Bartolo Colon vs. Josh Fogg - RedsZone.com - Cincinnati Reds Fans' Home for Baseball Discussion

TheBigLebowski · 02-25-2008, 01:58 PM

Which would you rather have had?

We got Fogg at a very affordable 1 mil for one year. Fogg is durable but his upside is..well..let's just say he is what he is.

BoSox signed Colon to a minor league deal and he stands to make a little more than 1 mil should he make the club.

To me, Colon has much better stuff and has the potential to be a VERY good #2 or #3 should he stay healthy, which I do acknowledge is unlikely.

Josh Fogg is durable, as I said, but you know you're not getting much more than an average #4/#5 starter.

Personally, I'd have rather taken a flier on Colon and used a young 'un in his place should he fail to make the team or go down with an injury, although I do want to reiterate that I DO think the Fogg signing was a good one.

Bip Roberts · 02-25-2008, 02:02 PM

Colon threw like 20 innings in the winter league and from reports had neck and shoulder/elbow injuries and discomfort if i recall. His stuff is no where what it used to be. I really doubt Colon throws another MLB pitch.

Newman4 · 02-25-2008, 02:12 PM

Colon used to have better stuff. I don't know if he still does or not. Depends on his health really. Of course, he's never been one to stay in tip-top shape.

Degenerate39 · 02-25-2008, 02:20 PM

I've always like Bartolo alot but I'm pretty sure that he's done for good now. I'd have to take Josh Fogg but if Bartolo has a good year in the Sox minor league then I'd have to set up a trade for him on July 31. The Red Sox don't really need him they're pretty stacked in the pitching department so I'd trade a Double A prospect for him at most. If you can't get a trade done then try to get him in the offseason. I'd love to have a healthy Bartolo Colon on the Reds but I really don't see him getting healthy for a whole season.

AdamDunn · 02-25-2008, 02:47 PM

I agree with you. While one million isn't a lot, it's still something and takes away development time for our prospects who have nothing to prove in the minors (like Bailey and Volquez)

Va Red Fan · 02-25-2008, 05:06 PM

I think that it would be best to let Cueto and Bailey for sure and possibly Volquez begin in Louisville and see how things shake out. Since it looks like Colon is washed up, I would surely take Fogg over him. He is not nearly as bad as some are claiming.

CRedsLarkin11 · 02-25-2008, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Va Red Fan

He is not nearly as bad as some are claiming.

WHAT!?!?!

I agree

AmarilloRed · 02-25-2008, 06:37 PM

Reports were coming out that he could not hit 90 mph in winter ball. If true, that explains why he didn't receive a 2 year deal.

Oxilon · 02-25-2008, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdamDunn

I agree with you. While one million isn't a lot, it's still something and takes away development time for our prospects who have nothing to prove in the minors (like Bailey and Volquez)

Strongly disagree. Bailey still needs to improve his control on his changeup and as well as his curve. He definitely has talent, but to say he has nothing to prove in the minors is wrong. Volquez, I can agree with you on, but it's looking like he'll make the rotation out of spring training regardless of Fogg or not.

I'm seeing the rotation out of ST as
1) Harang
2) Arroyo
3) Belisle
4) Volquez
5) Fogg
With Affleldt in the pen, and Bailey and Cueto starting out the season in Louisville.

AdamDunn · 02-25-2008, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oxilon

Strongly disagree. Bailey still needs to improve his control on his changeup and as well as his curve. He definitely has talent, but to say he has nothing to prove in the minors is wrong. Volquez, I can agree with you on, but it's looking like he'll make the rotation out of spring training regardless of Fogg or not.

I'm seeing the rotation out of ST as
1) Harang
2) Arroyo
3) Belisle
4) Volquez
5) Fogg
With Affleldt in the pen, and Bailey and Cueto starting out the season in Louisville.

Bailey may need to improve his control, but that doesn't mean he's going to do that in the minors. He clearly has the stuff to make it in the majors right now, even if that's the number four or five slot. I'd hate to see his confidence get shot by sending him up and down.

This is what I think will happen
1) Harang
2) Arroyo
3) Belisle
4) Affeldt
5) Fogg

Remember, this is Dusty and Dusty doesn't like young guys.

Redleg39 · 02-25-2008, 10:27 PM

The bottom line for me is that we were looking for a possible five starter in the rotation. Colon is going to at most be a middle to long reliever with the occasional spot start. Fogg was the best choice.

wlf WV · 02-26-2008, 01:11 PM

For the money,if we could get Colon,I would have both.

