10 Most Lopsided Trades in the Reds' Favor

[Bob Borkowski]

I'm enjoying this thread. It's lots of fun thinking about the players acquired by us for a song...lots of great memories.

The hard part will be looking at the list Fay will be coming up with next - the trades that backfired on the Reds. Players involved such as , oh I don't know, maybe Christy Mathewson and Frank Robinson! Oh my laundry! :all_cohol

[westofyou]

the trades that backfired on the Reds

Adcock trade
Sauer Trade
Getting Frank Thomas
Harper for Culver
Flood trade
Osteen trade

[George Anderson]

Originally Posted by Bob Borkowski

- the trades that backfired on the Reds.

Paul O'Neill for Roberto Kelly.
Hal McRae for Roger Nelson and Richie Scheinblum.

[RedsBaron]

The Reds traded Ross Grimsley to the Orioles after 1973 for Merv Rettenmund. In 1974 Grimsley won 18 games for the O's while Rettenmund was terrible. Put Grimsley on the '74 Reds and perhaps they catch LA in the NL West.
In June of 1977 the Reds traded Mike Caldwell for nothing much. In 1978 Caldwell won 22 games for the Brewers while Grimsley won 20 for the Expos, and both pitchers had good ERAs. The Reds got nothing from either trade. If both Grimsley and Caldwell had been on the 1978 staff the Reds would have returned to the World Series that year, Sparky would not have been fired, there would have been world peace, etc.

[westofyou]

Originally Posted by RedsBaron

The Reds traded Ross Grimsley to the Orioles after 1973 for Merv Rettenmund. In 1974 Grimsley won 18 games for the O's while Rettenmund was terrible. Put Grimsley on the '74 Reds and perhaps they catch LA in the NL West.
In June of 1977 the Reds traded Mike Caldwell for nothing much. In 1978 Caldwell won 22 games for the Brewers while Grimsley won 20 for the Expos, and both pitchers had good ERAs. The Reds got nothing from either trade. If both Grimsley and Caldwell had been on the 1978 staff the Reds would have returned to the World Series that year, Sparky would not have been fired, there would have been world peace, etc.

Both learned the spitter from George Bamberger however, that's what extended their careers. Grimsley forced the hand of the Reds when he and Sparky butted heads, he was definitely "new school" and a junkballer in a fastball league. Apparently once while getting bombed in Baltimore Bamberger came to the mound and asked him if he had ever thought of cheating to get the pitch in, Grimsley apparently said no, and Bamberger replied, maybe you should.

When Caldwell was a Brewer he was crediting his new found 'sinker' as his success that year, one of the other team managers replied, "So that's what they're calling it now."

Maybe the Reds need Bamberger more than Grimsley and Caldwell.

[Chip R]

Originally Posted by WebScorpion

December 9th, 1977 - The A's and Reds announce a deal that will send P Vida Blue to Cincinnati for OF Dave Revering and $1.75 million cash. Adding a Cy Young award winning pitcher to the two-time World Champion Reds lineup proves to be just too much. Commissioner Bowie Kuhn voids the deal less than 2 months later... I was looking forward to that 3rd championship.

Oh yeah, Blue went on to pitch 258 innings of 1.17 WHIP ball for the Giants and the Reds finished 2.5 games behind the Dodgers in 1978.

[HokieRed]

Among the bad ones, Perez for Fryman has to rank high.

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by HokieRed

Among the bad ones, Perez for Fryman has to rank high.

We also got Dale Murray, who was (at the time) a reliever in the Scott Sullivan mold.

It should have been a good trade, as the paramters were well thought out.

Instead of allowing the BRM to get old and run down, trade its oldest (Rose was actually older but he doesn't count) component for some decent pitching depth, when we had the multi-talented Driessen in the wings chomping to play.

Driessen had decent (if unacceptional) power, but was a high average, slick fielding firstbaseman who could draw walks and steal 30 bases.

But he regressed somewhat in all phases of his game, and the Reds underestimated Perez' influence on the rest of the team.

The trade was the first dismantling of the BGM and, as such, was a horrible trade. But I remember understanding it and liking it at the time.

FWIW, Driessen actually outhit Perez in the first year following the trade, .843 OPS to .816. In the next 3 years, they were pretty similar.

But it's one case where I think you need to look beyond the numbers, as every member of the BRM will tell you.

[VR]

Originally Posted by westofyou

Adcock trade
Sauer Trade
Getting Frank Thomas
Harper for Culver
Flood trade
Osteen trade

Non-Reds fans would add Hamilton to that list.

[westofyou]

Originally Posted by VR

Non-Reds fans would add Hamilton to that list.

Jury still out there

[HokieRed]

Originally Posted by PuffyPig

We also got Dale Murray, who was (at the time) a reliever in the Scott Sullivan mold.

It should have been a good trade, as the paramters were well thought out.

Instead of allowing the BRM to get old and run down, trade its oldest (Rose was actually older but he doesn't count) component for some decent pitching depth, when we had the multi-talented Driessen in the wings chomping to play.

Driessen had decent (if unacceptional) power, but was a high average, slick fielding firstbaseman who could draw walks and steal 30 bases.

But he regressed somewhat in all phases of his game, and the Reds underestimated Perez' influence on the rest of the team.

The trade was the first dismantling of the BGM and, as such, was a horrible trade. But I remember understanding it and liking it at the time.

FWIW, Driessen actually outhit Perez in the first year following the trade, .843 OPS to .816. In the next 3 years, they were pretty similar.

But it's one case where I think you need to look beyond the numbers, as every member of the BRM will tell you.

Unlike you, Puffy, I hated the trade from Day One. I remembered the Robinson trade all too well.

[Tony Cloninger]

Gary Nolan got mono during ST and then hurt his toe and then his arm again...as the year went on...plus he was a Jerry K client....so he went out with Eastwick and the rest on June 15. That whole year was a mess.....FA made everyone ask for their share...and it looked like the players were not feeling the FO was being loyal. From the Perez trade down to new contracts.

Joe Horner replaces Caldwell in the bullpen? Terrible bench that year as well. I think the average of the reserves was a combined barely .200 with 0 pop really.

[westofyou]

Originally Posted by PuffyPig

We also got Dale Murray, who was (at the time) a reliever in the Scott Sullivan mold.

It should have been a good trade, as the paramters were well thought out.

Instead of allowing the BRM to get old and run down, trade its oldest (Rose was actually older but he doesn't count) component for some decent pitching depth, when we had the multi-talented Driessen in the wings chomping to play.

Driessen had decent (if unacceptional) power, but was a high average, slick fielding firstbaseman who could draw walks and steal 30 bases.

But he regressed somewhat in all phases of his game, and the Reds underestimated Perez' influence on the rest of the team.

The trade was the first dismantling of the BGM and, as such, was a horrible trade. But I remember understanding it and liking it at the time.

FWIW, Driessen actually outhit Perez in the first year following the trade, .843 OPS to .816. In the next 3 years, they were pretty similar.

But it's one case where I think you need to look beyond the numbers, as every member of the BRM will tell you.

Both reds were Jerry Kapstein clients, that was a part of it.

[VR]

Originally Posted by westofyou

Jury still out there

For Reds fans....yes. On the surface for the baseball world, no.

[Benihana]

As much as I like him as a guy, Dave Parker for Jose Rijo (and Tim Birtsas) worked out quite nicely. Ditto for Van Snider for Hal Morris (and Lou Pinella?)