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Thread: Chapman to start? Maybe not

  1. #16
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Quote Originally Posted by cumberlandreds View Post
    Bowden is just stirring the pot. Jocketty is no dummy. He signed Broxton to close. Unless Broxton is injured, he will close and Chapman will start. If Dusty even brings up Chapman in the pen I'm sure he will get a call from Jocketty and remind him why Broxton was signed.
    And also a reminder to Dusty why Chapman was signed - not as a a bullpen arm but as a starter.
    Opinions are like belly buttons. Everybody has one, and they don't want someone else's shoved into their face.

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  3. #17
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Source: Jim Bowden

    Response: Consider the source
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  4. #18
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    After listening to Dusty yesterday, I was reminded why I have so little faith in the player usage part of his job. He talked about the role of the leadoff guy by mentioning speed in about 5 different ways; never hinted at getting on base. And then he went in to the Chapman part, citing that he could be both his best starter and best reliever, as if it wasn't obvious that if he's your best starter you'd be a moron to use him in relief.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  5. #19
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    After listening to Dusty yesterday, I was reminded why I have so little faith in the player usage part of his job. He talked about the role of the leadoff guy by mentioning speed in about 5 different ways; never hinted at getting on base. And then he went in to the Chapman part, citing that he could be both his best starter and best reliever, as if it wasn't obvious that if he's your best starter you'd be a moron to use him in relief.
    “There are very few leadoff men around,” Baker said. “A leadoff man keeps the pitcher in the stretch. ... They set the table and also permit you to win games without hitting the ball out of the ballpark. We depend on the home run a lot. And the fact that we have low-scoring games and good pitching, that’s even more important for us to have the leadoff man to win even more one-run ball games than we do.”
    http://news.cincinnati.com/article/2...ng-much-better

    I didn't turn the timer on, but I'd have it in less than two minutes I located a recent quote refuting your claim. It appears you may have entered obscurantist territory with Dusty. Guys have to be on base to set the table and keep the pitcher in the stretch, or so it seems reasonable to assume that is what he meant.
    Last edited by traderumor; 12-04-2012 at 03:08 PM.
    Can't win with 'em

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  6. #20
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    http://news.cincinnati.com/article/2...ng-much-better

    I didn't turn the timer on, but I'd have it in less than two minutes I located a recent quote refuting your claim. It appears you may have entered obscurantist territory with Dusty. Guys have to be on base to set the table and keep the pitcher in the stretch, or so it seems reasonable to assume that is what he meant.
    I can see your point; perhaps I was listening through my anti-Dusty filter. Maybe the OBP point is obvious that he doesn't feel the need to make it. But when I hear Dusty talk about keeping the pitcher in the stretch and setting the table on the heels of the points specific to speed, I hear "speed keeps the other team honest" and "manufacture runs small-ball style". Perhaps that says more about me than Dusty...
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  7. #21
    Moderator RedlegJake's Avatar
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    I can see your point; perhaps I was listening through my anti-Dusty filter. Maybe the OBP point is obvious that he doesn't feel the need to make it. But when I hear Dusty talk about keeping the pitcher in the stretch and setting the table on the heels of the points specific to speed, I hear "speed keeps the other team honest" and "manufacture runs small-ball style". Perhaps that says more about me than Dusty...
    I like Dusty but he is old school. I agree with you there. If you had 2 20/20 Hitters (hr/sb) one line. 260ba/.410 obp the second. 310ba/.328obp my bet is Dusty picks player 2. Because stinking obp ain't important.

  8. #22
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    And then he went in to the Chapman part, citing that he could be both his best starter and best reliever, as if it wasn't obvious that if he's your best starter you'd be a moron to use him in relief.
    Generally absolutely.

    But if you had 6 great/good starters, and a weak bullpen, and only one fo those starters could pitch in releif effectively, a case could be made that you'd have a better team even if your best starter became the closer. it would depend on how good your # 5 starter is, and how bad your bulllpen was.

  9. #23
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    Source: Jim Bowden

    Response: Consider the source
    Very well put.

    C'mon class ...How can you tell if Jim Bowden is not telling the truth?

    Ans: His mouth is moving of course.

    How quickly we forget.
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  10. #24
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Jim Bowden is a tool, but that doesn't mean he should be used as a hammer against Dusty.

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    jojo (02-16-2013)

  12. #25
    Future Fame of Holler WildcatFan's Avatar
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Jim Bowden is a tool, but that doesn't mean he should be used as a hammer against Dusty.
    Nailed it.
    "I never argue with people who say baseball is boring, because baseball is boring. And then, suddenly, it isn't. And that's what makes it great." - Joe Posnanski

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    jojo (02-16-2013)

  14. #26
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Quote Originally Posted by RedlegJake View Post
    I like Dusty but he is old school. I agree with you there. If you had 2 20/20 Hitters (hr/sb) one line. 260ba/.410 obp the second. 310ba/.328obp my bet is Dusty picks player 2. Because stinking obp ain't important.
    Just because Dusty said something smart about leadoff hitters doesn't mean he actually believes what he said.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

    "Man do I miss the days where were didn't need a calculator and an encyclopedia of baseball metrics to enjoy a baseball game ... - MikeS21" - 8/2/12 game thread

  15. #27
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Jim Bowden is a tool, but that doesn't mean he should be used as a hammer against Dusty.
    Quote Originally Posted by WildcatFan View Post
    Nailed it.
    Not sure if you purposely made this hammer meet nail reference, but regardless, kudos. Well played, Mauer. Well played.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  16. #28
    Party like it's 1990 Blitz Dorsey's Avatar
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Bowden doesn't understand how the Reds are winning without having several "5-tool" outfielders on the roster.

  17. #29
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    The Broxton deal would make no sense at all then
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  18. #30
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Chapman to start? Maybe not

    Quote Originally Posted by Blitz Dorsey View Post
    Bowden doesn't understand how the Reds are winning without having several "5-tool" outfielders on the roster.
    He would refer to both Stubbs and Bruce as 5 tool guys.


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