Bip Roberts · 02-26-2008, 03:39 PM

Id like to add this which I just picked up from MLBTR

Quote:

TUESDAY: The Boston Herald has the contract details. Colon gets $1.25MM if he's in the bigs, and the deal can reach $7MM if he makes 30 starts.

Newman4 · 02-26-2008, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oxilon

Strongly disagree. Bailey still needs to improve his control on his changeup and as well as his curve.

Definitely. Those two pitches are what determines if he becomes an ace or not. A season of working on them at AAA would help in the long run.

reds2221 · 02-27-2008, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Newman4

Definitely. Those two pitches are what determines if he becomes an ace or not. A season of working on them at AAA would help in the long run.

exactly, waiting a year to help develop is so much better in the long run than rushing him out there and watching him struggle.

02-25-2008, 01:58 PM	#1
TheBigLebowski Winning the Human Race Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Titletown, FL Posts: 3,798	Bartolo Colon vs. Josh Fogg Which would you rather have had? We got Fogg at a very affordable 1 mil for one year. Fogg is durable but his upside is..well..let's just say he is what he is. BoSox signed Colon to a minor league deal and he stands to make a little more than 1 mil should he make the club. To me, Colon has much better stuff and has the potential to be a VERY good #2 or #3 should he stay healthy, which I do acknowledge is unlikely. Josh Fogg is durable, as I said, but you know you're not getting much more than an average #4/#5 starter. Personally, I'd have rather taken a flier on Colon and used a young 'un in his place should he fail to make the team or go down with an injury, although I do want to reiterate that I DO think the Fogg signing was a good one. __________________ The land was farther away from the core and had much less gravity so bigness could develop and dominate -Jose Canseco

02-25-2008, 05:06 PM	#6
Va Red Fan Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 117	Re: Bartolo Colon vs. Josh Fogg I think that it would be best to let Cueto and Bailey for sure and possibly Volquez begin in Louisville and see how things shake out. Since it looks like Colon is washed up, I would surely take Fogg over him. He is not nearly as bad as some are claiming.

02-25-2008, 06:37 PM	#8
AmarilloRed Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Amarillo,Texas Posts: 3,997	Re: Bartolo Colon vs. Josh Fogg Reports were coming out that he could not hit 90 mph in winter ball. If true, that explains why he didn't receive a 2 year deal.

02-25-2008, 10:27 PM	#11
Redleg39 Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Powell, Ohio Posts: 113	Re: Bartolo Colon vs. Josh Fogg The bottom line for me is that we were looking for a possible five starter in the rotation. Colon is going to at most be a middle to long reliever with the occasional spot start. Fogg was the best choice.

02-26-2008, 01:11 PM	#12
wlf WV Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: huntington,wv Posts: 527	Re: Bartolo Colon vs. Josh Fogg For the money,if we could get Colon,I would have both.

02-25-2008, 02:02 PM	#2
Bip Roberts Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,189	Re: Bartolo Colon vs. Josh Fogg Colon threw like 20 innings in the winter league and from reports had neck and shoulder/elbow injuries and discomfort if i recall. His stuff is no where what it used to be. I really doubt Colon throws another MLB pitch.

02-25-2008, 02:12 PM	#3
Newman4 Old Red Guard Reject Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,419	Re: Bartolo Colon vs. Josh Fogg Colon used to have better stuff. I don't know if he still does or not. Depends on his health really. Of course, he's never been one to stay in tip-top shape. __________________ If you ain't first, you're last! - Ricky Bobby

02-25-2008, 02:20 PM	#4
Degenerate39 Senor Votto Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 7,847	Re: Bartolo Colon vs. Josh Fogg I've always like Bartolo alot but I'm pretty sure that he's done for good now. I'd have to take Josh Fogg but if Bartolo has a good year in the Sox minor league then I'd have to set up a trade for him on July 31. The Red Sox don't really need him they're pretty stacked in the pitching department so I'd trade a Double A prospect for him at most. If you can't get a trade done then try to get him in the offseason. I'd love to have a healthy Bartolo Colon on the Reds but I really don't see him getting healthy for a whole season. __________________ Most Vottomatic Player

02-25-2008, 02:47 PM	#5
AdamDunn Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 407	Re: Bartolo Colon vs. Josh Fogg I agree with you. While one million isn't a lot, it's still something and takes away development time for our prospects who have nothing to prove in the minors (like Bailey and Volquez)

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