Billy Hamilton: #1 on the BA Hot Sheet

[powersackers]

So according to BA Billy Hamilton is the No. 1 prospect in baseball? Ahead of Bryce Harper who isn't even in the top 10? They say it's a re-ranking of the top 100 based on current performance, but what does that mean?

[757690]

Originally Posted by dougdirt

Jenner probably would have been an above average runner.

But in this situation, what does Hamilton's ability to play other sports at a high level (which is almost directly tied to him being incredibly fast) do for him on the baseball field?

It means that he has the athletic ability to learn new skills.

To me being a great athlete says nothing about tools or skills. Tools and skills are acquired through hard work, intelligence and natural talent. Athleticism is based slowly on natural talent. It mostly has to do with coordination, quickness and strength, but it can't be divided like the five baseball tools, it's one "tool" in and of itself.

Having athleticism helps individuals succeed in most physical sports, since coordination is the main requirement for success in most sports. Throw in hard work and intelligence, and most great athletes will develop most of the tools or skills needed to succeed at most sports. Hamilton seems to be proving that true.

[dougdirt]

Originally Posted by powersackers

So according to BA Billy Hamilton is the No. 1 prospect in baseball? Ahead of Bryce Harper who isn't even in the top 10? They say it's a re-ranking of the top 100 based on current performance, but what does that mean?

No, not at all. The Hot Sheet is something that comes out every Friday afternoon that basically just looks at the hottest minor leaguers from the past week who are actually prospects (IE: No 28 year old AA guys who hit .600 with 5 home runs are going to make the list).

[dougdirt]

Originally Posted by 757690

It means that he has the athletic ability to learn new skills.

To me being a great athlete says nothing about tools or skills. Tools and skills are acquired through hard work, intelligence and natural talent. Athleticism is based slowly on natural talent. It mostly has to do with coordination, quickness and strength, but it can't be divided like the five baseball tools, it's one "tool" in and of itself.

Having athleticism helps individuals succeed in most physical sports, since coordination is the main requirement for success in most sports. Throw in hard work and intelligence, and most great athletes will develop most of the tools or skills needed to succeed at most sports. Hamilton seems to be proving that true.

Every single guy playing minor league baseball is a very good athlete though. Tools are something that are considered natural. Skills are the thing that are generally based upon the work put in with those tools.

I feel like I am ripping Hamilton here, but I really like the kid as a prospect, I just don't really see him as some super athlete simply because he is incredibly fast. His other 'athletic' things he does on the baseball field just don't really stack up as being stand out compared to the guys on the field with him.

[dfs]

Both Votto and Mesoraco, other high school players, developed a ton after they left Dayton. No reason to believe that Hamilton can't do the same thing.

I'm not convinced that Hamilton is going to stay in the infield at all, but if he turns into a centerfield version of Vince Coleman, then he is still a useful player. He may "add power" in the way that Davey Concepcion did, but he's never really going to be a power hitter.

[757690]

Originally Posted by dougdirt

Every single guy playing minor league baseball is a very good athlete though. Tools are something that are considered natural. Skills are the thing that are generally based upon the work put in with those tools.

I feel like I am ripping Hamilton here, but I really like the kid as a prospect, I just don't really see him as some super athlete simply because he is incredibly fast. His other 'athletic' things he does on the baseball field just don't really stack up as being stand out compared to the guys on the field with him.

All minor and major leaguers are very good athletes, some are great athletes, and some are very great or super athletes. And of the five tools, speed and arm are really the only ones that are mostly natural. Hitting for average and power and playing defense are clearly skills that players can improve with hard work, intelligence and dedication. Being able to hit has very little to do with athleticism. Just look at John Kruk, lol.

Hamilton is a super athlete not because he is fast, but because he has superior coordination, strength (for his size) and quickness as well.

[RedlegJake]

Originally Posted by MikeS21

You just don't want him turning into Deon Sanders, the guy who could fly, but just couldn't get on base.

This. I don't care much about his lack of power. Speed like Hamilton's is the only kind of speed that really pressures a ML defense. The "faster-than-average-Drew Stubbs" kind of speed doesn't and the players who truly take over games running are rare. Hamilton can be that kind of player IF he can learn to get on base, keep his KO rate down enough that he has more chances to leg out grounders, line a few balls in gaps so he can add extra bases and play decent enough defense not to be a liability. I just want him to improve pitch selectivity and patience, and get on base any way possible, and improve defensively.

[Kc61]

Originally Posted by RedlegJake

This. I don't care much about his lack of power. Speed like Hamilton's is the only kind of speed that really pressures a ML defense. The "faster-than-average-Drew Stubbs" kind of speed doesn't and the players who truly take over games running are rare. Hamilton can be that kind of player IF he can learn to get on base, keep his KO rate down enough that he has more chances to leg out grounders, line a few balls in gaps so he can add extra bases and play decent enough defense not to be a liability. I just want him to improve pitch selectivity and patience, and get on base any way possible, and improve defensively.

