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Thread: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

  1. #16
    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Quote Originally Posted by Superdude View Post
    If Votto still isn't pre-surgery Votto, we've got a lot bigger problems than just figuring out where to bat him in the lineup.
    We are agreed on that, sir. But I think he will be.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

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  3. #17
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    The Reds need OB. If it comes attached to power great. If it comes attached to speed, that's fine too. And Phillips' main offensive value is putting the ball in play with runners on base. He's a better #2 hitter than a #1 hitter.

    Plus, it's time the Reds gave Dusty what he wants. He wants a CF who can hit leadoff. Stubbs can't do it, at least not vs. RHPs. Time to get someone who can.
    I think this is an excellent point. Jocketty, for the most part, pays attention to and does well in the area of synergy, chemistry, etc. He pursues players who work well with other players. I don't believe the Reds were at all deficient in that area, and I think that aspect of the roster served them well. But the same dynamic operates in the manager-GM relationship. The manager and GM have to complement each other. As M2 said, Dusty is absolutely a champion of the CF/leadoff type. To make him the best manager he can be, it's incumbent upon Jocketty to supply that player. He tried with Patterson and Taveras, but not hard or effectively enough. Dusty attempted to force the issue with Stubbs, and it was an unsightly mismatch. Given the job Dusty did this year, and the contract extension, it's absolutely time that he is afforded the type of player he prefers to work with at the top of the lineup.

  4. #18
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    I'm not entirely convinced that will be the case. They are preparing for a much bigger windfall than has previously been reported.
    Fay reported just yesterday that the Reds won't be big players in free agency. Has something come out since yesterday afternoon that says otherwise?

  5. #19
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Fay reported just yesterday that the Reds won't be big players in free agency. Has something come out since yesterday afternoon that says otherwise?
    When have they ever been players, much alone big players?

    There is no way this team dumps cash on a big name FA or a long term contract for a guy who has never played for the Reds.

    They already have the big cogs, I look for them to fill in spaces with under the radar guys or ones that need another chance

  6. #20
    Have Faith In Dusty DGullett35's Avatar
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    When I read the article on Reds.com they sounded like that the Reds are going to keep Stubbs. If stubbs is back I would think hes our starting CF(Im guessing what the front office brass is thinking). That means if they really are looking for a leadoff hitter than that guy will have to play LF. This also means no Luddy. With that situation we may end up with a decent leadoff hitter but then we wont have the middle of the order bat to protect our 2 LH hitters. Basically what Im saying is that we still need Luddy if the money is right to hit 4th and Id love to pick up a Crisp or even Span to play the CF position and bat leadoff. If the Reds really want to keep Stubbs he would have to be our 4th OF because if he starts this team will be without either a good leadoff hitter or a middle of the order bat. I also think that with the extensions 2 of our pitchers need and the money we have already spent in the lineup paying for Luddy and a good leadoff hitter may be pushing it. Hopefully Castellini can push the budget up just a little. IMO I look for Pierre to be signed and Phillips to bat 4th all year. Just my 2 cents
    Last edited by DGullett35; 10-26-2012 at 04:19 PM.
    "Losing feels worse than winning feels good." -Vin Scully

  7. #21
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Quote Originally Posted by _Sir_Charles_ View Post
    Spot on. Get a big LH bat for LF who can actually PLAY left field.

    But, if the Reds are insistent on getting a leadoff hitter, then trading for Shin Soo Choo is my number 1 target and plop him down in left.
    Yes, I agree.
    It sure would be nice to get a CF with a high OBP, but supposedly they were asking a king's ransom for Span.. If we are going to pay through the nose, I'd rather do it on a guy like Choo. Hopefully the Indians are in tear down mode this winter.

    And yes, I'm also more worried about replacing Ludwick's production than I am in upgrading CF.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  8. #22
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    I don't see any urgency to acquire a leadoff hitter. We already have one in Brandon Phillips. Just get a good CF period. If he just so happens to fit the profile of a leadoff man, fine. But the front office should lock themselves into certain requirements and pass on other available productive guys just because they aren't fast.

