Turn Off Ads?
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 54

Thread: Jocketty talking extensions

  1. #31
    Member Superdude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    2,807

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by Tadasimha View Post
    Why would this make you mad? It would be a really good thing imho for Hamilton (provided he shows development at AAA and if he gets a September call-up) to be the 4th outfielder behind Choo and Ludwick - getting his feet wet, making starts in CF with Choo in LF so Ludwick gets a break, coming in as a pinch runner. He could easily play his way into a starters roll by the end of the season or end up getting ready to be the starter in 2015 with Choo in LF after Ludwick's contract is up.
    Giving Hamilton 150 at bats and pinch running duty in his prime developmental years would definitely make me mad.

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #32
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    35,933

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by Superdude View Post
    Giving Hamilton 150 at bats and pinch running duty in his prime developmental years would definitely make me mad.
    It's called the Devin Mesoraco plan.... It seems to have done wonders for him.

  4. #33
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Bedford, KY
    Posts
    8,992

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    It's called the Devin Mesoraco plan.... It seems to have done wonders for him.
    Don't you have to first hit well enough to earn playing time?
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
    -- Christy Matthewson
    "Show me a good loser and I'll show you an idiot."
    -- Leo Durocher

  5. #34
    Member Superdude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    2,807

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Don't you have to first hit well enough to earn playing time?
    I can't really fault the reds for how they handled the catching spot last year given how valuable Hanigan is, but making rookies with pedigree "earn it" seems a little silly and arbitrary to me. If they think he can hit, give him an actual opportunity beyond a handful of trips to the plate every week.

  6. #35
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    16,314

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    It's called the Devin Mesoraco plan.... It seems to have done wonders for him.
    The Reds won 97 games and Mesoraco was only 23 on OD last year. Lets not get crazy.

  7. #36
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Bedford, KY
    Posts
    8,992

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by Superdude View Post
    ... making rookies with pedigree "earn it" seems a little silly and arbitrary to me. If they think he can hit, give him an actual opportunity beyond a handful of trips to the plate every week.
    Why?

    He earned a trip to the bigs on his pedigree. He earns more playing time with production over and above what the position player he replaces has done. Especially considering the team's chances to win the pennant.

    In seasons where pennants aren't at stake, the calculus obviously changes.

    But Mesoraco is going to have to earn his playing time. If he can.
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
    -- Christy Matthewson
    "Show me a good loser and I'll show you an idiot."
    -- Leo Durocher

  8. #37
    breath westofyou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    PDX
    Posts
    43,282
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Don't you have to first hit well enough to earn playing time?
    Yes you do, unless your Johnny Edwards 1961 and your hand is forced

    But it's not Devins fault that Hanigan is currently a better option

  9. #38
    Member Superdude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    2,807

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Why?

    He earned a trip to the bigs on his pedigree. He earns more playing time with production over and above what the position player he replaces has done. Especially considering the team's chances to win the pennant.

    In seasons where pennants aren't at stake, the calculus obviously changes.

    But Mesoraco is going to have to earn his playing time. If he can.
    Making him earn it in Mesoraco's case has been giving him limited, erratic playing time and judging him based on small sample size. I'm not saying let him flounder all summer in the heat of a pennant race, but earning anything necessitates an actual opportunity.

  10. #39
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    16,314

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Yes you do, unless your Johnny Edwards 1961 and your hand is forced

    But it's not Devins fault that Hanigan is currently a better option
    It is partially Devin's "fault". If Devin plays better, he'll see more time. Pretty simple.

  11. #40
    breath westofyou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    PDX
    Posts
    43,282

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    It is partially Devin's "fault". If Devin plays better, he'll see more time. Pretty simple.
    As ye sow, so shall ye reap.

  12. #41
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Bedford, KY
    Posts
    8,992

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by Superdude View Post
    Making him earn it in Mesoraco's case has been giving him limited, erratic playing time and judging him based on small sample size. I'm not saying let him flounder all summer in the heat of a pennant race, but earning anything necessitates an actual opportunity.
    So he earns it in that limited, erratic playing time so that his small sample size grows larger.

    I simply don't understand the mindset that continues from some posters that Mesoraco is entitled to playing time. Why wouldn't we, as fans, want the best player playing so that the Reds can win more? I'd understand this mindset if the Reds were Astros or Cubs bad (or even Pirates or Brewers bad), but this team is (and was last season) built to win.
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
    -- Christy Matthewson
    "Show me a good loser and I'll show you an idiot."
    -- Leo Durocher

  13. #42
    Member Superdude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    2,807

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    So he earns it in that limited, erratic playing time so that his small sample size grows larger.

    I simply don't understand the mindset that continues from some posters that Mesoraco is entitled to playing time. Why wouldn't we, as fans, want the best player playing so that the Reds can win more? I'd understand this mindset if the Reds were Astros or Cubs bad (or even Pirates or Brewers bad), but this team is (and was last season) built to win.
    I don't know where you're getting entitlement from. The best player should play, but its probably in our best interest to at least consider the possibility that Hanigan isn't the best player.

  14. #43
    Pitching is the thing WVRedsFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Rainelle, WV
    Posts
    8,173

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Yes you do, unless your Johnny Edwards 1961 and your hand is forced

    But it's not Devins fault that Hanigan is currently a better option
    .186. And that was a championship year back in the day without wild cards or other crazy things.
    www.ris-news.com
    "You only have to bat a thousand in two things; flying and heart transplants. Everything else you can go 4-for-5."
    -Beano Cook

  15. #44
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Bedford, KY
    Posts
    8,992

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by Superdude View Post
    I don't know where you're getting entitlement from. The best player should play, but its probably in our best interest to at least consider the possibility that Hanigan isn't the best player.
    I know of no metric that would come close to suggesting Mesoraco was within two wins of Hanigan last season.
    "You can learn little from victory. You can learn everything from defeat."
    -- Christy Matthewson
    "Show me a good loser and I'll show you an idiot."
    -- Leo Durocher

  16. #45
    Member Superdude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    2,807

    Re: Jocketty talking extensions

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    I know of no metric that would come close to suggesting Mesoraco was within two wins of Hanigan last season.
    You know what I mean. I wouldn't be making this argument if I thought last season was in any way reflective of Mesoraco's true talent level.

    And just for the record, I totally see your case for Hanigan over Mesoraco and I probably even agree on most days. I just find the question of how to integrate a potentially high impact rookie onto a winning ballclub interesting. That hasn't been a relevant topic in quite some time.


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25