberger
    Aroldis Chapman
    Todd Coffey
    Jeremy Horst


    Not great. Not great at all.
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
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  6. #5
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    All Home-Grown Red Team:
    C Ryan Hanigan
    Devin Mesoraco
    Yasmani Grandal
    1b Joey Votto
    Yonder Alonso
    2B Justin "Red" Turner
    SS Zack Cozart
    MI Paul Janish
    3B Todd Frazier
    OF Adam Dunn
    Drew Stubbs
    Jay Bruce
    Chris Denorfia
    Chris Heisey
    SP Johnny Cueto
    Homer Bailey
    Mike Leake
    Dustin Moseley
    Travis Wood
    RP Sam LeCure
    Logan Ondrusek
    Brad Boxberger
    Aroldis Chapman
    Todd Coffey
    Jeremy Horst

    Not great. Not great at all.
    I'm not sure of the point you're making. I'm guessing these are Reds developed players who are currently playing in the big leagues. The fourteen I've highlighted in bold are on our current 25 man roster (save Votto, now on the DL). That's over half that of our current team developed by us and many are integral to us being in 1st place. Are you suggesting that this is somehow mediocre? Presently 13 of our 25 man roster are homegrown and it will go to 14 when Joey's activated (I'm assuming that the player sent down will be one of the guys not originally with the Reds). I'm just now sure how that's not a good thing.
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    Quote Originally Posted by redsmetz View Post
    I'm not sure of the point you're making. I'm guessing these are Reds developed players who are currently playing in the big leagues. The fourteen I've highlighted in bold are on our current 25 man roster (save Votto, now on the DL). That's over half that of our current team developed by us and many are integral to us being in 1st place. Are you suggesting that this is somehow mediocre? Presently 13 of our 25 man roster are homegrown and it will go to 14 when Joey's activated (I'm assuming that the player sent down will be one of the guys not originally with the Reds). I'm just now sure how that's not a good thing.
    If we start from the current 25 man roster plus Votto, there are 14 players the Reds can truly claim as homegrown -- either drafted (11) or signed as undrafted FAs (Hanigan) or from Latin America (Chapman, Cueto).

    There are seven players the Reds acquired in trade. Of those seven, four were acquired in deals where the Reds gave up virtually all homegrown players:

    * Phillips (acquired for Jeff Stevens, a Reds draftee)
    * Valdez (acquired for Jeremy Horst, ditto)
    * Latos (acquired for Alonso, Boxberger, Grandal, all draftees, plus Volquez who was more of a throw-in)
    * Marshall (acquired for Torreyes, Wood, and Sappelt)

    Rolen was acquired for a Reds draftee in Zach Stewart and a guy the Reds acquired very young in Encarnacion. Homegrown talent Austin Kearns was the lynchpin of the deal that brought Bray.

    The remaining five players were acquired via waiver or free agency, with the only one requiring any substantial outlay being Ryan Ludwick (at $2.5M which is peanuts for an MLB team).

    You would have to conclude that the Reds have been extraordinarily shrewd in building a club from the inside-out over the last half-decade.

  8. #7
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    The 1965 Reds were loaded with home grown talent. The starting lineup included future Hall of Famer outfielder Frank Robinson, Hall of Famer but for you know what second baseman Pete Rose, and all stars/Gold Glovers catcher Johnny Edwards and shortstop Leo Cardneas, all orginally signed and developed by the Reds.
    The lineup also had outfielder Tommy Harper, a terrific all around talent who who later be an all star after leaving the Reds and who scored 126 runs for the '65 Reds.
    The lineup further had near Hall of Fame outfielder Vada Pinson.
    The members of the regular lineup not developed by the Reds were Deron Johnson and Gordy Coleman, neither of whom were stars until they arrived in Cincinnati.
    Reserves included future Hall of Famer Tony Perez, catcher Don Pavletich (his average/OBP/slugging line that season was .319/.394/.513), and, in brief roles, future NL rookie of the year Tommy Helms, slugger Lee May, and future Mets star Art Shamsky-all home grown.
    The starting pitching staff was almost all home grown, starting with 20 game winners Sammy Ellis and Jim Maloney, former ace Jim O'Toole (who sadly collapsed as a pitcher in '65), and a fellow named Nuxhall.
    The bullpen also had home grown talent in Billy McCool and Teddy Davidson.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."

  9. #8
    Member medford's Avatar
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    A guy like Phillips obviously isn't home grown, and even though your average Reds fan probably doesn't realize he played for Cleveland at one point, he's a guy I sort of consider a home "grown up" guy as in most of his significant development in the majors was done here.

    I mean, how is he significantly different in that regard from Mike Leake? Mike was obviously drafted by the Reds, but has spent little time actually developing thru the minors. One could argue he was developed for the bigs by Arizona St prior to getting drafted by the Reds.

