OSU-UM Football Rivalry

[ThornWithin81]

Originally Posted by WMR

I wonder what sort of response you would receive if this question was posed to the current UM student body?

They would hate it. Absolutely hate it.

It defines both of our football programs (I went to Ohio State from 2004 to 2009). It is everything.

I think they should just leave the conference alone. We've had 11 teams for years now and we only had one division. Every team gets 8 divisional games. Instead of playing 8 out of 10 division peers each year, teams will now play 8 out of 11. Simply add in Nebraska and leave it alone. Make sure the big rivalries play every year and go from there.

I hate the 6 and 6 "Title Game" setups anyway. Teams should not play twice a year in College Football, unless by some freak circumstances two non-conference opponents play early in the season, go undefeated from there and meet again in the National Title game (or another bowl, for that matter).

Think about this: If the Big Ten had 12 teams in 2006 when "The Game of the Century" was played in Columbus, that game would have lost most of it's meaning, assuming OSU and Michigan were in opposite conferences. OSU beats Michigan and then faces Michigan on a neutral site the next week? Terrible. Just terrible.

It's perfect that our seasons always end up against each other. If OSU is undefeated and heading to a title game, they have to get through the Wolverines. If the Wolverines are undefeated and heading for the title game (Sadly, a long shot these days) they have to go through the Buckeyes.

That is the way it should always be.

[westofyou]

Originally Posted by Cedric

In terms of football talent compared to Michigan? Yes it sure is.

I think that is what 15 fan was talking about.

Not the drift I was getting, "destination" "options" all belie the place, not the folks at said place.

That said I'd take Ann Arbor 10000 times over Columbus... as a "destination"

[WVRed]

Originally Posted by Cedric

In terms of football talent compared to Michigan? Yes it sure is.

I think that is what 15 fan was talking about.

I'm thinking more along the lines of college atmosphere. SoCal and beach life, etc.

All Ohio State has to offer is academics and facilities.

[Boston Red]

Originally Posted by westofyou

Not the drift I was getting, "destination" "options" all belie the place, not the folks at said place.

That said I'd take Ann Arbor 10000 times over Columbus... as a "destination"

And I'd take Westwood, CA 10000 times over both if a kid is really exploring his options.....though, somehow, UCLA has still managed to be mediocre to bad for most of a decade.

[ThornWithin81]

Originally Posted by WVRed

I'm thinking more along the lines of college atmosphere. SoCal and beach life, etc.

All Ohio State has to offer is academics and facilities.

Sorry, wrong. "College Atmosphere" goes beyond sunny weather and beach access. If you play football at Ohio State you are a god in the city of Columbus, especially on that campus. That goes a long way, as does the fact that most of OSU's players grow up wearing OSU gear from the crib onward.

[15fan]

Originally Posted by westofyou

And Columbus is the Paris of the Midwest?

Nah. Parisians are snooty. Columbus is more...London. It's always gray both places.

Shoulda done a better job spelling out my premise. In a nutshell,

http://www.census.gov/popest/states/NST-ann-est.html

Michigan's population has been flat for the past decade, and has actually declined each of the last 4 years. Over the same time frame, Ohio (which has about 1.5 million more people) has added population each year, and grown by about 200,000 people over the decade. The Great Lakes region as a whole isn't adding population like the sun belt, southwest, or California. Michigan as a state is seeing a net outflow of people. There doesn't appear to be anything on the immediate horizon to reverse that trend line.

That's a reflection of a lot of things. Mainly economics. If you are a kid who grew up in Michigan, staying at home for college & football is an easier sell. If you are a kid from outside the state / region, it's a tougher sell. Factor in the weather (worse in Ann Arbor than in just about any other major college football town), and the smaller home state population base from which to draw, and those are two big things that UM must overcome. All else being equal, UM must import talent without a couple of the usual selling points that make it easy for Chambers of Commerce to drum up interest.

[15fan]

double post

[westofyou]

Originally Posted by 15fan

Nah. Parisians are snooty. Columbus is more...London. It's always gray both places.

