Chevy Volt: 1 Year Later?

[Spazzrico]

Originally Posted by Yachtzee

Yes. I can go on road trips in a TDI without worrying about where to plug in if I need to stay at a hotel. If I'm buying a car that has limits on how I use it compared to another car, it needs to come in at a lower price. In my mind, inconvenience plays a role in the cost as well.

I hate to quit restating this, but you wouldn't have to worry about that. The Volt runs on gas when the initial charge runs out. It is fully electric until then, then it becomes a hybrid. I'm starting to think this is the biggest problem with the Volt. They need a full on media blitz to get it through the thick-skulled American mind that it can be driven anywhere like any other car without fear of becoming stranded.

To your larger point, more people would indeed begin driving these things in mass when the price point in cost per mile driven drops below many traditional fueled economy models.

[paintmered]

Originally Posted by Yachtzee

Yes. I can go on road trips in a TDI without worrying about where to plug in if I need to stay at a hotel. If I'm buying a car that has limits on how I use it compared to another car, it needs to come in at a lower price. In my mind, inconvenience plays a role in the cost as well.

Thanks for proving my earlier point that GM has failed to educate the general public how the Volt works.

[Slyder]

Originally Posted by durl

You're welcome.

Just be prepared for an electric car tax. States won't be happy with you driving on the roads without paying gas taxes to help maintain them.

Or the fact the state is likely to have to pay for the upkeep of the plugs to charge them.

[Yachtzee]

Originally Posted by Spazzrico

I hate to quit restating this, but you wouldn't have to worry about that. The Volt runs on gas when the initial charge runs out. It is fully electric until then, then it becomes a hybrid. I'm starting to think this is the biggest problem with the Volt. They need a full on media blitz to get it through the thick-skulled American mind that it can be driven anywhere like any other car without fear of becoming stranded.

To your larger point, more people would indeed begin driving these things in mass when the price point in cost per mile driven drops below many traditional fueled economy models.

I understand what you're saying, but if I'm not plugging it in to get a full charge, I'm not getting the promised savings and I'm therefore left with a really expensive Prius, which aren't cheap to begin with. With my driving needs, I'm likely to be driving it in regular hybrid mode more often than not. I could get a Volkswagen Jetta SportWagen TDI and fit the whole family into a car that has good performance and good fuel economy for much less than a Volt. And of course I like cars I know I can get 200k miles and 10 years out of, and VW's been making TDIs for years, so its proven technology. If you want me to be an early adopter on the Volt, Chevy, you're going to have to make sure I can afford it and give me a warranty that tells me you'll fix anything at least until I pay off the car.

GM's problem is that any time they make something cool, they price it out so that only aging baby boomers can buy it. Their entry level and midsize cars generally tend to be boring, at least since they got rid of Pontiac, where you could get a G6 GT without breaking the bank. Meanwhile, people my age and younger are looking to Asian and European manufacturers for affordable cars that get good mileage while still giving good performance.

[Spazzrico]

Originally Posted by Yachtzee

I understand what you're saying, but if I'm not plugging it in to get a full charge, I'm not getting the promised savings and I'm therefore left with a really expensive Prius, which aren't cheap to begin with. With my driving needs, I'm likely to be driving it in regular hybrid mode more often than not. I could get a Volkswagen Jetta SportWagen TDI and fit the whole family into a car that has good performance and good fuel economy for much less than a Volt. And of course I like cars I know I can get 200k miles and 10 years out of, and VW's been making TDIs for years, so its proven technology. If you want me to be an early adopter on the Volt, Chevy, you're going to have to make sure I can afford it and give me a warranty that tells me you'll fix anything at least until I pay off the car.

GM's problem is that any time they make something cool, they price it out so that only aging baby boomers can buy it. Their entry level and midsize cars generally tend to be boring, at least since they got rid of Pontiac, where you could get a G6 GT without breaking the bank. Meanwhile, people my age and younger are looking to Asian and European manufacturers for affordable cars that get good mileage while still giving good performance.

Pretty much agreed. It's a work in progress & until gas prices really skyrocket or costs with new generations come down it will remain so. Here's just some cost per mile info to add to the fire....

[JaxRed]

Originally Posted by Slyder

Or the fact the state is likely to have to pay for the upkeep of the plugs to charge them.

Why would states pay for the upkeep of plugs? I don't even know what "upkeep for plugs" means....

The Leaf is pretty much a commuter car. The plug is in my garage. 1875 gas free miles now.

[paintmered]

Originally Posted by Yachtzee

I understand what you're saying, but if I'm not plugging it in to get a full charge, I'm not getting the promised savings and I'm therefore left with a really expensive Prius, which aren't cheap to begin with. With my driving needs, I'm likely to be driving it in regular hybrid mode more often than not. I could get a Volkswagen Jetta SportWagen TDI and fit the whole family into a car that has good performance and good fuel economy for much less than a Volt. And of course I like cars I know I can get 200k miles and 10 years out of, and VW's been making TDIs for years, so its proven technology. If you want me to be an early adopter on the Volt, Chevy, you're going to have to make sure I can afford it and give me a warranty that tells me you'll fix anything at least until I pay off the car.

GM's problem is that any time they make something cool, they price it out so that only aging baby boomers can buy it. Their entry level and midsize cars generally tend to be boring, at least since they got rid of Pontiac, where you could get a G6 GT without breaking the bank. Meanwhile, people my age and younger are looking to Asian and European manufacturers for affordable cars that get good mileage while still giving good performance.

There's a difference in saying that the Volt doesn't meet your needs as saying that it's not as worthwhile of a car as a TDI, even at the same price point. Perhaps your daily commute is considerably longer than 20 miles. The majority of commuting Americans do live within 20 miles, and the Volt is potentially a much better fit for their lifestyle.