  10. #9
    Member Captain Hook's Avatar
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    Quote Originally Posted by dsmith421 View Post
    If we start from the current 25 man roster plus Votto, there are 14 players the Reds can truly claim as homegrown -- either drafted (11) or signed as undrafted FAs (Hanigan) or from Latin America (Chapman, Cueto).

    There are seven players the Reds acquired in trade. Of those seven, four were acquired in deals where the Reds gave up virtually all homegrown players:

    * Phillips (acquired for Jeff Stevens, a Reds draftee)
    * Valdez (acquired for Jeremy Horst, ditto)
    * Latos (acquired for Alonso, Boxberger, Grandal, all draftees, plus Volquez who was more of a throw-in)
    * Marshall (acquired for Torreyes, Wood, and Sappelt)

    Rolen was acquired for a Reds draftee in Zach Stewart and a guy the Reds acquired very young in Encarnacion. Homegrown talent Austin Kearns was the lynchpin of the deal that brought Bray.

    The remaining five players were acquired via waiver or free agency, with the only one requiring any substantial outlay being Ryan Ludwick (at $2.5M which is peanuts for an MLB team).

    You would have to conclude that the Reds have been extraordinarily shrewd in building a club from the inside-out over the last half-decade.
    And that club currently sits in first place with one of the best records in baseball.I'm not sure how that's "not great at all".

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    Re: Home Grown Team

    Quote Originally Posted by redsmetz View Post
    I'm not sure of the point you're making.
    I'm saying the Red home-grown team isn't nearly as good as other squads. That's all.

    For example, check out the Ranger squad. Or the Kansas City team. Or even the Indian team.
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
    -- Christy Matthewson
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  12. #11
    First Time Caller SunDeck's Avatar
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    Interesting topic. I consider it less important to have players make their way up to the big league club than it is to have a good big league club, so if talent needs to be traded away to achieve that, so be it. But this has gotten me to thinking about the real strength the Reds have right now, which seems to be the pitching staff and it's solid roots in the farm system. By far, the best thing to happen to the Reds has been the rebuilding of their farm, but now I'm wondering if the best thing really hasn't been more specifically the job they have done developing pitching. Out of their best two position players, Votto is home grown and Phillips was claimed from the Cleveland reject pile, but in terms of pitching, it's the home grown crew that has had the most effect, especially [Praying hands]with Bailey coming around[/Praying hands].
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  13. #12
    Moderator RedlegJake's Avatar
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    I'm saying the Red home-grown team isn't nearly as good as other squads. That's all.

    For example, check out the Ranger squad. Or the Kansas City team. Or even the Indian team.
    All that tells me is that the Reds have been extraordinarily shrewd in trading and keeping the right players or they wouldn't be sniffing a good team right now!

  14. #13
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    I'm saying the Red home-grown team isn't nearly as good as other squads. That's all.

    For example, check out the Ranger squad. Or the Kansas City team. Or even the Indian team.
    Lord knows it's benefitted the Royals and Indians tremendously.
    "Since I've been with the Reds in 1989, we've never had a farm system this loaded," Bowden said. "If we were the New York Yankees and had unlimited dollars, we could have traded for Colon, (Jeff) Weaver, Rolen, (Cliff) Floyd, (Kenny) Rogers and Finley and gotten them all -- and still held onto our top five prospects. That's an amazing statement."

  15. #14
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    Sigh.

    It was a tangential discussion, one that focused on Cincinnati's lack of pitching acumen or development before the emergence of Cueto, Leake, Bailey, and Chapman.

    It had little to do with any other conversation, but was (I thought) an interesting side-note to it.

    It wasn't meant as some sort of castigation of the pitchers currently in the Red pipeline or pitching in the major leagues.
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
    -- Christy Matthewson
    "Show me a good loser and I'll show you an idiot."
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  16. #15
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Re: Home Grown Team

    I mentioned the 1965 Reds, WOY mentioned the 1967 Reds and George Anderson mentioned the 1976 Reds. We could of added the 1970 NL champs, as the '70 Reds had a starting lineup that had 7 of 8 regulars being "home grown": Bench, May, Helms, Concepcion, Perez, Carbo and Rose--Tolan was the only exception.
    The Reds for two decades, 1956-76, had an amazing run of home grown talent: Frank Robinson, Vada Pinson, Curt Flood, Jim O'Toole, Claude Osteen, Mike Cuellar, Pete Rose, Tony Perez, Tommy Helms, Johnny Bench, Lee May, Jim Maloney, Sam Ellis, Billy McCool, Tommy Harper, Art Shamsky, Dave Concepcion, Gary Nolan, Mel Queen, Wayne Simpson, Don Gullett, Ken Griffey Sr., Bernie Carbo, Hal McRae, Pat Zachary, Rawly Eastwick, Will McEnaney, Leo Cardenas, Johnny Edwards, Don Pavetich, et al.
    In retrospect it is somewhat disappointing that it was only at the end of that amazing run, 1975 and 1976, that the Reds finally brought home World Series crowns.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."


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