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Thread: Free Agent signings....

  1. #16
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by webbbj View Post
    Yeah, for that cheap the reds should of hopped all over that. From what Ive heard the guy may have some weaknesses defensivly but he can get on base which is what we need.
    An OBP of .350 for less than $2m a year will always be a good deal.

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  3. #17
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by webbbj View Post
    Yeah, for that cheap the reds should of hopped all over that. From what Ive heard the guy may have some weaknesses defensivly but he can get on base which is what we need.
    They may have hopped all over it. He could have preferred Miami. No income tax, decent weather...

  4. #18
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Piere has a complete wet noodle for an arm, he cant play anything other than left and plays that poorly plus hes very splitty a platoon player at best
    http://bbref.com/pi/shareit/FQlNb

  5. #19
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    The Mariners DFAed Chone Figgins I hope we take a shot at him as our super utility player. His career fell off the face of the earth in Seattle but moving to a better hitting park and a winner club could do wonders and the price is no-doubt right.

  6. #20
    This dude rules. HatchMo's Avatar
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by HometownHero View Post
    The Mariners DFAed Chone Figgins I hope we take a shot at him as our super utility player. His career fell off the face of the earth in Seattle but moving to a better hitting park and a winner club could do wonders and the price is no-doubt right.
    I agree. Perfect bench player to replace cairo, as long as the price is right.
    Just a dude who loves the reds, and some new sneakers.

  7. #21
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by HometownHero View Post
    The Mariners DFAed Chone Figgins I hope we take a shot at him as our super utility player. His career fell off the face of the earth in Seattle but moving to a better hitting park and a winner club could do wonders and the price is no-doubt right.
    Well, he's Dusty's kind of leadoff hitter. Can't get on base

  8. #22
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    Well, he's Dusty's kind of leadoff hitter. Can't get on base
    Well for a poor as he hit he gets on at at a good clip. He had a .181 average but a .262 OBP. Valdez had a .206 BA but just a .236 OBP and Cairo's .187 came with a .212 OBP. Also with a much higher average Stubbs's .277 and Cozart's .288 wasn't far off.

    I think he could be inline for a massive bounce back to crazy low BABIP the last two year. His luck totally vanished falling to .215 and .237 the last two years and with any spike in BA and his OBP will jump quick. But what makes it so appealing is we know he rock bottom with no luck whatsoever is better than what we had 2 of and still won the division. Plus he has better speed and if we get hit with injury he can play all the postilions and also is cheaper than anyone else we can get helping improve in other areas.

    If we got lucky and he had the Ludwick type bounce back to his just under his .291 BA and .363 OBP Angels days then we could start printing up some 2013 playoff tickets with him potentially getting PT all over the field getting on for the big bats.

    I hope Walt has already or plans to get in contact with his camp as we're a very good fit for him. Winning team, hitters park and tons of potential AB with several positions not held down by proven players.

  9. #23
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    I never understood what happened to Chone Figgins. He just dropped off a cliff after about age 31 - which certainly isn't old. I just don't understand it. But if the Reds think that any shadow of the old Figgins is still in there someplace, he's certainly worth a cheap gamble.

  10. #24
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by HometownHero View Post
    Well for a poor as he hit he gets on at at a good clip. He had a .181 average but a .262 OBP. Valdez had a .206 BA but just a .236 OBP and Cairo's .187 came with a .212 OBP. Also with a much higher average Stubbs's .277 and Cozart's .288 wasn't far off.

    I think he could be inline for a massive bounce back to crazy low BABIP the last two year. His luck totally vanished falling to .215 and .237 the last two years and with any spike in BA and his OBP will jump quick. But what makes it so appealing is we know he rock bottom with no luck whatsoever is better than what we had 2 of and still won the division. Plus he has better speed and if we get hit with injury he can play all the postilions and also is cheaper than anyone else we can get helping improve in other areas.

    If we got lucky and he had the Ludwick type bounce back to his just under his .291 BA and .363 OBP Angels days then we could start printing up some 2013 playoff tickets with him potentially getting PT all over the field getting on for the big bats.

    I hope Walt has already or plans to get in contact with his camp as we're a very good fit for him. Winning team, hitters park and tons of potential AB with several positions not held down by proven players.
    I was certainly making those comments tongue in cheek because of the recent history of leadoff hitters with the Reds but don't get me wrong, I'd love to get Chone Figgins on a cheap deal and see if he can't bounce back. However, I'm not so sure "bad luck" was the biggest factor in his decline. Yes, his BABIP was crazy low the last 2 years and slightly down in 2010 from his career norm but let's dig a little deeper. I kind of dismiss last year's numbers because of the small sample size and sporadic playing time.

    I don't think he was a bad player in 2010. He was a 32 year old player heavily reliant on speed. I think you can expect a downtick in production. His line drive rate was down a bit in 2010, accumulated almost double his career high in sacrifices (which negatively effects BABIP but not batting average) hitting behind Ichiro and his K% was up and his BB% down. What really took a toll on his batting average, IMO, was his out of the strike zone swing rate. He swung at 20.8% of the pitches he saw that were out of the strike zone. He had one outlier in 2007 of 22.3% but had never been above 16.5% in a full season 2002 & 2003 were partial seasons. Those are low hit % balls. That helps to explain his downtick in average and BABIP.