Your second point about reliability and early adoption is true. There is more inherent risk with any technology that is not fully matured. And for that reason, a TDI may be the better choice today. But it's not necessarily correct to assume that a VW will be inherently more reliable than a Chevy, at least according to JD Power. And to Chevy's credit, they have a 10-year/80,000 warranty on the batteries and electric motor system.

http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings...ings-by-brand/

[Yachtzee]

Originally Posted by paintmered

There's a difference in saying that the Volt doesn't meet your needs as saying that it's not as worthwhile of a car as a TDI, even at the same price point. Perhaps your daily commute is considerably longer than 20 miles. The majority of commuting Americans do live within 20 miles, and the Volt is potentially a much better fit for their lifestyle.

Your second point about reliability and early adoption is true. There is more inherent risk with any technology that is not fully matured. And for that reason, a TDI may be the better choice today. But it's not necessarily correct to assume that a VW will be inherently more reliable than a Chevy, at least according to JD Power. And to Chevy's credit, they have a 10-year/80,000 warranty on the batteries and electric motor system.

http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings...ings-by-brand/

I'm not saying the Volt isn't a worthwhile car. My main point is that the price Chevy's charging for a car geared toward commuters is way too steep when there are other car makers putting out less expensive options that get good gas mileage and are more useful.

After watching the Super Bowl ads, I checked out the info on the Sonic just because I hadn't heard much about it. It seems to be marketed toward younger buyers maybe just out of college. But when you compare it to other cars marketed toward that age group, there just seem to be more attractive options out there. After the government bailout, I would think GM would make more of an effort to draw in buyers of smaller passenger cars, but it still seems to be stuck in "sell more trucks and SUVs" mode.

It's a shame, because I grew up in a family that bought GM. My first car was a 1980 Pontiac Grand Prix and I loved it. I've owned Pontiacs, an Olds and Chevys. I went away from GM in the late '90s because of reliability issues but came back and bought a G6 with my wife in '05. Of course GM got rid of Pontiac and the G6. I want GM to sell me a car, but when I look at what they're putting out, I just don't get excited. And my GM buying family members all switched to Hondas years ago. Heck, I never would have bought a Ford, but looking at what's out there right now, Ford has some nice models.

[Slyder]

Originally Posted by JaxRed

Why would states pay for the upkeep of plugs? I don't even know what "upkeep for plugs" means....

The Leaf is pretty much a commuter car. The plug is in my garage. 1875 gas free miles now.

The same reason they pay for road maintenance and infrastructure. Things wear out and need replaced. For the Chevy Volt to truely become a viable option for many people the state will have to install some means for people to conveniently charge the vehicles while they are at work or whatever. Right now a large portion of the nation the Volt is not a feasible vehicle. Why?

It costs significantly more than other gas only options.
The mileage wouldn't cover my daily commute and thus still burning gas.
If you don't have a handy outlet then you are going to have to pay for something run into the garage.

Like I said in my previous post it maybe feasible for people who live in major metropolitan areas where everything is within a 10 mile radius but 50 miles range is NOT worth the extra 10-20k for me to spend when there is no other means to charge it besides when I get home.

Not to mention every time the car dealers come up with some new technology it makes it even more expensive on repairs because they know the dealers are the only ones who could repair the problems with a vehicle when it first comes out.

[jojo]

Originally Posted by MikeThierry

Is the future really electric? It seems like the technology is limiting. I don't think America will catch onto a plug and drive system. It's going to take something like hydrogen or a substance that hasn't been invented yet for the auto industry to take that next step, in my opinion.

Free cold fusion, baby....

[pedro]

Originally Posted by Slyder

The same reason they pay for road maintenance and infrastructure. Things wear out and need replaced. For the Chevy Volt to truely become a viable option for many people the state will have to install some means for people to conveniently charge the vehicles while they are at work or whatever. Right now a large portion of the nation the Volt is not a feasible vehicle. Why?

It costs significantly more than other gas only options.
The mileage wouldn't cover my daily commute and thus still burning gas.
If you don't have a handy outlet then you are going to have to pay for something run into the garage.

Like I said in my previous post it maybe feasible for people who live in major metropolitan areas where everything is within a 10 mile radius but 50 miles range is NOT worth the extra 10-20k for me to spend when there is no other means to charge it besides when I get home.

Not to mention every time the car dealers come up with some new technology it makes it even more expensive on repairs because they know the dealers are the only ones who could repair the problems with a vehicle when it first comes out.

Not sure why the State would be responsible for charging stations. Many grocery stores, parking garages, and hotels have them here in Oregon

[Spazzrico]

Originally Posted by jojo

Free cold fusion, baby....

Mr. Fusion, baby...

[Slyder]

Originally Posted by pedro

Not sure why the State would be responsible for charging stations. Many grocery stores, parking garages, and hotels have them here in Oregon

You won't get that kind of investment in a number of states because of the lack of need. The state/fed gov is going to have to get the ball moving on an issue such as battery chargers for cars like the Volt or they are NEVER going to take off for a number of reasons.

[RBA]

Originally Posted by pedro

Not sure why the State would be responsible for charging stations. Many grocery stores, parking garages, and hotels have them here in Oregon

Aren't they doing this with partnership with the government? I thought I read that most of the cost is provided by the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act.

[pedro]

Originally Posted by Slyder

You won't get that kind of investment in a number of states because of the lack of need. The state/fed gov is going to have to get the ball moving on an issue such as battery chargers for cars like the Volt or they are NEVER going to take off for a number of reasons.

I don't see that ever happening. Nor do I think it'll be necessary. It's more likely IMO that the auto manufacturers will co-op with private businesses to place charging stations.