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Thread: Mesoraco

  1. #61
    Member klw's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    No, I am not saying that. I have an opinion on it all, but I can't really get into it without going into what the reasoning was, which I really shouldn't. I will say this though, the reason shouldn't have any ramifications moving forward. That isn't to say it won't, but that it shouldn't.
    You had been a proponent of Mes when he was struggling for a period in the minors and many were down on him. What are your thoughts on his skill level/ potential going forward now that he has been up for a year- (though underutilized during that year)?

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  3. #62
    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    The problem, IMO, is taking it as gospel.

    Sometimes, opinions come out as facts.

    Sometimes, sources are purposely leaking information as propaganda.

    Sometimes, inside sources aren't really as inside as they seem to think.

    And, sadly, sometimes, inside sources are totally fabricated.
    Talent is God Given: be humble.
    Fame is man given: be thankful.
    Conceit is self given: be careful.

    John Wooden

  4. #63
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Sources are only worth something if they add to the discourse

    Otherwise it's barroom blather

  5. #64
    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Sources are only worth something if they add to the discourse

    Otherwise it's barroom blather
    Exactly
    Talent is God Given: be humble.
    Fame is man given: be thankful.
    Conceit is self given: be careful.

    John Wooden

  6. #65
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by klw View Post
    You had been a proponent of Mes when he was struggling for a period in the minors and many were down on him. What are your thoughts on his skill level/ potential going forward now that he has been up for a year- (though underutilized during that year)?
    On most teams, he could profile as a #5 hitter if he goes out and gets most of his potential out there, hitting .275 with 25 home runs and 30 doubles. He needs to play most of the time though.

  7. #66
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    The problem, IMO, is taking it as gospel.

    Sometimes, opinions come out as facts.

    Sometimes, sources are purposely leaking information as propaganda.

    Sometimes, inside sources aren't really as inside as they seem to think.

    And, sadly, sometimes, inside sources are totally fabricated.
    While this is all true, this specific scenario isn't such a case.

  8. #67
    Member powersackers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    On most teams, he could profile as a #5 hitter if he goes out and gets most of his potential out there, hitting .275 with 25 home runs and 30 doubles. He needs to play most of the time though.
    That's a career year for most catchers. Very rare to see any do that with consistency. Hope he is one of them.
    Attended 1976 World Series in my Mother's Womb. Attended 1990 World Series Game 2 as a 13 year old. Want to take my son to a a World Series Game in Cincinnati in my lifetime.

  9. #68
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by powersackers View Post
    That's a career year for most catchers. Very rare to see any do that with consistency. Hope he is one of them.
    Rare is underselling that feat

    It's been done 28 times and the guys who all did it more than once are HOF catchers, plus the majority was achieved during blatant hitting eras

    Code:
    OPS                           YEAR     OPS      AVG      2B       HR      RC/G      AGE    
    1    Mike Piazza              1997    1.070     .362       32       40    10.59       28   
    2    Gabby Hartnett           1930    1.034     .339       31       37     9.51       29   
    3    Mike Piazza              2000    1.012     .324       26       38     8.92       31   
    4    Roy Campanella           1953    1.006     .312       26       41     9.22       31   
    5    Chris Hoiles             1993    1.001     .310       28       29     9.09       28   
    6    Rudy York                1938     .995     .298       27       33     9.38       24   
    7    Bill Dickey              1937     .987     .332       35       29     9.61       30   
    8    Roy Campanella           1951     .983     .325       33       33     8.50       29   
    9    Bill Dickey              1938     .981     .313       27       27     9.47       31   
    10   Mike Piazza              1998     .960     .328       38       32     8.30       29   
    11   Mike Piazza              2001     .957     .300       29       36     7.42       32   
    12   Jorge Posada             2000     .943     .287       35       28     8.24       28   
    13   Mike Piazza              1999     .936     .303       25       40     6.62       30   
    14   Johnny Bench             1970     .932     .293       35       45     7.14       22   
    15   Carlton Fisk             1977     .922     .315       26       26     7.88       29   
    16   Paul Lo Duca             2001     .917     .320       28       25     7.18       29   
    17   Mike Lieberthal          1999     .914     .300       33       31     7.02       27   
    18   Ivan Rodriguez           1999     .914     .332       29       35     6.12       27   
    19   Yogi Berra               1950     .912     .322       30       28     7.94       25   
    20   Yogi Berra               1956     .911     .298       29       30     7.56       31   
    21   Gary Carter              1982     .890     .293       32       29     6.70       28   
    22   Johnny Bench             1977     .889     .275       34       31     6.48       29   
    23   Gary Carter              1977     .881     .284       29       31     6.58       23   
    24   Victor Martinez          2007     .879     .301       40       25     6.64       28   
    25   Johnny Bench             1975     .878     .283       39       28     6.75       27   
    26   Carlton Fisk             1983     .874     .289       26       26     6.57       35   
    27   Johnny Bench             1974     .870     .280       38       33     6.52       26   
    28   Gary Carter              1984     .853     .294       32       27     6.66       30

