Turn Off Ads?
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 16 to 28 of 28

Thread: Jason Bay Released by Mets

  1. #16
    Two-Time Batting Champ Edd Roush's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Loveland, OH
    Posts
    3,026

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Forget Bay. Sign Ludwick and worry about CF from outside the organization for 2013.
    If we were the Yankees, yes we'd re-sign Ludwick, Broxton, Madson and trade for Wright. However, even given the attendence/playoff sales boost, we still have limited resources. I think we can get a left fielder at below market value (I don't necessarily want this guy to be Bay) for three reasons. First, the market is flooded driving down guys values, second, most guys want to play for a contender and Cincinnati definitely has a contender next year and finally others saw what GABP did for Ludwick's performance last year, they might want to be on a similar one year deal so they can cash in like Ludwick is going to this off-season.

    I really like Ryan Ludwick and would not be upset if we did re-sign him. I just think there is a good chance that we could get an average to above average left fielder to sign at below market value due to the three factors I listed above.

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #17
    Moderator Plus Plus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    1,485

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    Ryan Ludwick 2.2 WAR in 2010-11
    Bay -0.1 WAR in 11-12

    Narratives are similar but performance has not been.
    Bay fell off of a fungible cliff upon heading to the Mets, and I think he might have lost it with the bat. Bay's ISOp and HR/FB fell off dramatically in 2010, and stayed down in 2011 and 2012. In 2012, Bay was also hindered by a super-low BABIP, making it look even worse than it was. Ludwick's story was one about changing approach once he went to bigger ballparks, and let's not forget that he wasn't necessarily signed to be the starting LF- he took over that mantle with a hot streak in early June.

    I think Bay could be an interesting Ludwick-in-2011 level reclamation project in the chance that he hasn't lost it and instead the Mets simply messed up his approach a la Ludwick, but unless he could be had for the 2.5m or whatever Ludwick was signed for, he isn't worth pursuing.
    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Thus his team was punished

    Long live punishment
    Quote Originally Posted by BCubb2003 View Post
    The base you want to acquire is home.

  4. #18
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    34,336

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    It's tempting. He sure used to kill the Reds when he was in PIT. But that was a few years ago.
    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rally-...24872650873160

  5. #19
    Kmac5 KoryMac5's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Waterloo, NY
    Posts
    3,681

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    Bay's struggles were two fold, injuries and a ball park that swallowed up his bat. I think he would be a guy who sounds a lot like who we got last yr on the cheap in Ludwick.
    If you have a losing record at Reds games, please stop going.

  6. #20
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Posts
    13,179

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    Quote Originally Posted by Edd Roush View Post
    If we were the Yankees, yes we'd re-sign Ludwick, Broxton, Madson and trade for Wright. However, even given the attendence/playoff sales boost, we still have limited resources. I think we can get a left fielder at below market value (I don't necessarily want this guy to be Bay) for three reasons. First, the market is flooded driving down guys values, second, most guys want to play for a contender and Cincinnati definitely has a contender next year and finally others saw what GABP did for Ludwick's performance last year, they might want to be on a similar one year deal so they can cash in like Ludwick is going to this off-season.

    I really like Ryan Ludwick and would not be upset if we did re-sign him. I just think there is a good chance that we could get an average to above average left fielder to sign at below market value due to the three factors I listed above.
    Let's forget about the long list of Broxton, Madson, David Wright, Ty Cobb and Babe Ruth. Let's just focus on Ludwick.

    The idea that the Reds cannot afford Ryan Ludwick for a starting position is inconceivable to me. This is not an all-star, not a near-all star. He is a pretty good player. The Red should be able to sign him for a two-year deal.

    I can understand the "we're not the Yankees" mantra when it comes to a David Wright. But Ryan Ludwick?

    If the Reds don't like Ludwick's game, well, then they should let him go. If he is overpricing himself, yes, they should let him go.

    But he seems to me as a good, reasonable, choice for left field. He's not a luxury item, the Reds should be able to work something with him if they still like his game.

    Jason Bay would be a high risk, high reward gamble. I'd prefer a deal with Ludwick, but whatever.
    Last edited by Kc61; 11-08-2012 at 10:14 AM.

  7. #21
    Two-Time Batting Champ Edd Roush's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Loveland, OH
    Posts
    3,026

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Let's forget about the long list of Broxton, Madson, David Wright, Ty Cobb and Babe Ruth. Let's just focus on Ludwick.

