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Thread: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

  1. #16
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    I don't think this one is as automatic a win for the Rays as it may seem.

    1) Shields is a legit top tier pitcher and Davis just had a stud season in relief. That's a big boost to the Royals' pitching staff.

    2) The Royals have the money to spend.

    3) Royals prospects have a way of crashing and burning. If you look at a modern history of the KC franchise, it would have been a lot better off trading guys like Jeff Granger, Jim Pittsley, Dee Brown, Chris George, Runelvys Hernandez, Kyle Snyder, Jimmy Gobble, Angel Berroa, Colt Griffin, Chris Lubanski and Luke Hochevar before they disintegrated. Myers looks like the real thing, but Odorizzi is no sure thing and Montgomery has been a bust so far. I think there's a general assumption that the Rays can polish turds into diamonds, and they very well may need to with the arms coming over from KC.

    And what if Myers isn't awesome? Kind of like how Eric Hosmer and Mike Moustakas haven't been awesome yet. And how it took Alex Gordon five years to figure things out. If Tampa Bay gave up Shields for that, then this deal isn't going to look so good on their end.

    On the flipside, the Royals had a fairly poor offense last season. I know the in-house thinking is that the lineup will come around, but you don't get to be Royals-bad having just one flaw.
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  3. #17
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    I can think of 10 other pitchers I'd trade Myers for before thinking of Shields. I don't find him as elite as some.

  4. #18
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I don't think this one is as automatic a win for the Rays as it may seem.

    1) Shields is a legit top tier pitcher and Davis just had a stud season in relief. That's a big boost to the Royals' pitching staff.

    2) The Royals have the money to spend.

    3) Royals prospects have a way of crashing and burning. If you look at a modern history of the KC franchise, it would have been a lot better off trading guys like Jeff Granger, Jim Pittsley, Dee Brown, Chris George, Runelvys Hernandez, Kyle Snyder, Jimmy Gobble, Angel Berroa, Colt Griffin, Chris Lubanski and Luke Hochevar before they disintegrated. Myers looks like the real thing, but Odorizzi is no sure thing and Montgomery has been a bust so far. I think there's a general assumption that the Rays can polish turds into diamonds, and they very well may need to with the arms coming over from KC.

    And what if Myers isn't awesome? Kind of like how Eric Hosmer and Mike Moustakas haven't been awesome yet. And how it took Alex Gordon five years to figure things out. If Tampa Bay gave up Shields for that, then this deal isn't going to look so good on their end.

    On the flipside, the Royals had a fairly poor offense last season. I know the in-house thinking is that the lineup will come around, but you don't get to be Royals-bad having just one flaw.
    Seconded. Shields was the best guy in this deal. Myers might be good some day. I'm very skeptical of the arms KC traded. If this is the year that Hosmer amd Moustakas put it together, this deal makes the Royals a contender. That's something they weren't going to be without making a move like this.

    Glad the Reds didn't deal any of Bailey, Latos, Cueto or Chapman for Myers.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

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  5. #19
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    Quote Originally Posted by cinreds21 View Post
    I can think of 10 other pitchers I'd trade Myers for before thinking of Shields. I don't find him as elite as some.
    Even in naming 10, it puts him in some pretty darn good company. He's been an absolute hoss the last two seasons.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  6. #20
    All work and no play..... Vottomatic's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    Tampa will probably turn around and trade Myers to the Reds for Mez.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

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  7. #21
    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    I'm apparently the only person on the planet who thinks the Rays got hosed.

  8. #22
    Member hebroncougar's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    This is what happens when a GM of a crappy team in a crappy market gets desperate to save his job.

  9. #23
    Member chicoruiz's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    Apparently the Royals aren't buying the Tigers as an AL Central juggernaut- they're shifting into "go for it" mode.
    "In baseball, you don't know nothin'"...Yogi Berra

  10. #24
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    Quote Originally Posted by camisadelgolf View Post
    I'm apparently the only person on the planet who thinks the Rays got hosed.
    Yeah, I'd rather have what I know rather than what could be. Myers would have to be pretty good to make this a good deal for the Rays.
    I'm interested in jobs and you won't create jobs by forcing employers to pay their employees $9/hr- Sea Ray
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  11. #25
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    Quote Originally Posted by camisadelgolf View Post
    I'm apparently the only person on the planet who thinks the Rays got hosed.

