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Thread: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

  1. #31
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vottomatic View Post
    How does it make it more expensive? It's guaranteed. The total is $71M. If he gets more at the backend of it, he gets a total of $71M. If he gets more at the frontend of it, he gets a total of $71M.
    A dollar today is worth more than a dollar tomorow.

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  3. #32
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vottomatic View Post
    Brace yourself. The way it's looking, you're gonna have Gomes or Ludwick back in the cleanup spot or maybe Jason Bay and management crossing their fingers. Cheap, cheap, and did I say cheap will be the answer at cleanup.
    You say that like Ludwick was some kind of chump last year.
    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
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    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.

  4. #33
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wonderful Monds View Post
    You say that like Ludwick was some kind of chump last year.
    Well, I already stated earlier that Ludwick had a killer season, but I don't think he can duplicate it next season.

    And I don't think Ludwick puts any fear into opposing pitchers. I'd rather have an upgrade, but I know the Reds can't afford it.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

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  5. #34
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    So the faxt that they have gone the first 2 weeks of the offseaosn without a move means they will do nothing for remaining 3 months or so? Really?

    Maybe time will prove you right, but it seems a bit early to be accusing this front office & owner of being cheap and unwilling to make moves.




    Quote Originally Posted by Vottomatic View Post
    Brace yourself. The way it's looking, you're gonna have Gomes or Ludwick back in the cleanup spot or maybe Jason Bay and management crossing their fingers. Cheap, cheap, and did I say cheap will be the answer at cleanup.

  6. #35
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    Know? Or think?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vottomatic View Post
    Well, I already stated earlier that Ludwick had a killer season, but I don't think he can duplicate it next season.

    And I don't think Ludwick puts any fear into opposing pitchers. I'd rather have an upgrade, but I know the Reds can't afford it.

  7. #36
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    Quote Originally Posted by UKFlounder View Post
    So the faxt that they have gone the first 2 weeks of the offseaosn without a move means they will do nothing for remaining 3 months or so? Really?

    Maybe time will prove you right, but it seems a bit early to be accusing this front office & owner of being cheap and unwilling to make moves.
    I've applauded ownership/management for all their good moves, which are many.

    But my obvious long term gripe (probably 3 years) is the obvious need for a legit cleanup bat and leadoff hitter. And management typically tools around with scrap heap filler types such as Corey Patterson, Willy Taveras, Gomes, Ludwick (which worked out).

    Now, to give them the benefit of the doubt. We've all been longing for a TOR arm for a long time, and they went out and surprised us all and got Latos last season. Sooooooooooo, maybe this offseason they will surprise us and fill these obvious other needs (LF/CF/cleanup hitter/leadoff hitter).

    Track record for LF/CF isn't that great. But maybe this is the offseason they address it.

    Jocketty is clothed in secrety.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

    "Man do I miss the days where were didn't need a calculator and an encyclopedia of baseball metrics to enjoy a baseball game ... - MikeS21" - 8/2/12 game thread

  8. #37
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    Quote Originally Posted by Plus Plus View Post
    Gregorious has been highly touted this offseason as well. I don't have the exact source (d'oh!) but I read on twitter the other day that pundits believe that if his bat progresses as anticipated, he could be a 60 player going forward, and be a high quality player for quite some time. Henry Rodriguez' bat has also been widely praised as being as close to a sure thing as any player in the Reds' system. Corcino is also highly regarded, and Stephenson has humongous upside.

    While the Reds' system isn't quite overflowing in the same way that it was before the Latos trade, there is still quite a bit of quality there.
    Point taken.. Gregorious is probably a coveted prospect by other teams.
    The other guys would probably draw interest as well.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  9. #38
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    Justin Upton has always been my #1 target for the Reds (going back to last offseason).

    Assuming, as Jocketty's comments yesterday indicate, that the Reds plan to move Chapman into the rotation at some point, I'd do a deal centered around one each of Homer/Leake* and Cozart/Gregorius.

    My first offer would be Leake and Gregorius, but if it required the other two instead, I'd swallow hard and pull the trigger. Especially if Ludwick wants more than 2 years or $15MM.

    Then sign a closer and Sizemore to platoon/play CF until Hamilton is ready, and boom- the Reds are the favorite for the pennant.



    *I'd also gauge if they were willing to take one of Cingrani/Corcino along with a guy like Lotzkar instead of Bailey as the only pitcher in the deal.
    Go BLUE!!!

  10. #39
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    To get Justin Upton you'd have to do this:

    Bailey/Leake, Cozart/Didi, Cingrani/Corcino, and Henry Rodriguez. That could be close to getting it done. You may would also have to throw in Yorman Rodriguez as well. If the deal was Bailey/Leake, Didi, Cingrani, Henry and Yoman, I'd do it in a heartbeat and not think twice.