  10. #69
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Rare is underselling that feat

    It's been done 28 times and the guys who all did it more than once are HOF catchers, plus the majority was achieved during blatant hitting eras

    Code:
    OPS                           YEAR     OPS      AVG      2B       HR      RC/G      AGE    
    1    Mike Piazza              1997    1.070     .362       32       40    10.59       28   
    2    Gabby Hartnett           1930    1.034     .339       31       37     9.51       29   
    3    Mike Piazza              2000    1.012     .324       26       38     8.92       31   
    4    Roy Campanella           1953    1.006     .312       26       41     9.22       31   
    5    Chris Hoiles             1993    1.001     .310       28       29     9.09       28   
    6    Rudy York                1938     .995     .298       27       33     9.38       24   
    7    Bill Dickey              1937     .987     .332       35       29     9.61       30   
    8    Roy Campanella           1951     .983     .325       33       33     8.50       29   
    9    Bill Dickey              1938     .981     .313       27       27     9.47       31   
    10   Mike Piazza              1998     .960     .328       38       32     8.30       29   
    11   Mike Piazza              2001     .957     .300       29       36     7.42       32   
    12   Jorge Posada             2000     .943     .287       35       28     8.24       28   
    13   Mike Piazza              1999     .936     .303       25       40     6.62       30   
    14   Johnny Bench             1970     .932     .293       35       45     7.14       22   
    15   Carlton Fisk             1977     .922     .315       26       26     7.88       29   
    16   Paul Lo Duca             2001     .917     .320       28       25     7.18       29   
    17   Mike Lieberthal          1999     .914     .300       33       31     7.02       27   
    18   Ivan Rodriguez           1999     .914     .332       29       35     6.12       27   
    19   Yogi Berra               1950     .912     .322       30       28     7.94       25   
    20   Yogi Berra               1956     .911     .298       29       30     7.56       31   
    21   Gary Carter              1982     .890     .293       32       29     6.70       28   
    22   Johnny Bench             1977     .889     .275       34       31     6.48       29   
    23   Gary Carter              1977     .881     .284       29       31     6.58       23   
    24   Victor Martinez          2007     .879     .301       40       25     6.64       28   
    25   Johnny Bench             1975     .878     .283       39       28     6.75       27   
    26   Carlton Fisk             1983     .874     .289       26       26     6.57       35   
    27   Johnny Bench             1974     .870     .280       38       33     6.52       26   
    28   Gary Carter              1984     .853     .294       32       27     6.66       30
    So, then, it's nice to have a catcher with that kind of potential. Hopefully he does more with his opportunities in 2013.

    Bum

  11. #70
    .377 in 1905 CySeymour's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    I'd take 15 bombs and 25 doubles, actually
    ...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound.

  12. #71
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    The problem, IMO, is taking it as gospel.

    Sometimes, opinions come out as facts.

    Sometimes, sources are purposely leaking information as propaganda.

    Sometimes, inside sources aren't really as inside as they seem to think.

    And, sadly, sometimes, inside sources are totally fabricated.
    I understand the risks of trying to glean information from an internet message board. It's probably not the most reliable source of accurate information all the time. But I knew that coming in. And a poster like dougdirt, who does happen to have more possible links with "inside" sources, is someone I value for tidbits of information on this board. Yes, I suppose he could just be making stuff up or misleading us. But given his track record, I doubt he'd do that on purpose.
    Last edited by RedEye; 12-11-2012 at 11:34 AM.
    "I’ll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. That’s just how I do things.” -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  13. #72
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by RANDY IN INDY View Post
    Then why dangle anything out there? Why post anything about it, if you aren't willing to expound?
    Because if nothing else, he refuted that other rumor. And I for one appreciate his knowledge and information. Sure, we'd all like more info...but some info is better than NO info.
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
    Bailey CYA winner
    Hamilton ROY & GG

  14. #73
    Party like it's 1990 Blitz Dorsey's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Reading between the lines of what Douglas is saying, I think Mesoraco probably did something immature and rubbed some important people the wrong way. Glad to know it's something that shouldn't affect him moving forward, as long as he's made amends with the proper people. He's a very young guy who perhaps made a mistake. All good as long as history doesn't repeat.

  15. #74
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by _Sir_Charles_ View Post
    Because if nothing else, he refuted that other rumor. And I for one appreciate his knowledge and information. Sure, we'd all like more info...but some info is better than NO info.
    It's not info if it doesn't inform, otherwise it's noise

  16. #75
    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    It's not info if it doesn't inform, otherwise it's noise
    Talent is God Given: be humble.
    Fame is man given: be thankful.
    Conceit is self given: be careful.

    John Wooden


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