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Thread: John Fay Abstains from HOF Voting to Avoid Casting Votes for Bonds and Clemens

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    KungFu Fighter AtomicDumpling's Avatar
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    Re: John Fay Abstains from HOF Voting to Avoid Casting Votes for Bonds and Clemens

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Come on now, that's not even at 10% of my diatribe capabilities. I yawn more stridently than that.



    I think the problem is that you're now randomly picking good guys and bad guys. Were the Braves clean? Supposedly yes, but maybe we just think that because their local media whistled past the PED use. And you're throwing Sosa under the bus based on what evidence?

    My point is you have no idea whether PED use was concentrated on a handful of teams, let alone who those teams might have been (Philly was a glaring omission and the Yankees were a questionable inclusion). You can't make a comprehensive list of juicers. You can't even make an accurate partial list of juicers outside of guys who've been caught or admitted to juicing (and it's not just you, no one can).

    I don't disagree that GMs, managers and owners tacitly, or in some cases overtly, condoned PED use, but I'll guarantee your rogues gallery is incomplete and, in cases, possibly mistaken. Maybe the winning teams in MLB were a bit like Lance Armstrong, beating out a well-medicated pack of challengers.

    We don't know and I don't see how more uninformed suspicion does anything other than make the whole mess more convoluted.
    Let's not pretend that we don't know which teams gained the biggest advantage from steroids. There is a ton of information out there for us to make an informed opinion. My suspicions are not uninformed at all. The Mitchell Report, Canseco's books, Caminiti's revelations, the Balco investigation, numerous court cases involving players, the Game of Shadows book, Congressional hearings and the list goes on and on. There is plenty of information out there to help us form a very complete picture of the situation. We even know exactly which drug most of them took. This is not guesswork. Do the research before you criticize someone else's opinion as uninformed suspicion.

    We don't know every single player who took 'roids, especially during the later years of the steroid era when usage was widespread around the league. We do know which players were the heaviest users. It is likely that many players dabbled with PEDs and never got exposed, but the worst offenders are in the public record. My posts made no attempt to list all the cheaters because that is completely irrelevant to the point I was making. I was only giving a few examples of teams that had managers or general managers who will make the Hall of Fame.

    In the early years of the steroid era the usage of PEDs was limited to a few teams, some of which had managers and general managers who are likely to be inducted into the Hall of Fame someday. They are just as guilty of cheating as the players who took PEDs because they allowed the cheating and may even have encouraged the players to cheat. My point was that those managers and general managers should be held to the same moral standard as the players.
    Last edited by AtomicDumpling; 01-09-2013 at 03:46 PM.


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