    The idea that the Reds cannot afford Ryan Ludwick for a starting position is inconceivable to me. This is not an all-star, not a near-all star. He is a pretty good player. The Red should be able to sign him for a two-year deal.

    I can understand the "we're not the Yankees" mantra when it comes to a David Wright. But Ryan Ludwick?

    If the Reds don't like Ludwick's game, well, then they should let him go. If he is overpricing himself, yes, they should let him go.

    But he seems to me as a good, reasonable, choice for left field. He's not a luxury item, the Reds should be able to work something with him if they still like his game.

    Jason Bay would be a high risk, high reward gamble. I'd prefer a deal with Ludwick, but whatever.
    My point is not that the Reds cannot afford Ryan Ludwick, but rather the Reds may be better served to use the money that Ludwick will get in free agency by acquiring another outfielder who value isn't so high after a big year especially considering we have holes in the bullpen and in centerfield. Again, I would not mind re-signing Ludwick. I just don't think we are in a position where we need to overpay and we need to understand the limitation of our resources.

  8. #22
    Member Crumbley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Toledo
    Posts
    698

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    If he'd take ten bucks to come in and compete for a job, sure.

  9. #23
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Posts
    13,179

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    Quote Originally Posted by Edd Roush View Post
    My point is not that the Reds cannot afford Ryan Ludwick, but rather the Reds may be better served to use the money that Ludwick will get in free agency by acquiring another outfielder who value isn't so high after a big year especially considering we have holes in the bullpen and in centerfield. Again, I would not mind re-signing Ludwick. I just don't think we are in a position where we need to overpay and we need to understand the limitation of our resources.
    The left fielder on the team is likely the cleanup hitter in the starting lineup. He is an important offensive piece.

    What I always liked about Ludwick is that he seemed adequate to fill that role, yet was not a big name, not a high salaried guy.

    Hard for me to name a comparable or better LFer who will come much cheaper.

    If this were a bench player or middle reliever then I'd be open to low cost gambles. But given the role the LFer plays in the lineup, given the team's makeup, I want Ludwick or better, which means some expenditure of funds will be necessary.
    Last edited by Kc61; 11-08-2012 at 02:52 PM.

  10. #24
    All work and no play..... Vottomatic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lebanon
    Posts
    7,067

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    Bay's decline? I'd surmise possibly PED's back then, and no more when his decline began.

    I'm starting to consider more and more the Upton option. Reasonable contract for a young player whose best years SHOULD BE, but might not be, ahead of him.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

    "Man do I miss the days where were didn't need a calculator and an encyclopedia of baseball metrics to enjoy a baseball game ... - MikeS21" - 8/2/12 game thread

  11. #25
    One and a half men Patrick Bateman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Calgary, AB
    Posts
    5,829

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    Not big on Bay. On one side, I think hitting wise Ludwick is a good comp. Similar type of situation Bay is in that Ludwick was in last year. I could see Bay coming into Cincy and putting up an .850 OPS.

    On the other side, he's an atrocious fielder limiting his overall upside. He's going to need to be that .850 OPS bat to be a thing. Ludwick on the other hand is a more servicable fielder at the position and the Reds didn't need to entirely bank on the offensive turnaround to add some value. For that reason I don't find the risk on Bay that appealing as he could be a replacement level player more easily than he could be a valuable component.

    If you can bring him in cheaply as a competition player, I think it's a good fit, but certainly not as 'the' solution to the LF hole.

  12. #26
    Member Superdude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    2,773

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman View Post
    If you can bring him in cheaply as a competition player, I think it's a good fit, but certainly not as 'the' solution to the LF hole.
    He's interesting for sure, but I still make Ludwick the main target. Bay may be comparable to Ludwick pre-Cincy, but pinning our hopes on the same kind of turnaround is risky. Especially with Ludwick serving a crucial role batting behind Votto.

  13. #27
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Bedford, KY
    Posts
    8,992

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    I'd gamble on him.

    Fairly cheap, I'd think, with massive upside.
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
    -- Christy Matthewson
    "Show me a good loser and I'll show you an idiot."
    -- Leo Durocher

  14. #28
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    14,697

    Re: Jason Bay Released by Mets

    I'm thinking Bay's best option is the Yomiuri Giants or the Fukuoka Dai Hawks. He'd probably get the most money there and he's still young enough to have a good season and take a shot at the US again.

    I'm wondering why Bay isn't playing winter ball somewhere. If he's really interested in showcasing his game and coming into spring in midseason form, I think he'd do that. Winter Ball was made for guys like Bay.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25