  11. #40
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    Quote Originally Posted by cinreds21 View Post
    To get Justin Upton you'd have to do this:

    Bailey/Leake, Cozart/Didi, Cingrani/Corcino, and Henry Rodriguez. That could be close to getting it done. You may would also have to throw in Yorman Rodriguez as well. If the deal was Bailey/Leake, Didi, Cingrani, Henry and Yoman, I'd do it in a heartbeat and not think twice.
    Leake, DiDi, Cingrani, and the Rodriguezes I would do as well in a heartbeat. Outside of Hamilton and Stephenson, I'd happily trade any 2+ minor leaguers in the system in a deal for Upton.

    Sub Bailey for Leake and I might think twice.

    Leake is an Arizona guy of course, hopefully that means something to them.
    Go BLUE!!!

  12. #41
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    I still don't think at this point trading Bailey should be a deal breaker. Yes, Bailey for the most part, had a really good season, and maybe he is turning the corner to be the Ace that everyone envisioned, but I wouldn't bet on it yet and I think you trade him now to fill a huge hole that the Reds have. If he does become that number one or number two, oh well, at least you have Justin Upton.

  13. #42
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    Quote Originally Posted by cinreds21 View Post
    I still don't think at this point trading Bailey should be a deal breaker. Yes, Bailey for the most part, had a really good season, and maybe he is turning the corner to be the Ace that everyone envisioned, but I wouldn't bet on it yet and I think you trade him now to fill a huge hole that the Reds have. If he does become that number one or number two, oh well, at least you have Justin Upton.
    Bailey is not a dealbreaker for me- would trade him and DiDi/Cozart for Upton. Once you add 2-3 additional minor leaguers (including Cingrani) to the mix, it would give me pause and I'd MUCH rather include Leake than Bailey.
    Go BLUE!!!

  14. #43
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    I am not a big Justin Upton fan. He is at best, an average defender at a corner OF position. My sense is that he is a good offensive player who will never quite live up to the greatness one expects of a #1 overall pick. Kevin Towers is a very smart GM. Upton's name would not be out there over the last year if Towers saw him as a future elite hitter around which a team could be built. My guess is that Towers is willing to sell high on Upton if someone will pay up in premium prospects.

    For me it comes down to Ludwick vs Upton in LF. Is the difference in production worth the extra money and premium players it would cost to bring in Upton? For me, it is not. The Reds are a 97 win team. Sign Ludwick. Put the resources into strengthening the pen and solving the lead off hitter problem.

    It is not clear to me that Chapman will work out as a starter (though I would give it a try). If he does work out, I think Leake could benefit from a year at AAA and capable backup should a ML pitcher go to the DL. The Reds are not in a position to trade a starter. Keeping that rotation intact makes them competitive even if they do nothing else.

  15. #44
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    Quote Originally Posted by RED VAN HOT View Post
    I am not a big Justin Upton fan. He is at best, an average defender at a corner OF position. My sense is that he is a good offensive player who will never quite live up to the greatness one expects of a #1 overall pick. Kevin Towers is a very smart GM. Upton's name would not be out there over the last year if Towers saw him as a future elite hitter around which a team could be built. My guess is that Towers is willing to sell high on Upton if someone will pay up in premium prospects.

    For me it comes down to Ludwick vs Upton in LF. Is the difference in production worth the extra money and premium players it would cost to bring in Upton? For me, it is not. The Reds are a 97 win team. Sign Ludwick. Put the resources into strengthening the pen and solving the lead off hitter problem.

    It is not clear to me that Chapman will work out as a starter (though I would give it a try). If he does work out, I think Leake could benefit from a year at AAA and capable backup should a ML pitcher go to the DL. The Reds are not in a position to trade a starter. Keeping that rotation intact makes them competitive even if they do nothing else.
    If you can get Ludwick for 2 years and less than $15MM, and if he continues to produce at 2012 levels for the next 2 years, then I would agree that the trade-up to Upton is not worth the cost in salary + players.

    However, if Ludwick wants more than $15MM, and/or if you think there is a decent chance he could begin to decline off of his 2012 numbers to the point where he looks more like the 2011 Ludwick, then I would disagree and say that Upton is worth it,
    Go BLUE!!!

  16. #45
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    Re: What would it take to get Justin Upton?

    I could see a Bailey/ Cozart/ Stubbs for Upton/ Gerardo Parra deal working out for both teams. But I'd sure prefer to see Leake substituted for Bailey.
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