    Now, 2011 is where it gets ugly. He had a 15.8% Infield Fly Ball Rate (automatic outs). By far a career high for a full season. His line drive rate was at a career low 18.3%. He did post a career best 13.1% K rate but also posted a career low 6.7% BB rate. Get this, in 2011 Figgins swung at a, by far, career high 25.2% pitches out of the strike zone and made contact with 83.1% of those pitches (which is nearly 15% above his career average). In other words, he was swinging at bad pitches and getting himself out.

    Does any of this mean he can't bounce back? Absolutely not. He will no longer have the burden of living up to a large contract and constant boos. He can be entrenched back in the leadoff spot where he would have to be hit by a truck to be moved from (Dusty sticks with his guys when they are struggling) and he will be back in a winning atmosphere. I'd absolutely take a shot at him.

  11. #25
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Numbers are nice and I am sure with almost any player a person can pick out a stat or two that supports their position. And I am certain that the Mariners have their paid saber guys who comb through the statistics of the players on their team looking for signs of life. BUT. If the team that saw him play for the past two years (meaning they should know him better than anyone) and then told him we will pay you eight million dollars if you take your bat and glove and go home; you have to wonder if there is anything left in that player's tank. If Seattle thought there was any chance at all that Figgins would bounce back, wouldn't they take him to spring and have a last look-see? Wouldn't they want to get something back for all the money invested in him, if there is anything to get back? They could always release him at the end of spring. No harm, no foul. To me he can't hit, he can't field and he is getting old. Teams (and posters on message boards) have been wrong, of course, and it wouldn't cost the Reds a lot to bring him into camp; but I would pass.
    Last edited by texasdave; 11-22-2012 at 08:34 AM.
    Zero chance the Reds miss the playoffs!

  12. #26
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by texasdave View Post
    Numbers are nice and I am sure with almost any player a person can pick out a stat or two that supports their position. And I am certain that the Mariners have their paid saber guys who comb through the statistics of the players on their team looking for signs of life. BUT. If the team that saw him play for the past two years (meaning they should know him better than anyone) and then told him we will pay you eight million dollars if you take your bat and glove and go home; you have to wonder if there is anything left in that player's tank. If Seattle thought there was any chance at all that Figgins would bounce back, wouldn't they take him to spring and have a last look-see? Wouldn't they want to get something back for all the money invested in him, if there is anything to get back? They could always release him at the end of spring. No harm, no foul. To me he can't hit, he can't field and he is getting old. Teams (and posters on message boards) have been wrong, of course, and it wouldn't cost the Reds a lot to bring him into camp; but I would pass.
    History is littered with guys who were given away by their teams or were unwanted in free agency and turned out to be huge successes. Sometimes there are just circumstances where a relationship is just so irreparably damaged that it is just time to move on. Will Figgins be his old self when he goes to a new team? Doubtful. But I think it's worth $450k to find out

  13. #27
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    History is littered with guys who were given away by their teams or were unwanted in free agency and turned out to be huge successes. Sometimes there are just circumstances where a relationship is just so irreparably damaged that it is just time to move on. Will Figgins be his old self when he goes to a new team? Doubtful. But I think it's worth $450k to find out
    Yes, history is littered with such players. But it is also deluged with players who did not pan out. I think the Reds budget is tight (it may well cost them more than originally thought to bring Ludwick back). If I am going to take a half million dollar flyer on someone with very limited funds available, I am not throwing it at a player whose game is based on speed. And is turning 35 and coming off of two horrible seasons in which he did not hit or field at a major league level. If he had a good glove at least then I could see taking a chance. JMO.
    Zero chance the Reds miss the playoffs!

  14. #28
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by texasdave View Post
    Yes, history is littered with such players. But it is also deluged with players who did not pan out. I think the Reds budget is tight (it may well cost them more than originally thought to bring Ludwick back). If I am going to take a half million dollar flyer on someone with very limited funds available, I am not throwing it at a player whose game is based on speed. And is turning 35 and coming off of two horrible seasons in which he did not hit or field at a major league level. If he had a good glove at least then I could see taking a chance. JMO.
    My thoughts are as a smaller market team, you take 500k fliers rather than going an extra year or overpaying for a $6-7M guy.

    I'm not saying sign him, guarantee a roster spot and slot him in the leadoff spot. I'm saying bring him to spring training and if he doesn't work out, no harm done

  15. #29
    I don't want to grow up Red Raindog's Avatar
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by MoneyInTheBank View Post
    My thoughts are as a smaller market team, you take 500k fliers rather than going an extra year or overpaying for a $6-7M guy.

    I'm not saying sign him, guarantee a roster spot and slot him in the leadoff spot. I'm saying bring him to spring training and if he doesn't work out, no harm done
    My worry if we did sign Figgins --- can we expect Jacoby to help him?
    The older I get - the better I was

    and yes - I hate the Cardinals (Reds fan since 1958)

  16. #30
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    Re: Free Agent signings....

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Righthander View Post
    My worry if we did sign Figgins --- can we expect Jacoby to help him?
    Or Dusty not to play him?
    Zero chance the Reds miss the playoffs!


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