    Luckily, I don't see them as the type to do that.
    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.

  9. #23
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Fay reported just yesterday that the Reds won't be big players in free agency. Has something come out since yesterday afternoon that says otherwise?
    LOL, I like Fay and the beat writers, they perform a great service for Reds fans, but they report virtually EVERY year that the Reds won't be players for free agents.

    I haven't fully researched it but I was waiting for yesterday's statement in Fay's blog -- and, as expected, it came.

    On November 19, 2011 Fay's blog was entitled "Reds unlikely to do much as far as free agency."

    On November 16, 2010, Fay wrote "Jocketty: Reds may not sign outside FAs."

    On November 19, 2009, MLB.com (Sheldon) had a piece "Reds won't be busy in free agency. General Manager Jocketty doesn't expect to be active."

    Maybe it all comes from Walt, I don't know. I'm sure the beat writers and Jocketty fully believe the statements. But I just can't take these as ironclad, they are just routine statements that show up every year.

    We'll see.
    Last edited by Kc61; 10-26-2012 at 05:41 PM.

  10. #24
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    LOL, I like Fay, he performs a great service for Reds fans, but he reports virtually EVERY year that the Reds won't be players for free agents.

    .
    Yep, last year, the word on the street was that the Reds had no money.
    Yet they pulled in Madson, surprising everyone.
    Marshall was acquired and extended (another expensive add)
    Ludwick wasn't super pricey, but also a notable signing.

    I don't expect a huge spending spree, but I think there's some budget room to add talent (maybe through a trade, but money there).. I have faith in Cast.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  11. #25
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    The Dbacks are shopping outfielders this offseason.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  12. #26
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Based on all the facts, I would try to sign Pierre to a 1 year deal if he'll bite. I think it's the best option for next season and pray that Hamilton is ready by 2014.

    Span is sort of intriguing, but what would it take to get him? He may only truly be needed be needed for 1 year of his 3 years left on his deal. The last year of his deal (2015), he starts to get pretty expensive comparatively speaking and I don't think anyone would trade much for him at that point. He obviously does get on base well and plays good defense, but he had a breakout year in 2012 with all the doubles he had. Can he keep that up?

  13. #27
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    If I had to bet on one guy the Reds pick up, I think it's Denard Span (for young pitching).
    Wow! I didn't know the Reds had, at one point earlier this year, talked with the Twins about Span

    http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/sc...pan-with-twins

    Another interesting article on Span (and the Twins)....

    http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_...stay-minnesota

    He's signed through 2014 (13:$4.75M, 14:$6.5M), with a club option for 2015 ($9M).

    The Twins have depth in the OF position within their system. They're hurting for starting pitching. What could we offer them that may be appealing to them?

    A deal like this would be great IMO. You've got him signed through 2014, which coincides with Hamilton's projected entrance. It fills a need, and buys you some time at no great cost. And if nothing else, could he be moved to LF?
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

  14. #28
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Pierre can't play CF. Replacing Ludwick's OPS in 2012 with Pierre is a step down for the offense, even if the leadoff spot improves.
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  15. #29
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    Yes, I agree.
    It sure would be nice to get a CF with a high OBP, but supposedly they were asking a king's ransom for Span.. If we are going to pay through the nose, I'd rather do it on a guy like Choo. Hopefully the Indians are in tear down mode this winter.
    You'd rather pay through the nose for one year of a corner OF (Choo) rather than 3 years of a CF?

  16. #30
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Adding productive leadoff man is Reds' top priority

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Fay reported just yesterday that the Reds won't be big players in free agency. Has something come out since yesterday afternoon that says otherwise?
    I agree that we won't dabble much in FA as usual, but for what it's worth...Fay say that exact same thing every single year and he's always stunned when we DO get a guy.

    ~edit~ Oh well, I see that others have already pounced on this. *grin* I really should read the WHOLE thread before posting. NAH!
    Last edited by _Sir_Charles_; 10-27-2012 at 09:34 AM.
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
    Bailey CYA winner
    Hamilton ROY & GG


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