    I am on your side too....I dont think they got hosed but I think KC looks good in this....prospects are just that, prospects....sure they are cheap but you just never know how long its going to take them to pan out, if they ever pan out....with James you at least know your getting a stud pitcher who no longer has to face the likes of the Yankees and other teams in that div that usually does well....I think KC will do well

  12. #26
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    I like this trade for KC, especially if they can extend Shields.

    They've been waiting on pitching prospects forever, and it hasn't produced anything. On the other hand, their young position players are primed to be perhaps the strongest such group in baseball. An infield of Hosmer -- Colon -- Escobar -- Moustakas -- Perez. I doubt there's a better young infield in baseball. Add Butler at DH and Gordon in LF. That's an offense. Give those guys some legit pitching, and I think they could become very dangerous.

    The Rays got prospects. Myers looks good, but remains unproven with a high K rate in AAA. The pitchers do not project as elite right now. Rays are taking on some risk here, Royals are deciding to go for it. Good for them, because that young group is ripe and ready, IMO.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

  13. #27
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    I think it's a very smart trade for the Rays. They weren't going to win anything in the AL East for the next two years, with the Blue Jays making huge moves, the Orioles still riding their playoff high, the Red Sox beginning to reload, and the Yankees being the Yankees.

    Now they are rebuilding a window for success from 2015-2020. I wouldn't be surprised to see Price go next for a boatload of guys that can help for that window.

    As far as the Royals go, they are kind of like where the Reds were five years ago in that they can produce decent hitting prospects but have no real pitching to speak of whatsoever. In a way, this is kind of like the Royals equivalent of the Hamilton-for-Volquez deal, only Myers is less proven than Hamilton was and Shields is obviously a lot more proven than Volquez was. Therefore, I don't see it as completely one-sided, although if I had to choose I certainly prefer the Rays side of this deal.

    Interestingly, this is somewhat akin to the inverse of what Tampa did when they shipped out Delmon Young for Matt Garza. That one worked out pretty well for them- I'm guessing this one likely will as well, it's just that we might not see the real dividends until 2-3 years from now.
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  14. #28
    Charlie Brown All-Star IslandRed's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    Yeah... it's more about the timing than anything else. Acquiring affordable front-line starting pitching is going to leave a mark, as we found out last winter. And I think Myers is going to end up on the very-nice-player track, not the superstar track. In pure baseball terms, it would be defensible for KC if they were in a "go for it" position. I'm not sure they were, though.

    For what it's worth, I know a handful of Rays fans and they're in "trust Friedman" mode here, because they know Wil Myers is not Mike Trout or Bryce Harper.
    Not all who wander are lost

  15. #29
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    Quote Originally Posted by Tornon View Post
    Shields, Davis, & a PTBNL for Wil Myers, Jake Odorizzi, Mike Montgomery, & Patrick Leonard
    Well, at first glance, it looks like Tampa should've traded us Shields last year.
    Supposedly they were offered what we offered for Latos (of course no way to prove that). Looks like their waiting game backfired, and they got less for Shields.

    Although I must admit I'm not an expert on KC prospects, but this looks like a good deal for them. It's hard to fault a team like KC for trying to be relevant and adding talent. This will certainly make them a better team.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

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  16. #30
    Moderator RedlegJake's Avatar
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    Re: James Shields and Wade Davis traded to Kansas City

    KC almost had to make a deal like this to stave off fan apathy - even worse than Reds a decade earlier. It is bad here for local fans. Real bad. They are hoping the offense finds its young footing and the central is winnable. Despite Detroits title it really is too. This is a big play but if they aren't at least competitive they may play before fewer fans in September than a little league squad. Imo Odorizzi was overrated and Montgomery was lost last year. I'd take Corcino as equal or better to Jake. As someone said Royals prospects do underwhelm especially pitchers.


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