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Thread: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

  1. #46
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by Homer Bailey View Post
    Dialtone...
    I don't think so. They want a SS and/or 3B. Frazier is arguably ROY at 3B. Cozart or DiDi gives you one of the better young, major league ready SS in the game. Plus in addition they get a top 100 pitching prospect (Corcino or Cingrani) or another prospect they really like. The third package gives them their #2/3 starter, and rumor has it they were ready to deal Upton for Garza. Bailey has outperformed Garza this year and doesn't have the same salary or current health issues. Plus, of course, there would be other pieces in that deal as well (ie Heisey and H-Rod).
    Last edited by Benihana; 08-02-2012 at 12:32 PM.
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  3. #47
    I'm gettin paper Homer Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    I don't think so. They want a SS and/or 3B. Frazier is arguably ROY at 3B. Cozart or DiDi gives you one of the better young, major league ready SS in the game. Plus in addition they get a top 100 pitching prospect (Corcino or Cingrani) or another prospect they really like. The third package gives them their #2 starter, and rumor has it they were ready to deal Upton for Garza. Bailey has outperformed Garza this year and doesn't have the same salary or current health issues.
    I don't think an Upton deal gets done without Hamilton. Not to mention, the Reds will need the D'Backs to throw in a decent amount of change to make the dollars even come close to working, which is going to cost more prospects.

  4. #48
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by Homer Bailey View Post
    I don't think an Upton deal gets done without Hamilton. Not to mention, the Reds will need the D'Backs to throw in a decent amount of change to make the dollars even come close to working, which is going to cost more prospects.
    Not sure the Reds will need the money if they don't sign Ludwick and they include someone like Bailey, who is due to make a chunk of change next year. Maybe they will, but who knows.

    If the D-backs require Hamilton, I probably take a pass- much like the Reds did with Garza and Johnson at the deadline. I doubt a higher rated prospect gets moved for Upton though. It's pretty rare to see a Top 25 prospect get traded these days (see the trading deadline for evidence).

    The Rangers weren't trading Profar or Olt. The Dodgers weren't trading Lee. etc.
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  5. #49
    I hate the Cubs LoganBuck's Avatar
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by camisadelgolf View Post
    Trading away Edinson Volquez helped give the Reds the flexibility to make the signing happen.
    Ahhhhhhhhh.....you can't talk about Payflex. That isn't allowed, I am sure of it. Check the unwritten board rules. No mentions of Neftali Perez signings is another.
    The Sox traded Bullfrog the only player they've got for Shottenhoffen. Four-eyes Shottenhoffen a utility infielder. They've got a whole team of utility infielders.

  6. #50
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    See my earlier post.

    First choice: They exercise the mutual $5MM option.
    Second choice: Offer him a 2 year $10MM deal.
    Third choice: Let him walk and trade for Upton.
    I just think there is a good chance that is an 0 for 3 proposition. Unless you wanted to bump that 10 MM up a bit...is 10 MM your max?

  7. #51
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    I just think there is a good chance that is an 0 for 3 proposition. Unless you wanted to bump that 10 MM up a bit...is 10 MM your max?
    For me with Ludwick, yes.

    If he could get much more than that from someone else, I'd wish him well. I'd be surprised, but then again, you can find a team to do something stupid every year.

    Ludwick clearly has to be in a hitters' park to be effective, and Colorado's OF is full. He's also 34 years old. I love what he's done for the Reds this year, and hope that he would stay (maybe even take less to stay) given his stated affection for the city and the club. But I would not give him more of a commitment than a 2 year, $10MM deal. I think there may be better bargains (including lefthanded options) to be had elsewhere, even if we can't trade for Justin Upton.
    Last edited by Benihana; 08-02-2012 at 02:20 PM.
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  8. #52
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    as I stated above, I might go 2 years, 12 mil, I think he'd get similar offers, but nothing significantly greater on the FA market.

  9. #53
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by medford View Post
    as I stated above, I might go 2 years, 12 mil, I think he'd get similar offers, but nothing significantly greater on the FA market.
    I don't think any of us are too far apart on the numbers, I just see a 3 yr 21 MM deal being the sweet spot, with the last year being a team option for 7 MM. This assumes he continues his yearly pace and finishes with over .850 OPS and over 25 HR.

  10. #54
    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by LoganBuck View Post
    Ahhhhhhhhh.....you can't talk about Payflex. That isn't allowed, I am sure of it. Check the unwritten board rules. No mentions of Neftali Perez signings is another.
    http://memecreator.net/the-most-interesting-man-in-the-world/showimage.php/4423/i-don't-always-play-by-the-rules-that-is-all..jpg

  11. #55
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    I don't think any of us are too far apart on the numbers, I just see a 3 yr 21 MM deal being the sweet spot, with the last year being a team option for 7 MM. This assumes he continues his yearly pace and finishes with over .850 OPS and over 25 HR.
    Remember, you're paying for a 34 year old player who hasn't OPS'd above .800 since 2008.

    2 years, $10MM- not a penny more for me. There are better places to commit $21MM, including the current RF on the Diamondbacks and the Yankees.
    Last edited by Benihana; 08-02-2012 at 03:03 PM.
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  12. #56
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    I don't think any of us are too far apart on the numbers, I just see a 3 yr 21 MM deal being the sweet spot, with the last year being a team option for 7 MM. This assumes he continues his yearly pace and finishes with over .850 OPS and over 25 HR.
    He's not even an everyday player yet. He's not worth those kinds of bucks. We can re-visit this at the end of the year but as of right now, you offer him the $5mill option and that's it. He needs the Reds and GABP as much as the Reds need him...maybe more so

  13. #57
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Ray View Post
    He's not even an everyday player yet. He's not worth those kinds of bucks. We can re-visit this at the end of the year but as of right now, you offer him the $5mill option and that's it. He needs the Reds and GABP as much as the Reds need him...maybe more so
    He's an everyday player in the sense that he's outright won the LF job. He just plays a little less than many starters only because Dusty is committed to keeping him fresh. But he's basically an everyday player in spirit.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  14. #58
    Party like it's 1990 Blitz Dorsey's Avatar
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    When do "we" start talking about his contract?

    When the season is over and all the data is complete and the thrill of the past week has tempered?
    Incorrect (at least if this thread is any indication).

  15. #59
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    I don't think any of us are too far apart on the numbers, I just see a 3 yr 21 MM deal being the sweet spot, with the last year being a team option for 7 MM. This assumes he continues his yearly pace and finishes with over .850 OPS and over 25 HR.
    Let's be careful here. When you're a low-mid revenue team, there's almost always more risk in signing a guy who who turns out to not produce up to his contract than there is in losing a guy you could have had at a discount.

    With the former, you lose any opportunity to remedy the problem. With the latter, you've missed on "buy low" opportunity -- but there are still others.

    If a guy is a unique talent who cannot otherwise be replaced, you take that risk on the multi-year deal. Otherwise, let's err conservative.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  16. #60
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    Re: When do we start talking about re-signing Ludwick

    When do you start talking? When the dust settles unless the Reds have some reason to think he's a substantially different player now than he was in the offseason. I doubt they do.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner


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