5/23/11 - Reds at Phillies

[OldXOhio]

Originally Posted by Reds/Flyers Fan

It's May

[edabbs44]

Originally Posted by Quatitos

A 3.5 is too high to be real this far into the season?

uzr/150 of around 25 right now. Double what the best in baseball was last year.

[edabbs44]

Originally Posted by reds44

I am much more worried about SS than LF. The Reds have a lot of guys who could come up and play LF right now (Heisey, Alonso, Frazier, Sappelt when he's healthy). The Reds have precisely nothing at SS.

You have a ton of faith in young guys having early success.

Ask Jay Bruce, the #1 prospect in baseball, how long it took him to get to where he is.

[Screwball]

Originally Posted by oneupper

Won't matter.

Arroyo 1-5 5.54 ERA vs Philly. They kill him regularly.

Prophetic.

On a side note, after the Reds' loss tonight and the Brewers win (they're up 6-1 on the Nationals in the 7th), Milwaukee will have tied us for 2nd place. And honestly, given the upcoming matchups, it might only get worse before it gets better.

Yuck.

[757690]

Just for the record...

On this date in 1975, the BRM was 22-20.

[OldXOhio]

Originally Posted by reds44

As do I. All 4 of them, in fact.

The Reds are waisting their time with what they're doing in LF. Eventually the figure it out and we will all ask what took them so long.

SS is something that will be addressed via trade. Hopefully Walt can get the big fish.

Hanley?

[Quatitos]

Originally Posted by edabbs44

uzr/150 of around 25 right now. Double what the best in baseball was last year.

Go look at his uzr/150 for third base.

Sent from my DROID2 using Tapatalk

[Tony Cloninger]

Originally Posted by 757690

Just for the record...

On this date in 1975, the BRM was 22-20.

I know the BRM....I saw the BRM.... Sir, I can tell you with all honesty, this Reds team is NO BRM.

[reds44]

@DatDudeBP Maybe Volquez was right! We do need to score more runs! LMAO... """""Believe Reds Fans""""

[757690]

Originally Posted by Tony Cloninger

I know the BRM....I saw the BRM.... Sir, I can tell you with all honesty, this Reds team is NO BRM.

Neither was the BRM on May 23, 1975.

I also could post around 100 examples of teams that were doing worse on this date than the current Reds that went on to make the playoffs.

[mth123]

Originally Posted by 757690

Neither was the BRM on May 23, 1975.

I also could post around 100 examples of teams that were doing worse on this date than the current Reds that went on to make the playoffs.

Two World Series appearances, another Division title, 3 MVP awards from two different players, four 95+ win seasons and several multiple time All Stars and Gold Glovers in the 5 previous years suggests that comparing this Reds team to that one might be a bad idea. They'd been the BRM for 5 years already and there was much more reason to have confidence that they had a run of high level success in them than we have with this team.

This team is an 85 to 90 win team with question marks in many areas. Its what they were when last season ended. Its what they were in the winter when improvements weren't made. Its what they were when they were sweeping the Cards and its what they are in the midst of a 6 game losing streak.

My real issue is the idea, that many have, that a team like that is good enough or that all the question marks will come through as positives and that improvements or the addition of a sure thing or two aren't necessary. They were and are necessary to go to the next level and everything they need is not available inside the organization.

[Ron Madden]

Man, I hate losing streaks.

[757690]

Originally Posted by mth123

Two World Series appearances, another Division title, 3 MVP awards from two different players, four 95+ win seasons and several multiple time All Stars and Gold Glovers in the 5 previous years suggests that comparing this Reds team to that one might be a bad idea. They'd been the BRM for 5 years already and there was much more reason to have confidence that they had a run of high level success in them than we have with this team.

This team is an 85 to 90 win team with question marks in many areas. Its what they were when last season ended. Its what they were in the winter when improvements weren't made. Its what they were when they were sweeping the Cards and its what they are in the midst of a 6 game losing streak.

My real issue is the idea, that many have, that a team like that is good enough or that all the question marks will come through as positives and that improvements or the addition of a sure thing or two aren't necessary. They were and are necessary to go to the next level and everything they need is not available inside the organization.

First, this team doesn't have to become the BRM in order for that fact to be meaningful, and applicable to the present situation.

Second, I have to wonder if the 1975 Reds make the playoffs with Vukovich at third and Foster on the bench. The point being that there is plenty of time for this team to make adjustments and improve, which really was the only point I was trying to make.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Now, I didn't get to watch the game, but reading this thread it looks like Maloney was horrible. But I'm seeing the stat line as 3.1 ip, 3 hits and 1 run allowed (HR). How is this bad? It's certainly not great, but against the Phillies lineup, 3 hits ain't shabby IMO. So how the Pen screwed this game up I'll never know. This is all on Bronson. And no, I'm not worried about Arroyo. He'll always have a game or 2 like this every year. But 9 times out of 10, he bounces back strong.

And btw....LOVING Bruce at the plate lately.

[Tony Cloninger]

Originally Posted by 757690

First, this team doesn't have to become the BRM in order for that fact to be meaningful, and applicable to the present situation.

Second, I have to wonder if the 1975 Reds make the playoffs with Vukovich at third and Foster on the bench. The point being that there is plenty of time for this team to make adjustments and improve, which really was the only point I was trying to make.

I was looking at Baseball Reference and I just happened to go into 1973. Saw that in about 50 games... OAK was under .500 and Cincy was barely over.

Those teams obviously made changes (Finley would make tons of trades from 1972-74 to fill out his bench) when trades were easier to make but they would also bring up players from Triple A.

I wish I had more recent examples obviously and I am not doubting that things can turn around .... but what trades can they make and they seem reluctant to trade too many minor leaguers beacuse they know they need those to sustain the future.

IF they believed in Alonso, Frazier or Francisco....they would be here by now and starting in LF. Baker can barely commit to saying he will start Heisey.
It will be interesting thing to watch as they hook their horses to their guys especially Gomes ...who does not deserve this kind of loyalty, in regards to starting. Bench guy...fine. But they act like he is Eric Davis in 1990 or Greg Vaughn in 1999...guys with good pedigrees who the team was counting on those years but struggled early and did not come on until late in the year.

Pitching wise....they have depth but how good is it to sustain itself if Volquez does not turn it around or if mono and just plain law of averages catches up to Arroyo? It's like they left it all in that sweep of STL.