I agree. Hamilton can become a lethal weapon for the Reds even if his overall game is just average. His kind of speed is a rare gift and can have great impact on a baseball game.

With Mes in the majors, Hamilton is IMO clearly the Reds best prospect right now and I wouldn't trade him except for some unbelievable return.

[Blitz Dorsey]

Originally Posted by dougdirt

Hamilton has super athlete speed. I am not sure anything else he does on the baseball field puts him in super athlete status. Josh Hamilton is a super athlete. Drew Stubbs is a super athlete. Billy Hamilton is super fast. Big difference.

No, Usain Bolt is both "super fast" and a "super athlete." Nice try though.

[dougdirt]

Originally Posted by Blitz Dorsey

No, Usain Bolt is both "super fast" and a "super athlete." Nice try though.

I haven't seen enough of Usain Bolt doing anything besides running to know if that is true or not. Neither have you I would bet. Nice try though.

[Scrap Irony]

Just for clarification, Billy Hamilton averaged 27 ppg as a high school senior and was one of Mississippi's Dany Dozen (top 12 players in the state) the same season Isiah Cannon verballed to Murray State. As a point guard, he drew comparisons to Allen Iverson, if you can believe it.

In football, he was signed by Mississippi State and a member of the state's first-team All-State selection. He ran a 4.4 40-yard dash and finished second in the state in 2A with 49 receptions for 742 yards, a 15.1-yard average. He also led all 2A receivers with 18 touchdown catches as a senior receiver on offense. On defense, he had 68 tackles and was second among all Class 2A defensive backs with seven interceptions.

He's not only athletic, he's among the best athletes in the nation.

[PTjvs]

Doug, I think you are a great poster here, and I understand exactly what you are trying to say, but your definition of "athlete" does not match what the general populous would call an athlete. The very BA article you linked/quoted mentions Hamilton's "off-the-charts athleticism".

That said, the folks in this thread projecting anything more than 12 HR for Hamilton in a ML year (half inside the park probably ) are crazy. Odds are decent that Hamilton never ever becomes a MLB everyday player. A tool that far off the charts is just so hard to project.

jvs

[powersackers]

Originally Posted by Scrap Irony

Just for clarification, Billy Hamilton averaged 27 ppg as a high school senior and was one of Mississippi's Dany Dozen (top 12 players in the state) the same season Isiah Cannon verballed to Murray State. As a point guard, he drew comparisons to Allen Iverson, if you can believe it.

In football, he was signed by Mississippi State and a member of the state's first-team All-State selection. He ran a 4.4 40-yard dash and finished second in the state in 2A with 49 receptions for 742 yards, a 15.1-yard average. He also led all 2A receivers with 18 touchdown catches as a senior receiver on offense. On defense, he had 68 tackles and was second among all Class 2A defensive backs with seven interceptions.

He's not only athletic, he's among the best athletes in the nation.

Wow.

[Blitz Dorsey]

Originally Posted by dougdirt

I haven't seen enough of Usain Bolt doing anything besides running to know if that is true or not. Neither have you I would bet. Nice try though.

Imitation is the highest form of flattery. Thank you. (And I'll even resist the urge to say "Get your own material." Whoops.)

[dougdirt]

Originally Posted by Scrap Irony

Just for clarification, Billy Hamilton averaged 27 ppg as a high school senior and was one of Mississippi's Dany Dozen (top 12 players in the state) the same season Isiah Cannon verballed to Murray State. As a point guard, he drew comparisons to Allen Iverson, if you can believe it.

In football, he was signed by Mississippi State and a member of the state's first-team All-State selection. He ran a 4.4 40-yard dash and finished second in the state in 2A with 49 receptions for 742 yards, a 15.1-yard average. He also led all 2A receivers with 18 touchdown catches as a senior receiver on offense. On defense, he had 68 tackles and was second among all Class 2A defensive backs with seven interceptions.

He's not only athletic, he's among the best athletes in the nation.

Dan Patrick was an all-state high school basketball player. Doesn't mean he was a great athlete.

Billy Hamilton's speed is what made him good in track. It is what made him good in football. It is part of what makes him good in baseball. Take away Hamilton's insane speed and make him just a fast runner (let's say he is just as fast as Didi Gregorius, who is an above-average runner), does anyone really think he is some elite athlete? Don't get me wrong, he is a very good athlete, but as an athlete from top to bottom, he doesn't stand out among the field aside from his pure speed. He doesn't have a good arm, he has an average arm. He doesn't have outstanding bat speed, he has solid bat speed. He doesn't have good hands, he has average hands. He doesn't have average strength, he has below average strength. I just don't see it guys, not to the point where he is some super athlete among other top end of the spectrum athletes.