Shoulda done a better job spelling out my premise. In a nutshell,

http://www.census.gov/popest/states/NST-ann-est.html

Michigan's population has been flat for the past decade, and has actually declined each of the last 4 years. Over the same time frame, Ohio (which has about 1.5 million more people) has added population each year, and grown by about 200,000 people over the decade. The Great Lakes region as a whole isn't adding population like the sun belt, southwest, or California. Michigan as a state is seeing a net outflow of people. There doesn't appear to be anything on the immediate horizon to reverse that trend line.

That's a reflection of a lot of things. Mainly economics. If you are a kid who grew up in Michigan, staying at home for college & football is an easier sell. If you are a kid from outside the state / region, it's a tougher sell. Factor in the weather (worse in Ann Arbor than in just about any other major college football town), and the smaller home state population base from which to draw, and those are two big things that UM must overcome. All else being equal, UM must import talent without a couple of the usual selling points that make it easy for Chambers of Commerce to drum up interest.

Stats are stats, and Columbus is still Columbus.

[Sea Ray]

Originally Posted by ThornWithin81

They would hate it. Absolutely hate it.

It defines both of our football programs (I went to Ohio State from 2004 to 2009). It is everything.

I think they should just leave the conference alone. We've had 11 teams for years now and we only had one division. Every team gets 8 divisional games. Instead of playing 8 out of 10 division peers each year, teams will now play 8 out of 11. Simply add in Nebraska and leave it alone. Make sure the big rivalries play every year and go from there.

I hate the 6 and 6 "Title Game" setups anyway. Teams should not play twice a year in College Football, unless by some freak circumstances two non-conference opponents play early in the season, go undefeated from there and meet again in the National Title game (or another bowl, for that matter).

Think about this: If the Big Ten had 12 teams in 2006 when "The Game of the Century" was played in Columbus, that game would have lost most of it's meaning, assuming OSU and Michigan were in opposite conferences. OSU beats Michigan and then faces Michigan on a neutral site the next week? Terrible. Just terrible.

It's perfect that our seasons always end up against each other. If OSU is undefeated and heading to a title game, they have to get through the Wolverines. If the Wolverines are undefeated and heading for the title game (Sadly, a long shot these days) they have to go through the Buckeyes.

That is the way it should always be.

That ship's already sailed. The main reason for adding a 12th team was so they could have a championship game. I share your concern about teams having to play twice but it'll also break ties. There have been years where the top two teams in the Big Ten didn't play each other.

[Chip R]

Originally Posted by 15fan

UM and RR each got what they deserved when they hooked up, IMO.

UM has historically done well when they've poached top shelf talent from Ohio. When Tressell shut of that pipeline, the tide turned.

I think UM is going to have a tough time returning to the status as an elite power every year. Michigan as a destination is a really tough sell. Especially on 18-23 year olds who also have options to head to places like Austin, LA, Tallahassee, Miami, etc.

If location were the top priority of playing football in college, none of the Big 10 schools or Big 12 schools would get any recruits.

[ThornWithin81]

Originally Posted by westofyou

Stats are stats, and Columbus is still Columbus.

I wouldn't move back to Columbus for any length of time. If it weren't for the friends I have in the city I wouldn't even consider it on a short time basis.

I've never been to Ann Arbor so I can't compare.

[paintmered]

What's the first non-OSU thing you think about when it comes to Columbus? I'm still trying to think of something... Chain restaurants, maybe?

Oh, and OSU and Michigan need to play every year.

[westofyou]

Originally Posted by ThornWithin81

I wouldn't move back to Columbus for any length of time. If it weren't for the friends I have in the city I wouldn't even consider it on a short time basis.

I've never been to Ann Arbor so I can't compare.

Ann Arbor is smaller, I haven't been in YEARS so I'm not qualified to speak of now... I'm just pushing buttons... well because i'm a UM fan, and that's all I got right now

[guttle11]

Originally Posted by paintmered

What's the first non-OSU thing you think about when it comes to Columbus? I'm still trying to think of something... Chain restaurants, maybe?

Oh, and OSU and Michigan need to play every year.

The Big Bang.

[ThornWithin81]

Originally Posted by westofyou

Ann Arbor is smaller, I haven't been in YEARS so I'm not qualified to speak of now... I'm just pushing buttons... well because i'm a UM fan, and that's all I got right now

All I know is that they play in a giant toilet bowl.