How is David Weathers still in MLB?

[44Magnum]

The man is way past done!

[Root Down]

He's had some real good outings before last night! I must say that I don't think he's washed up. Two nights ago there were three scouts at the game watching only Weathers.

[durl]

Because, for the month of June, he pitched 14 innings with an ERA of 1.93 with 7 Ks and only 1 BB.

I'd call that good pitching.

I have to ask, do you really look at the stats before you rip players?

[44Magnum]

The man is in trouble nearly every game he pitches in. He probably gives up at least one run per appearance in at least 50% of his games.

[Ahhhorsepoo]

his stats say that is not the case magnum.. except for when he is at home.. when we see him the most.. just upsets me that we let salmon and coutlangus go.. and kept weathers and merker.. those young guys couldnt have been worse than these guys.. and are far more moldable into big league players..

[44Magnum]

The man has given up at least 1 run in 33% of his appearances.
He has give up at least 1 hit in 64% of his appearances, which is terrible when you consider his appearances average less than 1 inning per.
He has pitched 32.1 innings and given up 15 earned runs.

That is terrible! :thumbdown

[durl]

Originally Posted by 44Magnum

The man is in trouble nearly every game he pitches in. He probably gives up at least one run per appearance in at least 50% of his games.

Not quite.

His trend was very good over June. 14 appearances and 3 earned runs. That included appearances against the Yankees, Red Sox, Cards, Florida, and Philadelphia.

For 2008, Weathers allows a run in 46% of innings pitched. CC Sabathia allows a run in 42%. Roy Oswalt allows a run in 51%. Ted Lilly does 51% of innings pitched.

[durl]

Originally Posted by 44Magnum

The man has given up at least 1 run in 33% of his appearances.
He has give up at least 1 hit in 64% of his appearances, which is terrible when you consider his appearances average less than 1 inning per.
He has pitched 32.1 innings and given up 15 earned runs.

That is terrible! :thumbdown

You're ignoring the fact that he's improved as the season has progressed.

His total numbers do need to look better, I'll grant you that. However, an ERA under 2 in his last 14 appearances is VERY good.

[flash]

Salmon is currently with the Omaha Royals pitching a 4+ ERA. Coutlangus is at Tucson with a 15+ ERA. He also is on the disable list. How could they have helped the Reds.

[StrikeIndicator]

Originally Posted by Ahhhorsepoo

his stats say that is not the case magnum.. except for when he is at home.. when we see him the most.. just upsets me that we let salmon and coutlangus go.. and kept weathers and merker.. those young guys couldnt have been worse than these guys.. and are far more moldable into big league players..

The problem is they never let the mature young guys in the pen have a chance.

And when they did, David Ross would hang them out to dry calling for outside pitches so he could get the jump on guys trying to steal 2nd. With that info in every scouting report, hitters just sat back and waited for their pitch. runner ended up on third or scored.

Veterans in the pen ALWAYS seem to get not only the benefit of the doubt but they get the 1st, 2nd and 3rd call from MLB clubs. As long as you have options, you have nothing.

Look at Tomko. Stunk as a starter with the Royals, moved to the pen where he stunk that up too, clears waivers and ends up in the pen for the Padres.

Trust me, if the Reds cut DW, he would be in another bullpen as soon as he cleared waivers at the latest.

PS
I know guys who have pitched with him and by all reports he brings alot more to the clubhouse and the community than what you see on the mound. He is a solid citizen and all around good guy.

[Grounds_Crew]

Consider this...

Maybe you guys are using his as the scape goat and finding an easy way to place blame...


Oh how soon we forget.
Weathers had a bad game last night. Horrific.
Yet he had the 2nd best ERA on the team in June.... 1.98 in 14 games.
And he had the best percentage of preventing inherited runners from scoring on the team entering last night.....allowing just 1 of 11 runners to score: 9%
For comparison
Cordero 7 of 9 inherited runners scored (78%)
Burton 6 of 14 (43%)
Bray 8 of 19 (42%)
Affeldt 10 of 29 (34%)
Lincoln 8 of 26 (31%)
Also....Weathers had retired the first batter faced 63% of the time.....Cordero 51%
And one year ago Weathers saved 33 of 39 games....85%
Cordero has saved 15 of 18 games.....83%
Weathers bring something this team needs more of....professionalism and accountability.
I'll be sad to see him go in the next couple of weeks.

[durl]

Excellent stats, Grounds Crew. You did a great job of answering the OP's question. Facts are a wonderful thing to counter our impressions.

[Grounds_Crew]

I can't take the credit for those stats...I pulled those from Lance McAlister's blog.

[tommycash]

Stats can be a bit deceiving in this case. (Just a bit). On June 25 Weathers came in and blew a save without giving up any ER at all. He just came in and allowed 4 hits. But it you only look at a relievers ERA, instead of taking into effect that people actually watch games and see batters hit Weathers hard, you may come up with an assumption that because Weathers hasn't given up a run in a while means that he is actually getting better. Weathers is a lifetime mediocre reliever who has happened to have a couple of better than average (for him) seasons with the Reds. I see him as a 41 year old man who will never have a end of season sub 4 ERA anymore because he simply gives up too many hits (guys are hitting .288 against him this year). If batters continue to hit that against him (and if you watch Weathers play this year you know they will), his ERA will go up and numbers only guys will turn on him too.

[Jack Burton]

Originally Posted by tommycash

Stats can be a bit deceiving in this case. (Just a bit). On June 25 Weathers came in and blew a save without giving up any ER at all. He just came in and allowed 4 hits. But it you only look at a relievers ERA, instead of taking into effect that people actually watch games and see batters hit Weathers hard, you may come up with an assumption that because Weathers hasn't given up a run in a while means that he is actually getting better. Weathers is a lifetime mediocre reliever who has happened to have a couple of better than average (for him) seasons with the Reds. I see him as a 41 year old man who will never have a end of season sub 4 ERA anymore because he simply gives up too many hits (guys are hitting .288 against him this year). If batters continue to hit that against him (and if you watch Weathers play this year you know they will), his ERA will go up and numbers only guys will turn on him too.

This about sums it up. Weathers should never be used in close games, only mop up duty. Move him if we can get anything, but by the sound of things in this thread we should get our pick of prospects. C'mon.